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What do gamers actually think about Ray-Tracing?

Mhursteth said:
Wouldn't that sign that looks like a target shine the lighter blue colour stronger than the exceptionally strong purple in the steam?

There is also no green light blending into the steam which would likely overpower both as these are much brighter colours.

The green is almost making the human look like shrek but has zero effect on steam.
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I smell a troll account
 
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With 7 posts, it is quite clearly exactly that lol Thinks he knows how literal light simulation behaves better than actual rays of light.
 
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ICDP said:
lol, so are we really at the the “it’s your monitor that’s the problem” stage? People can only form a positive opinion on RT, or they are called liars, stupid or are accused of having faulty or cheap monitors?

I could view it in a cheap LCD, or a very expensive OLED, it doesn’t change my opinion that the PT scenes you posted are too dark. The funny thing is you were the one who accused me of having an axe to grind. Now I’m accused of having cheap tat monitors that just don’t let me see what mrk can see. The absolute ******* arrogance.
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Some scenes look darker than they should (even more so since we're used to regular, relative "flat" raster), as the game has a really strong and weird Eye Adaptation + Vignetting going on. Even with a mod is hard to get rid off. Raster and RT are less effected, but path tracing manages to push it forward better.

In strong contrast, high dynamic range scenes is very obvious and annoying. Could be artistic, could be whatever, it happens less when there isn't such hard contrast.





First image is looking "up"/leveled somewhat, with the street in relative darkness. Second image is just looking down and the scene brightness up.

Below are a couple more pics. First is with Raster, second with path tracing. On the second image, right side up, where the blue is on the building, in the path tracing image the highlights are much stronger than in raster, so I'm not sure that the "darker" instances are due to path tracing (as in too few rays going around) or rather an artistic choice. I tend to lean towards the later and indeed, a better OLED HDR monitor would probably render it better (as in look better), while the raster and regular RT (in this game) probably tends to "compress" the space a little bit better for "normal" displays.



 
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Calin Banc said:
Some scenes look darker than they should (even more so since we're used to regular, relative "flat" raster), as the game has a really strong and weird Eye Adaptation + Vignetting going on. Even with a mod is hard to get rid off. Raster and RT are less effected, but path tracing manages to push it forward better.

In strong contrast, high dynamic range scenes is very obvious and annoying. Could be artistic, could be whatever, it happens less when there isn't such hard contrast.





First image is looking "up"/leveled somewhat, with the street in relative darkness. Second image is just looking down and the scene brightness up.

Below are a couple more pics. First is with Raster, second with path tracing. On the second image, right side up, where the blue is on the building, in the path tracing image the highlights are much stronger than in raster, so I'm not sure that the "darker" instances are due to path tracing (as in too few rays going around) or rather an artistic choice. I tend to lean towards the later.



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I heard someone mention that gameplay is affected in a large way from RT in this game because the game was not developed with RT in mind, it was an after thought add on later on by collaboration between CD Projekt Red and Nvidia.

They mentioned the lack of fill lighting where RT is not able to compensate, reducing playbility of the actual game and needing RT turned off for some sections.


I never played it far enough personally so I cannot say it is fact, but it's not the first time I have heard this complaint, and the other guy has a decent theory in my opinion.
 
Most of us have played the game through to completion a few times over now and there has never been a need to turn off RT because a section can't be played.

The only thing which I think you are on about is that at launch, and probably for the first year, Cyberpunk had a default LUT/shadow tone map that was washed out and occluded a lot of black detail, so in sections like the Delamain factory which is almost exclusively dark, some people had issues seeing where they were going (hence the torch/night vision mods became a thing). This seemed deliberate as it was artistic in styling. CDPR patched the game and suddenly this washed out look was gone and proper tone mapping was now being seen. It has been fine ever since.

What you are seemingly referring to is old news and has not been relevant for quite literally the last 2 years.
 
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mrk said:
Most of us have played the game through to completion a few times over now and there has never been a need to turn off RT because a section can't be played.

The only thing which I think you are on about is that at launch, and probably for the first year, Cyberpunk had a default LUT/shadow tone map that was washed out and occluded a lot of black detail. This seemed deliberate as it was artistic in styling. CDPR patched the game and suddenly this washed out look was gone and proper tone mapping was now being seen. It has been fine ever since.

What you are seemingly referring to is old news and has not been relevant for quite literally the last 2 years.
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Is that the same time - span of owning an OLED?

If RT requires an OLED, then you should contact the creators and tell them to put warnings to the recommended screen spec too.
 
No I had a 34" AH-IPS ultrawide calibrated with an onboard LUT during that period. RT does not require an OLED. All I said before was you are not getting the full scope of black level detail without on which is a matter of fact, it is the difference between having infinite contrast for black and not having infinite contrast. Not that it's impossible to play a game like this without one, because I and plenty of others did exactly that for the first playthrough.

But as is usually the case, people online just blow things out of proportion when there's something they don't like.
 
It's nice to go oooh for a few minutes. But most people are going to prefer higher FPS.

