Wenger and co getting abused by arsenal fans

Arsene Wenger has not only changed the way Arsenal play football but how football is played in England and has an effect on how football is being played in the world at the moment. Everyone who loves football needs to give him the respect he is due.

But as an Gooner we do need an injection of fresh ideas.

I love Wenger's style of spotting young talented players and playing attractive football, but its just not cutting the mustard at the moment. Clubs are just out muscling us in the transfers in and out with money and with 18 years, other clubs are have seen how we play, know how to play against us and this is been happening for a long while.

Even thou I can't stand Fergie; I can recognise how his management of Utd changed when needed. From match to match; season to season keeping it fresh and exciting.

The question is if Arsene Wenger can be the person who brings in the fresh ideas or should he step a side. Let's be honest here; only a handful of clubs in the world that's in a better position than Arsenal, but as fans we have become bored as Wenger's style has become stale.
 
Arsene Wenger has not only changed the way Arsenal play football but how football is played in England and has an effect on how football is being played in the world at the moment. Everyone who loves football needs to give him the respect he is due.

But as an Gooner we do need an injection of fresh ideas.

I love Wenger's style of spotting young talented players and playing attractive football, but its just not cutting the mustard at the moment. Clubs are just out muscling us in the transfers in and out with money and with 18 years, other clubs are have seen how we play, know how to play against us and this is been happening for a long while.

Even thou I can't stand Fergie; I can recognise how his management of Utd changed when needed. From match to match; season to season keeping it fresh and exciting.

The question is if Arsene Wenger can be the person who brings in the fresh ideas or should he step a side. Let's be honest here; only a handful of clubs in the world that's in a better position than Arsenal, but as fans we have become bored as Wenger's style has become stale.

The results over the past 10 years answers your question whether wenger is the person to bring fresh ideas to the club
 
horse****

Whoa whoa whoa, he brought sports science into football... without which because no one else in the world did so and no other sport did then football in England would still be played by fat players who go down the pub to drink 10 pints the night before a game.

It's rather tiring that Wenger gets credit for making players more athletes than footballers at a time when every sport in the world and most football clubs were doing exactly the same thing.

Wenger didn't change a single thing in English football and this beautiful game nonsense. We had constant posts about Barcelona becoming a possession based bore after a few years of Guardiola because.... they were pretty boring to watch where as Real and pre Guardiola Bayern being incredibly exciting to watch.

Arsenal when we were successful played a counter attacking/all out attack/pacey attack based game. Henry/Pires were epic counter attackers, we rarely played this 65-75% possession toothless rubbish stuff. But as with many things, because we were extremely exciting to watch and really from 98-2005 we were one of the most exciting teams in the world, lately the stuff we play is boring, ludicrously predictable with very little flare and really no truly exciting players at all. OX runs a lot but produces nothing, he's Townsend/lennon in his worst seasons, nothing else. Sanchez runs about a lot but ultimately he's scored about 2 pretty goals and 10 5 yard tap ins.

We don't have an Ibra smashing in epic goals from all angles, or a henry who runs past 5 players before scoring, or a Pires scoring from 40 yards or doing a couple of players then chipping Schmeichel(at Villa).

Arsenal USED to play great football and it used to be great to watch win OR lose... now we look boring and dull for 95% of every game, we look boring if we win most of the time and absolutely dire when we lose.

I can't stand that people just decide a team is a certain way then always refer to them the same way LONG after they have completely changed.
 
horse****

I think he did change things, but only like Mourinho has, and Guardiola before him etc. every now and again a manager comes along and changes the way people think and look at things. It does seem that Wenger has seemed to struggle to keep up with the changes in some areas.
 
I think he did change things, but only like Mourinho has, and Guardiola before him etc. every now and again a manager comes along and changes the way people think and look at things. It does seem that Wenger has seemed to struggle to keep up with the changes in some areas.

what exactly did he change then?
 
what exactly did he change then?

The science and physio side of football, in THIS country. I'd hope every top manager makes some sort of change. Sometimes it's an evolution of something, sometimes it's a revolutionary change. Wengers was an evolution of how things were going, but that is still a change.
 
Wasn't sure if it should go here or banter thread. Good old Ian Wright got drunk and started posting on twitter.

