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When are you going fully electric?

Discussion in 'Motors' started by Ricochet J, Aug 23, 2018.

  1. Mercenary Keyboard Warrior


    Joined: Aug 4, 2007

    Posts: 10,289

    Location: Wilds of suffolk

    I cant see existing petrol stations becoming EV charging points, the dynamics are too different. Thats assuming there isnt a big breakthrough in charging speed.

    I honestly think its far more likely we will see out of town sites going EV friendly. I mean look at most decent A roads and motorways, very limited distance to a decent size shopping place. Just enable most of the spots with chargers.
    Places like fast food spots etc.

    I am really split on this now. I was planning one more ICE car but I am becoming more and more convinced that i will stick with what I have for 3-4 years and done, move to electric.
    I dont easily have access to charging at home so for me like many others the enabling of streets will be key.
  2. Nasher


    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 16,149

    Buy a classic and keep running that :)

    Dirt cheap insurance and many are appreciating fast.
  3. jpaul


    Joined: Mar 1, 2010

    Posts: 10,325

    ... more virtue signalling from Boris - man without a plan, as the car manufacturers have commented,
    (they must have a calender with distraction strategies from sorting brexit.)

    and, in 15years, let alone the original target, will the supply of the battery raw materials lithium/cobalt remain at an economic price point, or, will the new
    opec emmerge. The tricky politics of lithium mining could derail electric cars
  4. Uther


    Joined: Jun 16, 2005

    Posts: 11,841

    I suspect one of the cunning plans to 'encourage' EV use will be to make fuel more and more expensive.
  5. Hagar


    Joined: Mar 1, 2010

    Posts: 8,045

    Location: Prev. Nkata Cheshire

    I sympathise and feel your pain. As I passed my driving test in the gas guzzling start of the nineteen-seventies and having owned a good few fast and thirsty bikes and cars, I am probably partly responsible for global warming and climate change. Now nearly in my dotage I dont mind taking my foot off the loud pedal now and then and an EV might even be fun.
  6. Rilot


    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 20,056

    Location: Wargrave, UK

    In 50 years time the internal combustion engine will seem as archaic as steam engines do today.
  7. Bug One


    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 10,035

    Location: Sandwich, Kent

    Last time I drove up the M1, at the service station Ecotricity chargers there was a queue of 4 cars waiting to use them. :( Luckily we were in the diesel at the time.

    To charge something like a Kona - it'll take two goes at an Ecotricity motorway charger. So an hour and a half. And there's one, maybe two of them at major motorway service stations.

    With the number of EVs being sold, that's absolutely bonkers.

    When you have to wait hours before you can continue your journey - you'd probably be thinking there's not enough.
  8. Russinating


    Joined: Dec 27, 2005

    Posts: 15,739

    Location: Bristol

    The annoying thing is the infrastructure is already there; there's electrical cabling down ever single street, into every house and premises (well, 99.99%). Imagine being in that position when ICEs became mainstream.

    In my eyes the government nor local councils have the funds, resources, space or time to invest in enough charging infrastructure to meet anticipated demand. I can't even see charging stations (aka petrol stations) being useful unless battery tech gets to a point where fast charging isn't detrimental to battery health.

    But the solution should just be to make charging at home easier. For those with a driveway, the OLEV grant is almost enough; £369 to have a charger fully installed is peanuts. About the same cost as a 3-yr service package or paint protection from a regular ICE dealership.

    For those of us without a driveway - me included - there's still a solution. I know I can get parked outside my house 75% of the time and I'm happy to fall back on public chargers when needed the rest of the time. But there's no OLEV grant, and some councils are particularly against doing so for no real or good reason. If they either provided a list of 'authorised' pedestrian cable covers for now, or - in an amazing/future world - contracted entire streets to have a submerged cable channel to run across the pavement, covered with a rubber strip or similar, then it would hugely encourage their uptake for minimal public cost.
  9. b0rn2sk8


    Joined: Mar 9, 2003

    Posts: 5,419

    There was a grant for LAs for up to 50% of the cost, just halrdly any took them up on it. Those that did focused on taxis rather than private cars.

    But the second question should really be, why should councils be funding chargers? they shouldn’t. Councils don’t fuel fossil refuel if stations. The private sector is key here, councils should be pushing it through the planning process. Glasgow and Milton Keynes are two great examples of what can be done if you want to actually achieve it. There not perfect but they are much better than what you get elsewhere.

