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Where did Dx10.1 from Vantage go, Nvidia knows

so.. let me get this right..

two pages of people ranting at nvidia, due to some "article" in..


Dun dun dunnnnnnnnnn!

FUDzilla!


Shame on you!
 
uvmain said:
so.. let me get this right..

two pages of people ranting at nvidia, due to some "article" in..


Dun dun dunnnnnnnnnn!

FUDzilla!


Shame on you!
Click to expand...

Well, to be fair, this article, too. :)

In particular:
DirectX 10.1 Summary

There should be no doubt that Assassin's Creed contains DirectX 10.1 technology, and that that technology provides AMD's video cards with a solid performance boost. However, it is not to last. A few days ago, we received this statement from Andy Swanson of Ubisoft via NVIDIA:

Ubisoft plans to release a patch for the PC version of Assassin’s Creed that addresses the majority of issues reported by fans. In addition to addressing reported glitches, the patch will remove support for DX10.1. The performance gains seen by players who are currently playing Assassin’s Creed with a DX10.1 graphics card are in large part due to the fact that our implementation removes a render pass during post-effect which is costly.

That leads us to believe that DirectX 10.1 support is being permanently removed from Assassin's Creed. But then, the Ubisoft UK site says this:

In addition to addressing reported glitches, the patch will remove support for DX10.1 in order to rework its implementation.

We don’t have an exact date for the release of this patch but we’re hard at work and hope to have further updates soon.

To "rework its implementation" sounds to us like they are removing DX10.1 so that they can change the way it is implemented in Assassin's Creed, not that they are removing it permanently, but that is just a hopeful guess.

So, regarding DirectX 10.1 in Assassin's Creed two things are clear. It is obvious that DirectX 10.1 brings significant performance enhancement for AMD's ATI Radeon HD 3870 and Radeon HD 3870 X2, and likely for all of the other Radeon HD 3K series of video cards. It is also clear that DirectX 10.1 does not bring with it a visual upgrade worth getting excited about in this game right now. One lousy edge receiving multisampling is not worth writing home about. The ATI Radeon 3870 performance boost gained with DX10.1 certainly is though.

Rather less clear, however, is the fate of DX 10.1 support in Assassin’s Creed and whether ATI Radeon HD 3000 series video cards will maintain the performance results they currently exhibit when AA is enabled. One thing is for sure, DX 10.1 seems to be very positive for AMD. This is the first game to use it, and we saw positive gameplay results. Removing that support would be taking a step backwards instead of pushing the industry forwards. If it truly gets removed in the next patch, that would make absolutely no sense at all from a gamers standpoint.

Kyle’s note: We think we have done our homework here and don’t see any reason for DX10.1 support to be taken away from Radeon 3800 series owners. This is the first time we have seen the ATI Radeon 3870 benefit from the heavily marketed DX10.1 support. To simply take that away is a travesty and we think that Ubisoft should at least leave the choice up to the end user. Obviously you don’t have to patch the game, so Ubisoft can’t really take it away from you, but don’t expect continued support for the DX10.1 version of the game, at least not for the time being. And that time being is very likely till NVIDIA gets its own DX10.1 GPU considering it has a reported US$4,000,000.00 in deals invested with Ubisoft at the moment. Time will tell.

The performance gains seen by players who are currently playing Assassin’s Creed with a DX10.1 graphics card are in large part due to the fact that our implementation removes a render pass during post-effect which is costly.

We did not find it to be “costly,” but Ubisoft is the company that has to pay to support their users, not us. Surely if you are playing with an 3800 series Radeon and using AA, you might want to look before you accept the next AC patch from Ubisoft.
Click to expand...
 
uvmain said:
so.. let me get this right..

two pages of people ranting at nvidia, due to some "article" in..


Dun dun dunnnnnnnnnn!

FUDzilla!


Shame on you!
Click to expand...

No, shame on you!.

DX10 got changed so that G80 could be compliant for Vista. If Microsoft will bend over for Nvidia then that speaks wonders as Microsoft is a huge company with massive resources.