Started off with saying someone, anyone, someone involved at Arsenal needs to be fired over not bringing Fabregas back to Arsenal when we had first choice. When some fans called him out on it he called them names and told them he'd like to meet them individually. Deleted later but added something along the lines of lots of truth spoken when drunk.

Wenger follows it up with brilliant retardism this morning.

"If everybody is fit and available, we dont need to go into transfer market but we have to accept Koscielny has a question mark over fitness, so we may have to go into market."

Yeah, in magic land where Arsenal don't have injury concerns if Arsenal have everyone fit we don't need anyone.... well except an actually competent defensive midfielder, a competent striker, a competent left back.

He managed to exclude the list of injury prone players and pick on Koscielny, seemingly the second CB we've had in row who has continuing achilles problems. Walcott, Gibbs, Koscielny, Flamini, Arteta, Ramsey, Wilshere, Rosicky, Diaby. But if just Koscielny is fit, we're fine.

Wenger refusing to prepare for injuries mostly because he denies we have injury problems. if we got rid of injury prone players and brought other players and had been doing this over the past decade consistently we'd have the same squad size, no need to buy and 5+ more useful squad players available at any time than we have now.

We gave Rosicky a new contract despite the fact he didn't play and for an attacking player produced too little and constantly gave away freekicks. He gave him a new contract then bought Sanchez/Welbeck which was going to limit spots across the attack/midfield, had Campbell coming back for the season and Walcott supposedly being available this season.... still gave a player who barely played before a new contract. How about not giving new contracts to bit part players who aren't good enough and especially when your plans are to reduce his playing time even further.
 
Ramsey plays 13 games in a row with no break(from a quick look I think the last game he missed was Chelsea and afaik that was due to an injury forcing him off at half time the previous game) for club and country, with a couple of sub appearances in there from end of October. The last 5 games in particular he played every minute without being subbed, 6 games from 22nd November to 9th December.... out for a month(likely at least) with a hamstring injury.

In some of the recent games I've pointed out that despite having Campbell/Rosicky/others on the bench we've made only 2 subs during a busy period and leading up to an even busier xmas period. So rather than sub Ramsey(or anyone else) in this busy period when other injuries have hurt us he's not even used all available subs to give him at least some break. Nor has he been completely rested at any time recently. Again while we threw a new contract at Rosicky and have point blank refused to use him, while Campbell has had 4-5 sub appearances only and Podolski is barely playing more than that despite being our best finisher.

So another predictable injury coming from more predictable inability to rotate, even recognise it could be a problem and the utterly absurd recent refusal to use a third sub while our teams injuries mount up.

Monreal had a minor knock, Wenger didn't give him a rest, rushed him back in for the next game, turned it into at least a couple of weeks out if not more when almost anyone with a brain would have protected him and not played him a few days after the first knock.

The guy is brain dead... but then bangs on about us not having injury problems, refusing to adapt, refusing to protect players.

Has his favourites, get injured, come back, play every game(almost every second) available till they get injured again.
 
Can't wait for Jan, Diaby will finally be fit, we'll give him a new contract, Wenger will bang on about it being like a new signing... and he'll get injured on 2nd Feb at the latest. Wenger will be shocked, the rest of the world sighs at the inevitability.
 
The business side of Arsenal are happy. Spend is comparatively low, and whilst they don't push for the title they regularly get into the CL, they're getting the TV rights cash for being on telly loads, they've massively increased match day revenue since leaving Highbury, they won the FA Cup last year... Where is the negative for the board members and shareholders?

They could spend an inordinate sum now and maybe push for the title and probably play better footy and get better results over the course of a season but if they push for the title and still finish 3rd or 4th (a realistic proposition with City and Chelsea being so strong and a lot of other money being in the league now) what was gained? Elevated happiness for fans? How do you capture that against the bottom line?

Winning a cup competition that most big teams don't care that much about

You do realise you are talking about the FA Cup here? :confused:
Be careful what you wish for.

Indeed! This is a running theme through this thread, and with good reason.
 
Firstly, football is entertainment, entertain the fans = more money, bore them to tears = less money.

Financially Arsenal aren't particularly profitable and have an exceptionally high wage spend for their achievement level. They are as it stands spending some 80million more than Spurs a year in wages to usually get one place higher does that sound like fantastic value. Is spending 80million more than Spurs to secure a champions league spot that brings in 25-30mil a year sound financially sound? it also ensures higher sponsorship deals but it's basically a wash.

