UNPOPULAR OPINION: German Marques are no longer prestige..

sx_turbo said:
I'm all honesty I love a lexus, if they brought the 350hp 3.5 V6 to the is and GS range, or had a decent small capacity turbo engine, with decent gearbox not the CVT I would definitely get one.

I'd even take just the engine with he CVT as a compromise.

But instead they just shove the 2.5v6 that's been out for 20years, that's pretty gutless and not very economical. There's no decent diesel comparable diesel.

I don't think it's a case of they can't, they just have their sights set elsewhere and Toyota are happy doing the numbers their doing.

I'm almost every review of a lexus they complain about the gearbox and lack of umph, but Toyota do not listen, they do them, which is good on them I suppose

Note: I know lexus does have models with more powerful engines, but there are only a couple, and not in the traditional segment (the bmw 1/2, 3 & 5 series segments)
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There is a GS 3.5 - the GS 450h, well, there was but I think they've canned the GS model.
 
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Greebo said:
I must admi it does help with the likes of BMW making their cars look uglier and uglier every year. There is good reason the XM was available recently at half price - £80k and even then they struggled to shift them.
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Very true.
Making our choices easy - for the wrong reasons.

The iX is a disaster. Should be taken off the road for visual pollution. (My opinion only :))
 
dlockers said:
It is ugly as sin but crazy functional
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I'm sure it is for £160k+ :p

Then it will lose a flat's worth in depreciation over the next 5 years.

If you want functional, buy a used estate car and a phone holder for a fraction of the price. What more is this monstrosity going to do, except spawn massive bills.
 
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Nasher said:
I'm sure it is for £160k+ :p

Then it will lose a flat's worth in depreciation over the next 5 years.

If you want functional, buy a used estate car and a phone holder for a fraction of the price. What more is this monstrosity going to do, except spawn massive bills.
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£160k? What?

sparton_SPA said:
What's better about it compared to an ix3?
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IX3 is just an electric retrofit in a petrol isn't it? IX is like a living room on wheels from the brief time I had sitting in one. Felt super large.
 
Just catching up with this and no I haven't read the previous 5 pages. I have a 2015 BMW 4 series, had it for nearly 3 years now and it's been great. Faultless, although a lot more expensive to keep running well than any car I've had previously. Is it 'Prestige' though? Well, given my car history (Escort, Almera, Rover 214i, Peugeot 306 (GTI-6!), Mk.1 Seat Leon (Cupra 180) and a Mk.3 Focus Ecoboost 182) it certainly feels it to me. The interior is a marked step up, even from my 2012 Focus. It has Cruise, electric, heated seats, DAB radio, music streaming via Bluetooth, electric windows all round with auto up/down and a frankly amazing automatic gearbox. It's better than any car I've ever had. To me, it's certainly Prestige.

Now, having said that, BMW keep trying to make the 1 series prestige by making it look like a 3 series inside. Unfortunately what they've succeeded in doing is making a 3 series like a 1 series inside, rather than making the 1 be 'just as good' as the 3. Instead of bringing the 1 up they've dragged the 3 down. At least that's how it felt when I looked at 3 and 1 series when buying.
 
JonRGV250 said:
Mercedes started going downhill after the W210 (E class).
These things were pure junk, and any time me or any of the other salesmen would hand one over to the customer we'd have bets on how long it'd be before it was back in the workshop with the dash lit up like a christmas tree.
The current A class at the time was almost as terrible.
Fast forward to modern times and them lobbing Renault engines into the lower range tier of their cars, coupled with all kinds of faults we used to find on PDI and the amount of remedial work that needed doing, doesn't really inspire confidence in the brand.
I'd love to know how many customers bought an A, B, C class etc without knowing what was under the bonnet.
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Probably around the late 90's, maybe into the early 2000's Mercedes started being run by accountants, not Engineers. Corners were cut and material quality were all reduced as the accountants, now in charge, decided that they weren't making enough profit per car sold and cut backs were required. Just about any Mercedes from that era, unless meticulously looked after, will be absolutely riddled with rust. All because all the things that made the previous models, like the 300,000Km E class Tehran taxi, bullet-proof were deemed too expensive and were cut back on such as galvanizing the chassis and making sure the wiring loom wouldn't fall apart within 5 years.
 
Have German cars ever been prestigious brands outside of the UK? Base models can be pretty poorly equipped and overpriced. People used buy them for reliability.
 
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jigger said:
Have German cars ever been prestigious brands outside of the UK? Base models can be pretty poorly equipped and over priced.
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They certainly used to be. Out of reach of your average person as they were quite a bit more expensive compared to Cavaliers, Cortina's/Sierra's/Mondeo's which usually had more standard features. As these companies started moving their own vehicles more upmarket their price got closer to BMW and Mercedes then it became 'only another £2k for a 316i with no options, but it's a BMW!'
 
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MissChief said:
Now, having said that, BMW keep trying to make the 1 series prestige by making it look like a 3 series inside. Unfortunately what they've succeeded in doing is making a 3 series like a 1 series inside, rather than making the 1 be 'just as good' as the 3. Instead of bringing the 1 up they've dragged the 3 down. At least that's how it felt when I looked at 3 and 1 series when buying
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This was only the case with the previous 3 series and 1 series. The 3/4 series of that generation had an interior that was very close to that of the 1 series.

This has been since been fixed and I think the 2019 onwards 3 aeries has the best interior of any 3 series they've produced.
 
[TW]Fox said:
This was only the case with the previous 3 series and 1 series. The 3/4 series of that generation had an interior that was very close to that of the 1 series.

This has been since been fixed and I think the 2019 onwards 3 aeries has the best interior of any 3 series they've produced.
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It's true I can only talk about the cars I looked at when buying which were F models. You've praised the G 3 many times, I may need to have a look.
 
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