Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Bug One said:
France => Israel
China => Pakistan
Russia => Belarus
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France did provide Israel with knowledge in the construction of nuclear power plants that were essential to their later development of the bomb, but by the time that Israel actually developed weapons (likely 1966) French-Israeli co-operation on nuclear power had ended.

No idea where you get the idea that Pakistan got is nuclear capability from China from. It's not true. It did get some nuclear power expertise from the UK though.

Russia has stationed Russia-controlled nukes in Belarus (just as the US stations nukes in 3rd countries), not given the weapons to Belarus.
 
bingham67 said:

What do people think more Russian propoganda or have they actually been taken out, I see some photos floating around of what looks like ATACMS that the Russians were parading.
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Yes they probably did shoot some down.
Its a ballistic missile not a super weapon or stealth weapon.

the overall amount of Air defence on the russian side is most likely why they were delayed in being gifted.

Anyone wanna bet that ukraine was told to produce sizeable results in Anti air assets destruction before they were gifted them.
 
Mr Jack said:
France did provide Israel with knowledge in the construction of nuclear power plants that were essential to their later development of the bomb, but by the time that Israel actually developed weapons (likely 1966) French-Israeli co-operation on nuclear power had ended.

No idea where you get the idea that Pakistan got is nuclear capability from China from. It's not true. It did get some nuclear power expertise from the UK though.

Russia has stationed Russia-controlled nukes in Belarus (just as the US stations nukes in 3rd countries), not given the weapons to Belarus.
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  • The French gave the Israelis what they needed to make a nuke, even if the original intent was commercial.
  • China gave Pakistan everything they needed to make nuclear weapons, and gave them the missiles needed to deliver them.
  • Lukashenko certainly seems to think he's got control over the nuclear weapons provided to them by Russia, and his air force are being updated / trained to deliver them.
Russia has been openly boasting / threatening to sending nuclear weapons to allies.
 
Bill Turnip said:
Didn't Ukraine give up their nukes to Russia?
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Yeah, Belarus and Ukraine gave up nukes after they became independent, what I meant was giving the ability to make nukes to another country.

Although, actually I was wrong about that. As @Bug One says, China did help Pakistan build a bomb (as did the US for that matter).
 
alchal said:
Slovakia has joined club vatnik.
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Commentators are writing it off as "they can't really do any damage" but I disagree, this has been Russia's goal, more passively than actively, for a long time to nibble away at those parts of Europe - if they'd rolled over Ukraine the dominoes would have fallen a lot quicker I think that people realise. While it doesn't have quite the same effect in the days of the internet and aircraft in the longer term it allows them to isolate countries like Romania and facilitate moving on the Baltics directly or indirectly.

EDIT: Slovakia has also been a useful additional jump off point for support going into Ukraine.
 
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I don’t know much about the mechanics of the US system. The new speaker dosen’t seem very keen on more support for Ukraine.

www.bbc.co.uk

Conservative Mike Johnson elected new House Speaker - BBC News

Louisiana's Mike Johnson won with 220 votes in his favour in the lower chamber of Congress.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

The numbers in the house still seem overwhelming in support, but I can see the minority using any opportunity to drive a wedge.
 
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Expanding slightly on the above. I find it very simplistic for anyone to say that support for Ukraine should be withdrawn. That obviously creates a very fluid situation with a wide range of possible outcomes.

Is withdrawal of support (in their opinion) conditional on getting an enforceable peace deal. What are the terms of that peace deal, and what are the consequences if the terms are broken. Will they force them into signing any deal by announcing there is a hard deadline on support ending. Do they even care, or are they cutting them loose and throwing them under the bus.

How will the rest of NATO respond to that?

Also, have the lasting consequences of giving up on Ukraine been fully factored in. I mean.. the Russians have continued this war on the basis that our resolve will expire. Cashing out now confirms their strategy works.

I wouldn’t feel at all comfortable being a vulnerable US ally in this situation.
 
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Mr Jack said:
Yeah, Belarus and Ukraine gave up nukes after they became independent, what I meant was giving the ability to make nukes to another country.
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Technically speaking Ukraine did give Russia the ability to make nukes, it's just they were both members of the USSR at the time so it was classed as one big country.

This is also the reason Russia's current stockpile is in such a state, because Ukraine stopped maintaining them for them after 2014 and Russia don't even know how Ukraine built some of them.
 
The current Hungarian and Slovakian positions are disappointing, but also pretty transient and of little consequence to the War. By 2026 the Ukrainians will have some serious military capacity and need less support. By the early 2030’s Ukraine will be looking like Poland and ready to enter the EU. The pro Russian nations will then find themselves between a rock and hard place if they allow themselves to become corrupted by Putin.
 
ubersonic said:
Technically speaking Ukraine did give Russia the ability to make nukes, it's just they were both members of the USSR at the time so it was classed as one big country.

This is also the reason Russia's current stockpile is in such a state, because Ukraine stopped maintaining them for them after 2014 and Russia don't even know how Ukraine built some of them.
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Their latest RS-24 readiness tests (I believe using the mobile platform) seem to have been a failure, though they aren't showing it as that, and bare in mind that according to OSINT sources their mobile stuff is in a much better operational state than the silo/static based systems...
 
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