Latest 8800GTX WHQL driver date?. Latest 9800Pro driver date?. Compare and be scared :p.

Assassins Creed with DX10.1 going to be removed until Nvidia catch up. Nvidia not happy that ATI are getting a boost so Nvidia is stopping it.

9800GTX card = any new technologies?. 9800GX2?. Nothing 9 series about them. No better efficiency, no better on the electric bill. They are not cooler either. 2900 - 3800 lots of changes that warrants the name change IMO. Even the 4 series is going to be different also. At least ATI have changed over the last 3 name changes. The 8800GTX got weaker with G92 (high res/highAA/AF) with not so great efficiency increases.

Nvidia have had a lot more time than ATI and still they can't even boast DX10.1. There's a definite improvement using AA, so why are Nvidia not using this already?.

So dun dun duuuunnnnnnnnn there you have it. The Assassins Creed part is something I've just found out about but the other stuff is common knowledge.

Oh and DX10.1 support not been included in Vantage because it would give ATI the advantage.

Nvidia "The way it's meant to be paid" is the new logo :p.
 
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http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ5Myw4LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==


Obviously you don’t have to patch the game, so Ubisoft can’t really take it away from you, but don’t expect continued support for the DX10.1 version of the game, at least not for the time being. And that time being is very likely till NVIDIA gets its own DX10.1 GPU considering it has a reported US$4,000,000.00 in deals invested with Ubisoft at the moment. Time will tell.
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Yeah definately a conspiracy theory. :rolleyes: Its clearly a case of you scrach our back and we'll scratch yours.
 
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jrodga2k5 said:
it's such a shame ATi cant throw the money about the way NVidia are! They ideally shouldnt have to, but then again, this is business!
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It is a shame but it's a plus for ATI. Nvidia will continue to get exposed if they keep getting their own way and that will maybe bring a huge fine for monopolization.

I really think ATI deserves a round of applause here. The company that was so behind and out of the game to some people is now affecting Nvidia for their lethargically alert approach. Nvidia are just trying to wipe DX10.1 support out just now because they know how much stick they will get for doing nothing in all the time they've had. I still can't understand how the 2900 transformed into the better 3870 and now nearly a third change with the 4850/70 cards within one year when Nvidia has given nothing but weaker variants of the one and a half year old 8800GTX.

Gerard said:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ5Myw4LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==




Yeah definately a conspiracy theory. :rolleyes:
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Oh c'mon Gerard. It's a well known fact Shocky has the Nvidia bedspread with matching pillowcases and a glow in the dark Nvidia border :D.
 
My Dx version reads as 10.

I would want a 10.1 test for any card why?

Might as well put a Dx15 test in.


I'm loving all this "Nvidia the evil", yet any time someone points out how things have gone ATI's way before, nobody answers their point. Brilliant.

Besides, listening to "$COMPANY is a corporate beastwhore" from a bunch of windows users is downright hilarious.
 
Hmm, I seem to remember a certain user in this thread, slagging of ATI on multiple occassions after going from ATI to Nvidia now he is slagging of Nvidia.

Personally I dont care about DX10.1 as its not a big deal for now and my card is based on G80 which was out long ago, and I knew not to buy the so called 9000 series cards anyhow.
 
Shocky-FM said:
Real mature as usual, but carry on, i'm lauging my ass off here. :D
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No need to take it personally lol. It's just a laugh :).

On a serious note though. Do you dismiss the report of Nvidia kicking up a stink because they have not got DX10.1 support on their cards?. You can see the improvements with Vista SP1 clearly when put against Vista without SP1 and the only gains are to be had with the ATI cards. Also the announcement that the new patch will remove this technology. I don't know how you can say that's nonsense? :confused:. Do you have any sources to prove otherwise? (same to you thegoonden). I'll happily read and try and understand your reasoning then.

I bet you any money when Nvidia have DX10.1, that a lot of games will start to support DX10.1 where as now you will not get as much support because of the influence Nvidia has in the gaming market.

When the Radeon 9800Pro has a 6 month newer driver than the 8800GTX you have to seriously start asking yourself why?.
 
