Soldato
Boot lickers crave boots to lick
Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar
- Thread starter areksnumbr1sxylady
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Soldato
Russia has never been Communist ; however thats for a different thread
Soldato
Oh, might be soon see Steven Seagal on the frontlines????
Soldato
I don't know anyone who openly supports Russia. But there's plenty that seem to follow every bit of nonsense conspiracy they read about on social media whom I'm sure are convinced it's all a hoax and that our tax dollas are being wasted (not that they appear to have ever contributed to the pot).
Considering the exchange rate of the Ruble Mercedes would be buying cars back at around half price.
Soldato
Doubtful, Russian logistics are already over stretched as it is.
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Well, they waved the flag and pretended, that's what they all do really.
Soldato
Isn't that what all Communist countries do though, pretend to be communist? Corruption/greed will always be the downfall of communism. It's a'nice idea' that in practice always totally fails, because people are people and always want more.
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Soldato
Can same the same for the West - only 1 true communist `state` has existed, it was in Northern Greece at the end of WW2 , and Churchill bombed them into oblivion.
Associate
Ah so we're going full out for cluster weapon use now? Nice.
Going to be hilarious with both sides removing red lines as quickly as possible. Next conflicts are just going to be complete free for all. Wouldn't be surprised armament companies haven't already opened up new R&D divisions knowing that basically anything will end up being fine.
Uhh this **** again
Soldato
because the last 18 months has been a love in? Russia invased Ukraine, this is a war.
Soldato
Russia have been using cluster munitions and vacuum bombs since the start. Just because Ukraine started returning the favour doesn't mean what you think it means.
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Associate
Really? You will say the same **** for all methods employed?
War or conflict? What difference does it make? It's people killing people.
Russia are morally bankrupt a$$holes that we shouldn't try and emulate. Just because bad people do things doesn't mean we should follow suit.
I'm still personally struggling to say the use of cluster munitions is fine tbh, because we (as a country) have signed the treaty banning their use.
The arguments of :
Its a war
Ukraine is fighting for it's existence
They are very effective in this scenario
Don't really wash with me, as we knew all those things about cluster munitions and when they get used and we still signed the treaty, so the cons must outweigh the pro's.
The only thing I can vaguely rationalise it with is it's Ukraine asking to use them on it's own soil, so that's their choice. Yes, it probably sentences a number of future civilians to death or injury, but that's no different to what Russia is doing to their citizens intentionally now.
The arguments of :
Its a war
Ukraine is fighting for it's existence
They are very effective in this scenario
Don't really wash with me, as we knew all those things about cluster munitions and when they get used and we still signed the treaty, so the cons must outweigh the pro's.
The only thing I can vaguely rationalise it with is it's Ukraine asking to use them on it's own soil, so that's their choice. Yes, it probably sentences a number of future civilians to death or injury, but that's no different to what Russia is doing to their citizens intentionally now.
If it fails totally on its own, all effort and resources put into cold war were completely unnecessary waste
There is no need to blockade or sanction Cuba and North Korea.
And definitely no need to keep up the anticommunist propaganda and lies 30 years after fall of USSR.
Communism is an existential threat to capitalists (who btw don't even know the meaning of words greed and corruption). Thats why they won't let off
I would add a couple of more reasons to your list.
1) Russia is using them anyway, so the main reason against them is some don't explode, are left on the ground and might get picked up by a civilian years later. Since Russia is using them anyway, that's going to be the case in Ukraine regardless of whether Ukraine themselves use them. Add to that that Ukraine are using western ones with a very low failure rate (so not many left unexploded) whereas the Russian ones are junk so leave up to a third of the bomblets on the ground unexploded.
2) Ukraine, unlike Russia, is only using them out in the open and not in towns and cities, which lessens the impact of unexploded bomblets.
When you weigh it all up, it seems like a pretty easy decision to me. Yes, some civilians will likely be killed or injured by Ukraine's western supplied cluster munitions. But, they help Ukraine to win the war, and whilst the war goes on, Russia, through a combination of not giving a **** or in some cases intentionally, is killing thousands of civilians.
Bear in mind also, that we signed the treaty safe in the knowledge that we're unlikely to ever have to fight a conventional war for our very existence, so you can't then just say the moral arguments that compelled us to sign it automatically should apply to our opinion of Ukraine using them.
Soldato
Yes its killing people, and Russia invaded Ukraine using every tool it has - Thermobarics and Cluster rounds in use since day 1.
Russia themselves said the TOS-1A was used day 1.
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I’m sure if you were in the trenches fighting for your life and lives of your family in your own country you’d want to use anything at your disposal.
Associate
So the plucky fighters should use chemical and biological if they want? Nuclear if they could get hands on it?
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