When are you going fully electric?

Jonnycoupe · 26 Sep 2024 at 21:30

Will be a piece of cake now with have 15118:20 for CCS. But you already knew that?

That’s the point really, no outlay for home batteries or a leaf just better utilisation of what you already have.

b0rn2sk8 · 26 Sep 2024 at 21:30

Solar and batteries have different applications and benefits - they are not an either or and incidentally, they have similar payback times.

V2G will be interesting particularly with the growing duck curve in the UK for 6 months of the year from renewables. We may soon see the lowest power prices being in the middle of the day over the summer.

Journey · 26 Sep 2024 at 21:44

Hawk Tuah said:
I'd be surprised if it ever takes off. It's cheaper and easier to buy a dedicated battery.

Not at all really, once the technology is installed at the point of the charger being fitted it is much less disruptive, and offers a much larger capacity than most people would dream of having in their homes.

Hawk Tuah · 26 Sep 2024 at 22:27

Journey said:
Not at all really, once the technology is installed at the point of the charger being fitted it is much less disruptive, and offers a much larger capacity than most people would dream of having in their homes.

Maybe. But, it's not new. Nissan Leafs have been V2G compatible since 2013.

My Leaf battery despite being quite small for a car, is much bigger than the house battery. Still, it's much better use in the car.

b0rn2sk8 said:
We may soon see the lowest power prices being in the middle of the day over the summer.

They already are for me. Power ups (free electric) is during the day. However a lot of people don't have their car at home and plugged in a that time.

Hawk Tuah · 26 Sep 2024 at 22:34

Jonnycoupe said:
Will be a piece of cake now with have 15118:20 for CCS. But you already knew that?

That’s the point really, no outlay for home batteries or a leaf just better utilisation of what you already have.

What chargers are compatible and how much do they cost?

The only V2G charger available at the moment is a Wall box Quasar.

Wallbox Quasar - V2G - Professional Installation Included with EV ultra cable - currently unavailable - Future Charging Solutions

CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE Register your interest here Wallbox has created a direct current (DC) bidirectional electric charger for the home. It uses unique power electronics and high-frequency switching technology to optimise the energy relationship between vehicles, power grids, home energy...

www.futurechargingsolutions.co.uk

If CCS V2G chargers are anything like that price, then I'd imagine it won't be particularly popular.

b0rn2sk8 · 26 Sep 2024 at 23:11

V2G chargers really need to be AC, not DC. Keep it simple on the house side and use the cars onboard inverters.

Many are including bi-directional inverters now, even on cheap cars.

Jonnycoupe · 26 Sep 2024 at 23:37

Hawk Tuah said:
What chargers are compatible and how much do they cost?

The only V2G charger available at the moment is a Wall box Quasar.

Wallbox Quasar - V2G - Professional Installation Included with EV ultra cable - currently unavailable - Future Charging Solutions

CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE Register your interest here Wallbox has created a direct current (DC) bidirectional electric charger for the home. It uses unique power electronics and high-frequency switching technology to optimise the energy relationship between vehicles, power grids, home energy...

www.futurechargingsolutions.co.uk

If CCS V2G chargers are anything like that price, then I'd imagine it won't be particularly popular.

So am I buying Leaf or a Leaf + Quasar? I wish people would get all the details when they recommended stuff. You suggested just a Leaf earlier ignoring the cost of a wall box which you are now citing as a reason v2G won’t take off… the mind boggles

It won’t be no as CHAdeMo leafs are DC only so the wall box needs to do this inversion to AC And step down. You know the very stuff cars with V2L bi direction chargers can do with hardware already in the car.

dlockers · 27 Sep 2024 at 08:11

Any further shouts on second hand hatchback EVs? Checking out minis now. Not for me, for my mum. She averages like 2k a year. Or best to stick to cheap petrol?

Haggisman · 27 Sep 2024 at 08:26

dlockers said:
Any further shouts on second hand hatchback EVs? Checking out minis now. Not for me, for my mum. She averages like 2k a year. Or best to stick to cheap petrol?

Is that 2k of short every day journeys or 2k of 400 mile round trips every couple of months?

Does she have the ability to charge from home?

Hawk Tuah · 27 Sep 2024 at 08:40

Jonnycoupe said:
So am I buying Leaf or a Leaf + Quasar? I wish people would get all the details when they recommended stuff. You suggested just a Leaf earlier ignoring the cost of a wall box which you are now citing as a reason v2G won’t take off… the mind boggles

I don't quite get your outrage. All I'm suggesting is that, in my opinion, I'm dubious it'll take off. My reasoning being, it's already available and people haven't invested in it.