    @Bug One one Ecotricty is utter garbage. Their network is old, was never maintained and completely unreliable. The government needs to step in there and strip their exclusivity contract with the service stations as it is holding back vital infrastructure investment. Thankfully there are normally more and better chargers just off the motorway now from better providers, you just have to find them.
  10. McPhee


    Joined: Apr 17, 2009

    Posts: 4,967

    The Ecotricity exclusivity agreement with MSAs is a major hurdle.

    The business deserves credit for its part in ensuring early EVs were viable. But its reluctance to invest further, while holding exclusivity on critical sites, is an ever growing problem. I know there are a few service stations, particularly on the M1 and M4, where there are regular queues. And then as a whole, the network is unreliable.

    While it's nice to see the government being ambitious with the revised target for electrification, it strikes me as little more than hot air without solutions for this and other problems (e.g. kerbside charging infrastructure).
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2020
  11. Russinating


    Joined: Dec 27, 2005

    Posts: 15,739

    Location: Bristol

    They shouldn't have to, but it would/should be the easiest and most cost effective way of doing so. For a start, anything to do with public highways has to go through and be approved by the council or the local authority anyway, so their involvement and time is prerequisite. If everyone on an individual basis applied for something like a pavement cable channel - with a potentially bespoke cover - then the time and cost per one would be far, FAR higher than a city-wide infrastructure project.

    As per all such projects it would be paid for by the public anyway via council tax, fuel duty, whatever.

    Anything's possible it's just a matter of demand.
  12. Alibaba99

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jun 29, 2004

    Posts: 2,295

    I'm guessing that you haven't watched the Carwow videos with Model 3, Audi RS5 and Merc GLC63? They don't just compare the cars on standing start acceleration.
  13. chaparral


    Joined: Nov 27, 2005

    Posts: 20,644

    I have a feeling fuel going to available for a very long time as it not just cars that use fuel

    Thousands of things other then cars also have ICE engines ;)

    What about boats, lorries, heavy plant machines, road making machines, planes etc etc etc
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2020
  14. Chris1712


    Joined: Jul 29, 2004

    Posts: 8,933

    Location: Somerset

    I don’t see what the fuss is about. I can’t imagine there will even be ICE cars produced in 15 years let alone anyone wants one? It’s like announcing ‘VHS won’t be available after 2010’. Like yeah of course?
  15. jpaul


    Joined: Mar 1, 2010

    Posts: 10,325

  16. DB_SamX


    Joined: Feb 17, 2006

    Posts: 7,952

    Location: Winchester

    I can't see how we our power network will be able to cope with the demand without a significant increase in power generator I. E. Investment in infrastructure.

    There was a report out literally last week on the subject. https://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/CBP-7480#full report (already out of date within a week as they were working based on previous dates - lol).

    I also attended a talk by a researcher at the University of Southampton where he expressed similar doubts about being able to deliver on it (based on current levels of expected infrastructure investment).

    So imo, based on current way/timescale infrastructure is delivered in the country, I can't see the target being achieved. So it's an unrealistic target made by policymakers who will be long gone and forgotten by then.
  17. Fusion


    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 10,215

    Location: Notts

    The optimist sees opportunity in every danger. Plenty of opportunity and money to be made in these coming decades, for those that step up.
  18. jpaul


    Joined: Mar 1, 2010

    Posts: 10,325

  19. ramirez


    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 3,116

    Location: Plymouth

    Who are people reccomending for Business leases at the moment? is there much in it between them? will be my first time leasing so not sure where to start
  20. CaptainRAVE

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Nov 21, 2004

    Posts: 33,381

    Exactly, it won't, this is a pipedream. We'd need many more power stations and a significantly upgraded power network. It makes Boris and the Tories sound good though.

    Power network fails - 'sorry, half of the countries work force can't make it in today because their cars didn't charge'.

    We don't even know yet if we have enough rare metals to supply enough batteries to replace all of the petrol cars. It also generates a lot of CO2 to make a battery - not to worry though, we'll make those in China (as we do everything else) so that the UK will appear to be reducing its carbon footprint.

    The whole thing is nonsense.