RT often doesn't actually look better tbh. It can over-saturate things.
 
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mrk said:
AKA Metro Exodus and a few others that have RT only reflections and/or lighting. The future is going to be RT whether people like it or not, realtime dynamics environments are only possible with RT if full immersion is considered.



This is some kind of troll attempt surely. There is not a single person with a bit of sense that can look at a screenshot like this:

xGLm1Jp.jpg


And go "Yeah mate that's low fidelity", and this is one of my weaker screenshots.


It's never publicly admitted but through quotes and interviews from the CDPR investor calls that they held often after launch we can get a grounded understanding of the PS4/XBOX situation. CDPR are quoted stating:

"The biggest question during this call was how it could have been this bad with last-gen versions of the game. How did this go unnoticed, how did the team think they could hide it from the public, and just what could have been done to prevent this.

Nowakowski mentioned, "It is more about us looking – as was previously stated – at the PC and next-gen performance rather than current-gen. We definitely did not spend enough time looking at that."

Which aligns with leaked info that CDPR didn't initially want to release a PS4 version as their vision was for a next gen game which simply wasn't possible on last gen PS/XBOX, but because of contractual agreements that they had, and the lack of testing on PS4/XBOX, and the fact that red flags raised by portions of CDPR development team went ignored (also admitted to by the same interview but I won't bother quoting that here as not relevant in this context), we end up with what we see about the PS4 version.
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Tbh that scene looks fake. The model looks dreadful and his face looks not life like at all. I wasn’t impressed at all by cyberpunks graphics as you know…..Is this all you have got to support your argument?
 
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mrk said:
The only person arguing is you and one other person seemingly, enjoy your own bubble I guess.
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Quite a few reading through the posts tend to agree RT is nice but has problems with it and isn’t implemented uniformly in all games and generally tanks performance on (let’s be generous) below a £1k 4080.

I’ll revisit this if it isn’t deleted in about 2-3 years to check the reality of RT then with what was predicted in this thread.
 
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mrk said:
No I had a 34" AH-IPS ultrawide calibrated with an onboard LUT during that period. RT does not require an OLED. All I said before was you are not getting the full scope of black level detail without on which is a matter of fact, it is the difference between having infinite contrast for black and not having infinite contrast. Not that it's impossible to play a game like this without one, because I and plenty of others did exactly that for the first playthrough.

But as is usually the case, people online just blow things out of proportion when there's something they don't like.
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Or best of all, ignore evidence or/and move the goal posts to suit narrative.

At the end of the day, as said many times, people won't be crying or rather be able to cry when more games come out and provide no fallback to raster methods hence why no one mentions spiderman 2, metro ee and avatar in such discussions, it's simply accepted, same way no one ever talks about things like tesselation, AO and so on ;)
 
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Nexus18 said:
Or best of all, ignore evidence or/and move the goal posts to suit narrative.

At the end of the day, as said many times, people won't be crying or rather be able to cry when more games provide come out and provide no fallback to raster methods hence why no one mentions spiderman 2, metro ee and avatar in such discussions, it's simply accepted, same way no one ever talks about things like tesselation, AO and so on ;)
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Doesn't matter at present times IMHO. The RT only games are only but a drop in an ocean of choices at the moment and with 3xA games going down the drain lately and indies on the rise I'm not to worried about my current GPU being poor at RT. I'm sure that will change but it will go the same way as all new tech always has. The first many years of the tech will be for enthusiast grade hardware only and still run like a turd without the help of all sorts of assistant features masked as upgrades. Then as it matures, together with the hardware to run it, it will increase in adoption rate. But what I also think will happen is that the overall design to run RT will go in a more streamlined direction to reduce the need for dedicated die space for the function. Once this happens, proper RT performance will trickle down to the midrange GPUs that cannot afford a 400-600mm square die, at which point it will become a feature we barely think about, like AO. Until then RT is but a gimmick in my book and not worth the money. Others may/will feel different of course. We all have our preferences.
 
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I keep reading how those who aren’t currently enamoured with RT are somehow crying, or hating on RT just because we don’t like it. Then usually followed up with a “you’ll have no choice in the future”. Like some how that’s a petty “up yours” victory.

I am all for the day when RT has no discernible FPS impact and all games have it on by default. I sure most of the other so called “haters” feel the same.

I hated DLSS at first because the IQ impact was terrible. Now I will enable DLSS or FSR even if I don’t need to because doing so means my GPU runs quieter and cooler. So DLSS or FSR on and an FPS cap at 60 is my preference.

Similarly I can appreciate what RT does and if I can enable it and get above 48 FPS (my monitor VRR floor), then I absolutely will. Thankfully devs have given us RT sliders so we can optimise between FPS and fidelity.

I play CP2077 on my 4080 with RT Psycho and DLLS quality at 4K. My son Plays it at 1440p at the exact same settings on his 7900XT apart from XeSS ultra quality. Both of us can experience similar levels of FPS (yes at different resolutions) using RT, one on AMD and one on Nvidia.
 
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