Volkswagen cheats emissions tests!

[MagicBoy]

But you'll only be able to drive them in the countryside

That's fine. It's quicker and cheaper (factoring in the price of parking) to get the train into the City Centre anyway. Plus they're saving the environment by not creating 450Kg of CO2 manufacturing a new Hybrid car, which will take hundreds of thousands of miles to offset with tailpipe emissions...

 

[Type_R]

According to this the High Court has appointed Salter & Gordon as lead lawyers to take this on so not sure how you can go to any other company??

http://www.vwemissionsaction.com/


I'm thinking of claiming myself as resale value of the vehicle I had at the time was affected due to all the bad press - but not sure if that's a viable request.....

There does appear to be many companies willing to take on the claim. However, you are quite right..I have signed up with Slator & Gordon

 

[GinG]

Being missold a car that was supposed to emit X but emitted Y.

However they've also lied about the fix. They've said it doesn't affect mpg, reliability or power but owners are experiencing all of these things since the fix. There's plenty of evidence that VAG have lied, from dynos, fleet manager testimonials etc. I bet if VAG have spent millions on TBM and 'goodwill gestures' fixing peoples cars. They should also offer owners a pre-fix rollback too, if owners aren't happy with the fix. They say that they can't do this, yet tuning specialists can.

I may be wrong in saying this but we have not been missold as in the UK the emissions which they had cheated in is more for the US market?

Again could be wrong, however as a Suoerb owner with an effected engine I am neither looking to get the engine rectified or going to look at claiming.

 

[booyaka]

Does this need you to own the car still? I PCP'd a vRS for 3 years, now no longer have it. Was between 2013 - 2016

 

[theone8181]

Does this need you to own the car still? I PCP'd a vRS for 3 years, now no longer have it. Was between 2013 - 2016

What would you be claiming for if you don't own the car anymore? Surely you should refund them for the extra performance/economy you had.

 

[Type_R]

Does this need you to own the car still? I PCP'd a vRS for 3 years, now no longer have it. Was between 2013 - 2016

No you can still claim against VW if you have proof you had an affected car (owned or PCP)!

GinG - you could get anything from £5k to the entire value of the car back. And yes they did missell you...they didn't tell you that the NOX levels were up to 240 times greater than on the spec sheet when you were driving it!

 

[Kenai]

Amazing how many people have become really conscious of their NOX emission levels all of a sudden. I bet most people wouldn't have even been able to tell you what NOX was when they were buying/renting these cars.

Lucky that a small cash payment will fix everything for those 'afflicted' too.

I wonder how many people claiming will use any of that money for trying to reverse the damage they're now apparently so concerned they were misled into doing or how many big TVs and new cars arrive instead.

 

[muon]

No you can still claim against VW if you have proof you had an affected car (owned or PCP)!

GinG - you could get anything from £5k to the entire value of the car back. And yes they did missell you...they didn't tell you that the NOX levels were up to 240 times greater than on the spec sheet when you were driving it!

Nothing has been decided yet. Hence the class action that needs to be settled, so don't mislead people yourself. They might just sue you.

That amount sounds very similar to the offer made to owners in the US which I believe was negotiated by the DoJ themselves, partly as a punitive measure.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35227435

Doubt you will get anything like that in the UK when the court has to assess exactly what damages were caused to you (if any) through a private suit.

 

[Nasher]

Either way it was miss-sold, which is obviously illegal. You don't need to wait for a class action for that.

 

[muon]

Either way it was miss-sold, which is obviously illegal. You don't need to wait for a class action for that.

Might be, but that doesn't mean much compensation.

 

[Entai]

Either way it was miss-sold, which is obviously illegal. You don't need to wait for a class action for that.

Problem is that everyone "knows" the figures quoted by manufacturers should be taken with a pinch of salt, that has been common knowledge for many years.

The figures quoted by manufacturers, are correct as per the laboratory testing that the vehicles had to undergo, every car had passed the legal regulatory testing needed for VW to legally sell those cars in the UK.

Just because the emissions were later proved to be higher figures when used outside of laboratory conditions, pretty much means nothing in the legal world, as at that point in time, there was no legal necessity for manufacturers to test their vehicles outside of lab conditions.

The cars were sold quoting the figures gained during lab testing, that is all they had to do legally, virtually all manufacturers will have some kind of small print to say something along the lines of -

"The quoted fuel consumption figures, and exhaust emissions figures do not express or imply any guarantee of achievable fuel consumption or exhaust emission of any particular vehicle."

