Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

[Rroff]

The sea is big though and even a few miles for something seemingly so unsophisticated is a big deal for target aquisition. The camera is barely above the waves the horizon must be very short so even a few miles away from where you think it is might be enough to make interception difficult. Like I say I'm amazed that the Russian ship appeared to either stationary or nearly so given the proven risk.

They probably used a variety of sources of information to find the likely location, a ship that big does give a fair signature on thermal/IR optics as well even under those conditions. IIRC with some previous incidents they used airborne drones to narrow down where the ship was.

 

[jigger]

Without these boats (ships?) the bridge becomes an even juicer target

Definitely, if Ukraine can get the kit able to deliver enough bang bang close enough.

F117 with 4000-5000lbs of good old fashioned American freedom onboard.

 

[FishThrower]

Give them long range weapons, aircraft, more tanks.

and the West should be prepared to escalate this to WW3 - if that's what it takes to defend western values and democracy.

might as well give them nuclear weapons as well while we are at it..... the Ukrainians dont have the skillset or the launchers to launch long range missiles as far as i aware. also using western weapons on russian territory should be avoided (someone earlier in the thread gave a reason for this)

People on this thread are just itching for escalation and gagging for Poland to get involved. I personally want Russia to be destroyed , but people fail to realise that giving military away to other countries also harms the defence of ours. Logistics in war isnt like command and conquer or starcraft on the PC.

 

[jigger]

might as well give them nuclear weapons as well while we are at it..... the Ukrainians dont have the skillset or the launchers to launch long range missiles as far as i aware. also using western weapons on russian territory should be avoided (someone earlier in the thread gave a reason for this)

People on this thread are just itching for escalation and gagging for Poland to get involved. I personally want Russia to be destroyed , but people fail to realise that giving military away to other countries also harms the defence of ours. Logistics in war isnt like command and conquer or starcraft on the PC.

HIMARS + ATACMS

People are itching for this silly war and Russian expansion to be over.

 

[Rroff]

Without these boats (ships?) the bridge becomes an even juicer target

I don't think actually destroying the bridge is a priority for Ukraine, Russian AD doesn't seem capable of stopping a serious attack on it, they've had a few chances they could have taken it out - looks like they are taking a more strategic approach to the bridge attempting to use it to shape Russia's actions and/or saving it up for something more symbolic.

Possibly amongst other considerations leaving it there for Russia to use to retreat.

 

[esmozz]

Give them long range weapons, aircraft, more tanks.

and the West should be prepared to escalate this to WW3 - if that's what it takes to defend western values and democracy.

Sort of like 'we had to destroy the village to save it...' - from a previous war.

 

[Mr Badger]

Sort of like 'we had to destroy the village to save it...' - from a previous war.

The Russians have fully embraced that doctrine when using their artillery to "liberate" Ukrainian towns. Ukraine do seem rather more targeted in the things that they blow up.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

I don't think actually destroying the bridge is a priority for Ukraine, Russian AD doesn't seem capable of stopping a serious attack on it, they've had a few chances they could have taken it out - looks like they are taking a more strategic approach to the bridge attempting to use it to shape Russia's actions and/or saving it up for something more symbolic.

Possibly amongst other considerations leaving it there for Russia to use to retreat.

Yeah i think they will wait for the opportune moment, assuming it comes
However that doesn't change that fact, the bridge becomes ever more important to Russia (and hence ever juicier a target) the less able Russia are able to utilise sea to move equipment/troops/ammo

IMO the point of going hard for the bridge will be when/if Ukraine manage to get a serious push down towards the sea of Azov. Effectively cutting off crimea from non naval resupply.
Right now they can still pretty safely resupply via road, even though its a long way either way round.

 

[jigger]

Sort of like 'we had to destroy the village to save it...' - from a previous war.

At some point we have to draw a line in the sand and say no further. How close the opposition are prepared to move to our line determines how far back we must push and redraw ours. Apparently Putin’s line seems somewhere in Berlin, so ours should be just west of Moscow.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

yes i mentioned this before and was routinely disagreed with...

But your in Switzerland, its hardly a secret that its where all the ill-gotten wealth is stored (although London is trying hard to challenge now) so its a natural place to flee to

My main point was really in regards usage of the term asylum. Its kind of a specific thing, and I don't believe the majority in the UK even want it.
The vast majority I believe are on a special temporary (visa in effect) scheme. Which is completely different.