With the way tv money is, with Arsenal's stadium income we could drop wages 70-80million, make the CL maybe slightly less often, and become more profitable.

Football isn't about where you finish or simply participation, it's about the chance to improve. Without that, watching the same hopeless football week in week out is boring. Arsenal are entirely predictable, beat a **** team in the CL, beat a team that hasn't beaten Arsenal at the emirates in 5 years or something who generally lose to Arsenal regardless of how well they play... woo, lose the next big game(though personally think we'll beat Liverpool because of how bad they currently are, it wouldn't surprise me if we lost I just don't think we will this time).

There is very little joy in watching a 170mil wage a year team that has spent a few hundred million in the past few years smash a crap newcastle when you know we'll lose both important games and stupid games against "weaker" teams due to the SAME mistakes we've been making for 10 years.

Again, something people keep ignoring when they bang on about massive spending, I haven't seen a single Arsenal fan that wants Wenger gone also want a massive spending spree. We all believe Arsenal can be run better with the current level of spending. Ozil money could have been spent so much better, getting shot of Diaby, Rosicky, monreal and a half dozen others, using great players we have who rot on the bench, actually organising the defence so we don't play like retarded idiots against any half decent offence. They got thoroughly embarrassed by STOKE, Newcastle played Cisse against us and they didn't look like scoring... but still did.

I don't care if we get worse, I don't care if we get better, I care that we have someone who TRIES to do better in charge and is willing to see his mistakes, admit to them and attempt to improve where he's weak. That is all, 90% of managers can do this, maybe 20-30% of them will do it successfully. It's the trying that's important. I currently support a team in which I feel 90% of the players don't give a flying **** if they lose, who get all giddy over themselves when they beat Norwich and pretend they played great when they win 1-0 through a fluke goal against Palace or something.

Attitude, my club, my manager, my players, they act like we're a cash machine and it doesn't matter how hard they try.

Seriously again, the majority of Arsenal fans make less than 40k a week and Wenger just sits there saying "I'm going to give Diaby another contract where he'll make more a week than the average Arsenal fan makes in a year..... " do you know how utterly downright disgusting that is. To show a complete lack of care that you would say that to the people who pay your salary? To say, this guy who has already received upwards of 15million for doing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, who has made 15 times what you ever will, who will never contribute to the team, I want to continue asking you to pay him even more because..... he's delusional, blind, stupid or literally doesn't care about the fans at all.

Watching a team barely put in any effort in half the games, show no ability to improve and no care that they don't is painful. Wenger and half the players treat Arsenal as a pay day, nothing more or less. I'd prefer to pay more to a manager and players that fail but TRY than to pay most of these ****'s to just sit around getting rich while pretending they are great.
 
So you want a Gordon Strachan/Martin O'Neill type that will kick every ball with the players on the pitch but might end up relegating you, as opposed to a studious teacher type that doesn't get animated very often yet brings home silverware, profitability and CL footy every year for what, 16 years in a row?

Yes, I can see why you'd be able to defend yourself against those calling delusions.
 
So you want a Gordon Strachan/Martin O'Neill type that will kick every ball with the players on the pitch but might end up relegating you, as opposed to a studious teacher type that doesn't get animated very often yet brings home silverware, profitability and CL footy every year for what, 16 years in a row?

Yes, I can see why you'd be able to defend yourself against those calling delusions.

home silverwhere? Di Matteo has bagged same amount of not more silverwhere then wenger in the last 10 years.

Point is wenger hardly brings success to the club.

When you have liverpool fans asking for rodgers head after 10 bad games and everyone seemingly accepting there reasons. If its an arsenal fan wanting wenger out for 10 years of rubbish, its "be careful what u wish for"/acting like a fickle fan.

lol
 
home silverwhere? Di Matteo has bagged same amount of not more silverwhere then wenger in the last 10 years.

But not in the last 1 year...

Point is wenger hardly brings success to the club.

What do you define as success? Stability? Silverware? CL footy? He brought all of that and still does (after a dry period, admittedly).

If you define it as regularly winning the Prem and the CL then you're pipe dreaming. Arsenal aren't at that level and changing the manager won't take them there.
 
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