Which is all they need under UK law to get out of any compensation claims.

 

[Entai]

No you can still claim against VW if you have proof you had an affected car (owned or PCP)!

GinG - you could get anything from £5k to the entire value of the car back. And yes they did missell you...they didn't tell you that the NOX levels were up to 240 times greater than on the spec sheet when you were driving it!

And when does any manufacturer explicitly tell you that unless you drive like miss daisy's grandmother, you will never get the fuel consumption figures quoted ?

They don't, so where are all the class claims against manufacturers for that aspect of being miss sold your car ?


Thing is it is actually possible to meet every one of VW's quoted figures when driving on the road, I know because I have done it, and driven many different VW models, pre and post software upgrades and hardware upgrades and every car has been able to meet quoted figures when driven in a certain way.

Granted not many people, will drive like that, or anyone to be fair, unless they have to like we do when testing.

However that is by the by, the figures can be met, so again technically, they never miss sold any vehicle.

 

[bloodiedathame]

They put cheat devices in cars to falsify test results. It's fraudulent behaviour.

 

[Kenai]

However that is by the by, the figures can be met, so again technically, they never miss sold any vehicle.

Surely the point was that they can't be met in tests, that's why they had to recall and install new software on them? If it was just the standard 'real life isn't like the tests' they wouldn't have had to take such action?

 

[Type_R]

This.

@Entai you need to get with the programme...maybe read about how they cheated using cheat devices to knowingly ‘cheat’ the system before you start lecturing us about your thoughts.

 

[Semple]

I think when I looked to sign up, I bought just after the cut off date. I'm not too fussed, I didn't fall for their "mandatory fix", and I've put on ~55k miles in 2+ years, so certainly had wear and tear out of it.

I'm not convinced that UK owners will get much out of the class action anyway. I think S&G are taking a 30% cut of any payout. Also I read they're only insured upto so many million in legal fees, so if VAG drags it out in court and exceeds the insured amount and wins, then each claimant will get lumped with a share of the bill.

I think the class action needed to be much clearer with how much they're trying to seek in damages and how much this would give each claimant after legal fees etc.

 

[bloodiedathame]

Some light viewing...

https://media.ccc.de/v/32c3-7331-the_exhaust_emissions_scandal_dieselgate

https://media.ccc.de/v/33c3-7904-software_defined_emissions

https://media.ccc.de/v/33c3-8131-dieselgate_a_year_later

 

[Semple]

snip

If people were being completely honest, no-one is attempting to sue VAG for miss-selling a car based on NOX values.

Most people have joined the class action because of two reasons:
- they've suffered problems from the "fix" (numerous repairs, paying out of your own pocket, TBM warranty is approaching the end and problems still occur, loss of earnings as a result of an unreliable car) and want some compensation.
- the VAG car they had devalued significantly (I read some people with PCP deals were left thousands out of pocket)

Frankly no-one honestly gives two hoots as to whether the car is spewing out more NOX than what was claimed by the manufacturer. I could 99% guarantee that anyone buying their car at the time would have still gone through with the purchase if they were told about the increase in NOX.

The problem is that no one can file a claim against VAG for either of the above 2 reasons, so they have to go for something that could potentially stick.

 

[Entai]

This.

@Entai you need to get with the programme...maybe read about how they cheated using cheat devices to knowingly ‘cheat’ the system before you start lecturing us about your thoughts.

I am with the program thanks, in fact I spend every single day well within the program,. as that is all we do at work, test emissions , both in the lab and on the road, and compare them.

We have tested vehicles from all manufacturers, (into many thousands now, both brand new and second hand, both low milers and ones into hundreds of thousands of miles) and all of them cheat in some way or other.

However I can guarantee you there is not a VW out there, nor any other car from any other manufacturer, that does not fully meet its printed figures, without using any cheat devices, (software or hardware) when driven in the correct way under the correct circumstances.

Also drive the vehicles properly and maintain them properly and we have seen zero failures on any mechanical item within the power train, on any vehicle we have tested.

Oh and no we do not work for VW,nor are we owned by any manufacturer, we are completely independent and are doing this testing for a completely independent body.


Finally you also have to remember that EVERY SINGLE manufacturer cheats on their emissions, under certain conditions, they ALL have software and hardware systems that change the emissions dependent upon temperature ranges and other driving factors.

Why is it only VW have been picked on ?

 

[bloodiedathame]

VW were picked on because they knowingly used a piece of code that they were told was illegal by Bosch. And then tried to cover their tracks.