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helmutcheese said:
Hmm, I seem to remember a certain user in this thread, slagging of ATI on multiple occassions after going from ATI to Nvidia now he is slagging of Nvidia.

Personally I dont care about DX10.1 as its not a big deal for now and my card is based on G80 which was out long ago, and I knew not to buy the so called 9000 series cards anyhow.
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lol yes, i have to agree. you guys are complaining about two separate issues here. yes yes we all know the nvidia cards are all old tech blah blah whatever, but they wouldnt be old tech if ati were in the running at the time. That is ATI's fault, not nvidia's. so lots got off that old boat and talk about more interesting.


as far as he dx 10.1 issue goes.....it dosnt look good for nvida does it. they gave the gf3's advantage in 01, they saved the gf8's and 9's from a disadvantage in 3dm vantage. at least thats what it looks like. i couldnt honestly say whether that was planned or not, or if futuermark genuinely didnt have time to create a dx 10.1 benchamrk.

incidentally, on the subject, does anybody have a link for AC benchmarks, including dx10.1 tests and runs on nvidia cards?
 
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thegoonden said:
My source?
DxDiag, it don't say "version installed 10.1".
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Sorry, I was meaning your reference towards DX10.1 being pointless. From what I've seen it looks pretty good to be honest so that's why I'm confused to what you have said. I know Vantage is the title name but you can't ignore the Assassins Creed results with Vista SP1 and without SP1 and the fact that Nvidia are wanting ATI's use of DX10.1 in this title wiped out. Nvidia has it's logo on a lot of titles and to think that there could be an AA improvement to be had in more games but not allowed because of Nvidia's bullying is worrying.

We are all wanting new technologies and really expected to see them from Nvidia first as they've been in the driving seat over the the last year and a half. Now that ATI have this and it's being used in a game that is quite popular and on release today with glowing results so far then I hope you can understand why people are bothered by this?.

James.Miller this is the only review I've seen so far. It's pretty interesting if this is what DX10.1 will bring. http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ5Myw4LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
 
J.D said:
On a serious note though. Do you dismiss the report of Nvidia kicking up a stink because they have not got DX10.1 support on their cards?. You can see the improvements with Vista SP1 clearly when put against Vista without SP1 and the only gains are to be had with the ATI cards. Also the announcement that the new patch will remove this technology. I don't know how you can say that's nonsense? :confused:. Do you have any sources to prove otherwise? (same to you thegoonden). I'll happily read and try and understand your reasoning then.

I bet you any money when Nvidia have DX10.1, that a lot of games will start to support DX10.1 where as now you will not get as much support because of the influence Nvidia has in the gaming market.

When the Radeon 9800Pro has a 6 month newer driver than the 8800GTX you have to seriously start asking yourself why?.
Click to expand...

Theres no proof nvidia were directly involved in the dx10.1 support being removed from AC, from screenshots at rage3d and [H] I can see a drop in IQ, contrast looks messed up and textures look blurry on the ATI cards tested, the developers themselfs even said the performance increase was due to a bug, it's just pure paranoia on everyones part to believe nvidia paid them to remove it.

Of course we will see dx10.1 games when nvidia support them, developers have no reason not to support it then, right now most users with high end cards do not have DX10.1 capable hardware and SP1 has only just been released, in fact it's still not available to the public via windows update.
 
thats interesting. according to that graph, the 9800gtx is bang on with the 3870x2 with 4xmsaa enable and dx10.1 installed. so it begs the question then: what have nvidia got to loose by 'allowing' futuremark to go ahead with a dx10.1 benchmark? should we really assume nvidia will be worried that a dual gpu 3870 is right on par with a single 9800gtx, but doing so with worse image quality?
 
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To be fair I dont think they want to see the technology "working"! If it is seen to give an advantage in terms of performance then why would NVidia want it to be known? Well ATi have a feature which does so and so and we dont kinda thing. People go wow that does that and it increases their likliness to buy something! So by "eliminating" that feature it is therefore useless!

It's basically a case of....if we cant do it, neither can you!
 
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