Are the Ukrainians in Switzerland applying for permanent right to reside which is generally what an asylum claim involves, or just hiding because they are high net worth individuals who can afford to sit there doing nothing?

As I said I don't believe the UK would have any issue sending back a Ukrainian who had been legally drafted and was dodging by being abroad.
Maybe there has been a sudden outbreak of Trump bone spurs.

 

[esmozz]

At some point we have to draw a line in the sand and say no further. How close the opposition are prepared to move to our line determines how far back we must push and redraw ours. Apparently Putin’s line seems somewhere in Berlin, so ours should be just west of Moscow.

At the borders of NATO, that's what it's for.

Just to clarify - that's the point at which NATO troops, air forces etc should directly engage Russian forces.

 

[Rroff]

My point I made earlier and a year ago and longer.....if the powers that be knows a compromise is the end result then both sides are completely and utterly morally bankrupt at all the people that now and will cease to exist.

If they fell victory was possible then thsts fair enough....but I haven't heard of many paths to this.

Problem is until it gets to the point both sides have to compromise it isn't going to happen, anything else is fantasy unfortunately. And there is nothing to say currently it will end with any given compromise, Putin certainly isn't intending to compromise ultimately even if he has to settle strategically for a compromise in the intermediate term.

There is no real future here for Ukraine if they can't achieve victory - there isn't going to be any happily ever after if Russia assumes direct control, at best they'll be hollowed out for Putin's benefit, at worst subjected to repression with likely 1000s or even 100s of thousands killed as has happened in the past with Russian/USSR occupations.

 

[Roar87]

Without these boats (ships?) the bridge becomes an even juicer target

The bridge is built in segments, it won't just fall down, if you knock one segment out it's pretty easy to repair. Also everytime Ukraine has attacked the bridge a few days later Russia does a massive attack on their infrastructure in response.

 

[Tefal]

might as well give them nuclear weapons as well while we are at it.....

Tbf they had them, they gave them to us and we gave them to russia.

Because it was agreed russia would be appeased and not attack urkraine if ukraine didn't have nukes....

 

[jigger]

At the borders of NATO, that's what it's for.

Just to clarify - that's the point at which NATO troops, air forces etc should directly engage Russian forces.

It’s really not. NATO is to ensure peace and prosperity globally and deter nations from perusing programs of weapons of mass destruction.

 

[Mr Badger]

It’s really not. NATO is to ensure peace and prosperity globally and deter nations from perusing programs of weapons of mass destruction.

Do they peruse these programs online or do they come in the post?

 

[jigger]

The bridge is built in segments, it won't just fall down, if you knock one segment out it's pretty easy to repair. Also everytime Ukraine has attacked the bridge a few days later Russia does a massive attack on their infrastructure in response.

The bridge is already failing. Go easy on the cement comrades, my wife needs a new Lamborghini and her diamond soled shoes are nearly worn out.

 

[Orangeade]

Watched the Putin interview fully on the plane.

Very interesting, clearly was aiming at multiple demographics with some of his replies especially domestically.

His references to the Russian soul and Dostoevsky was extremely interesting and weirdly enough even though lots of what he was saying was obviously ******** it was quite clear that he did believe the two sides would be reconciled.

I think the two takeaways were his allegations of CIA meddling in the US presidents decisions and the scuppering of a peace deal 15 months ago. (He made reference to signed papers etc). These should be possible to investigate more thoroughly and if can be proven to be fake could work strongly to dissuade a lot of people who believe in him. If there's even 1% truth it alludes to a problem far bigger than Ukraine.

Overall I can imagine both Putin and Carlson being unhappy with it as it wasn't focused and didn't really deliver the zangs they thought it would. It was interesting to watch through.

 

[jigger]

Do they peruse these programs online or do they come in the post?

I believe Belarus is the place to go for a good deal on nuclear weapons. Comes flat packed with a BOGOF deal as half don’t work.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

The bridge is built in segments, it won't just fall down, if you knock one segment out it's pretty easy to repair. Also everytime Ukraine has attacked the bridge a few days later Russia does a massive attack on their infrastructure in response.

Initial reports following the blast said that repair works would not be completed until July 2023. This week Russia deputy prime minister Marat Khusnullin has said: “Despite the terrorist attack, traffic was restored over the bridge in 57 days. Under normal conditions, it would take about a year to do such work.

I know you don't like facts.

Lets have a little quiz...
So hit it every month and it would be functioning how often?