Gees, what's got your balls in a vice.

dlockers · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:03

Haggisman said:
Is that 2k of short every day journeys or 2k of 400 mile round trips every couple of months?

Does she have the ability to charge from home?

2k of short. She can granny charge no problem.

Jonnycoupe · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:04

Hawk Tuah said:
I don't quite get your outrage. All I'm suggesting is that, in my opinion, I'm dubious it'll take off. My reasoning being, it's already available and people haven't invested in it.

Gees, what's got your balls in a vice.

Outrage? Just facts. You said get a leaf but overlooked the £4k wall box!

Simon · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:09

dlockers said:
Any further shouts on second hand hatchback EVs? Checking out minis now. Not for me, for my mum. She averages like 2k a year. Or best to stick to cheap petrol?

Petrol will cost less with that mileage.

Hawk Tuah · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:11

Jonnycoupe said:
Outrage? Just facts. You said get a leaf but overlooked the £4k wall box!

Oh come on, that's wasn't a serious recommendation. But, it is the reality if you wanted to do it today.

Maybe I'm wrong and it will be massive in a few years. I'm guessing it's going to be a JLR feature from your knowledge of it?

Mercenary Keyboard Warrior · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:15

I think V2G or V2H will be good, although its not a direct substitute for home batteries.
Unless of course you have a car that never moves...

If you are a relatively low mileage driver who can park at home and V2G/H takes off then its going to provide benefit for sure.
Otherwise I think a dedicated home system will remain far better. Especially if you pony up for a whole house EPS.

As mentioned above the duck curve could be interesting. (Basically its plotting the cost of green energy through a 24 hour period year by year and as renewables become more significant the mid day prices keep getting lower year by year so you end up with a graph that looks similar to a duck)

I expect over time the early am cheap units will start to disappear, or become less cheap, as more and more people look to take advantage of them.

Haggisman · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:15

dlockers said:
2k of short. She can granny charge no problem.

Pretty much anything would do that then, a 22kw Zoe would probably be the cheapest option - with battery lease if she wanted extra peace of mind (pretty sure the lease for that mileage is only £19/month).

Obviously anything more modern would do the job as well, but of course would be significantly more expensive.

Hawk Tuah · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:29

dlockers said:
Any further shouts on second hand hatchback EVs? Checking out minis now. Not for me, for my mum. She averages like 2k a year. Or best to stick to cheap petrol?

The obvious suggestions are Leaf's and Zoe's. But, any of the early EVs are perfectly useable (ie, also the Kia Soul EV, i3, B Class etc).

Our 2013 is still happily doing a 40 mile a day commute, with plenty to spare.

Keep in mind, 17 plate onwards will be taxed at a higher rate.

b0rn2sk8 · 27 Sep 2024 at 09:54

Yup basically anything will do the job as a cheap town car.

Leafs are surprising well equipped for a car of their age/price.

Simon · 27 Sep 2024 at 10:09

Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
I think V2G or V2H will be good, although its not a direct substitute for home batteries.
Unless of course you have a car that never moves...

If you are a relatively low mileage driver who can park at home and V2G/H takes off then its going to provide benefit for sure.
Otherwise I think a dedicated home system will remain far better. Especially if you pony up for a whole house EPS.

As mentioned above the duck curve could be interesting. (Basically its plotting the cost of green energy through a 24 hour period year by year and as renewables become more significant the mid day prices keep getting lower year by year so you end up with a graph that looks similar to a duck)

I expect over time the early am cheap units will start to disappear, or become less cheap, as more and more people look to take advantage of them.

In principle I could run my house for 2 weeks for free based on last nights free electric. (Or free charging ). And I don’t need to buy a battery

gailjon · 27 Sep 2024 at 10:34

Simon said:
In principle I could run my house for 2 weeks for free based on last nights free electric. (Or free charging ). And I don’t need to buy a battery

And most people have to have a car. Why not buy a V2G car, use that and when you move house, your battery moves with you. It seems so much more useful that a static battery system. Also, every time you change cars, you get an updated battery and V2G system. Roll on myenergis' new V2G EVSE:

Power to the people: myenergi starts work on new V2G EV charger | myenergi GB

British smart home energy technology manufacturer, myenergi has started development on what it believes is likely to be the UK’s first mass-market

www.myenergi.com