why all the hate for hs2?

[GreatAuk]

Another 10 years does seem a bit ridiculous, especially looking at how far progressed a lot of the work is already, like the various viaducts and tunnels that have already been built... French lines of similar scale seem to take about 5 years to build, but this delay takes it to about 15 years.

Poor decision making at the government level has got to be part of the story (constant changes to scope, lack of certainty about the project meaning no one can invest in capacity to deliver it with confidence, deliberately slowing delivery to reduce annual costs even if the total cost increases as a result, etc), but I think it's clear HS2 itself and the contractors working for them share the blame.

I'm very pro high speed rail in general, but the way HS2 is being managed by our politicians and delivered by the industry is making it hard to stay enthusiastic.

Would echo comments about how things like this seem all too emblematic of wider problems with the direction the country is going and how it's being run.

 

[doodah]

Not sure how this can't be seen as some type of fraud and theft? £250m to design something that's not going to get built?

Disgraceful joke.

 

[adam cool dude]

Another 10 years does seem a bit ridiculous, especially looking at how far progressed a lot of the work is already, like the various viaducts and tunnels that have already been built... French lines of similar scale seem to take about 5 years to build, but this delay takes it to about 15 years.

Poor decision making at the government level has got to be part of the story (constant changes to scope, lack of certainty about the project meaning no one can invest in capacity to deliver it with confidence, deliberately slowing delivery to reduce annual costs even if the total cost increases as a result, etc), but I think it's clear HS2 itself and the contractors working for them share the blame.

I'm very pro high speed rail in general, but the way HS2 is being managed by our politicians and delivered by the industry is making it hard to stay enthusiastic.

Would echo comments about how things like this seem all too emblematic of wider problems with the direction the country is going and how it's being run.

It is not ridiculous at all. All our governments let the private sector supple on the teat of the tax payer until it is basically run dry. They all have conflict of interests in all sorts of construction.

Resurfacing of the A1 Wentbridge viaduct which was meant to be finished in 2023 has been delayed until August this year and will most likely go into 2026. All costing the tax payer millions if not billions in logistical delays. The A52 bypass has a bridge which isn't up to spec and the company that designed it incorrectly is expecting the council to foot the bill!

Then you have rubbish like this which is just blind robbery.

HS2 is just the tip of a massive mountain of corruption and greed.

 

[bigmike20vt]

blimey. i use the A1M and go through that region semi regularly. i had no idea.

 

[mejinks]

Total cost of £66B and Wales won't see a penny, won't see a benefit and the project was classified as an England and Wales project specifically to cut Wales out even though it has been agreed that infrastructure as a whole has been vastly underfunded by both Labour and Conservative governments. If there hasn't been the greed and corruption that is married to each and every government project, £4B would have been spent on infrastructure in Wales and had they not dropped the link up North, there would be a tiny benefit for those living around Crewe.

Happy to take taxpayer money but not spend it where it is most needed.

 

[Lyle44]

A lot is made of European / Asian countries completing these quicker, cheaper etc...Yes to both but with caveats; remember we're a small island, other countries are typically much larger, with wider flat landscapes, allowing routing to be through the middle of nowhere, we're having to route through existing infrastructure, short of purchasing complete villages and towns all over the place we can't solve that, not to mention re-routing hundreds of miles or roads. Something Brunel didn't have to contend with. Plus changes in labour laws, H&S, pay, material costs etc..

As for cheaper, Japan's 1960s bullet train system (380B yen) at modern inflated costs would be 1.8T yen / £9,244,800,000 hardly cheap! Not to mention they're facing similar extortionate costs for the latest extension programme (https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Tr...n-extension-plan-under-pressure-as-costs-soar)

A much better idea instead of this would be re-designing the east-west northern rail links, Liverpool / Manchester - Hull. At least there's action on the reinstallation of the Varsity Line.

 

[adam cool dude]

A lot is made of European / Asian countries completing these quicker, cheaper etc...Yes to both but with caveats; remember we're a small island, other countries are typically much larger, with wider flat landscapes, allowing routing to be through the middle of nowhere, we're having to route through existing infrastructure, short of purchasing complete villages and towns all over the place we can't solve that, not to mention re-routing hundreds of miles or roads. Something Brunel didn't have to contend with. Plus changes in labour laws, H&S, pay, material costs etc..

As for cheaper, Japan's 1960s bullet train system (380B yen) at modern inflated costs would be 1.8T yen / £9,244,800,000 hardly cheap! Not to mention they're facing similar extortionate costs for the latest extension programme (https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Tr...n-extension-plan-under-pressure-as-costs-soar)

A much better idea instead of this would be re-designing the east-west northern rail links, Liverpool / Manchester - Hull. At least there's action on the reinstallation of the Varsity Line.

This is the problem with our governments. They are investing everything with links to London. Leveling up other areas of the country would bring far bigger benefits as a whole.

Manchester would be a good starting point then maybe giving the Northeast some love too.

 

[bainbridge]

I heard that some of the stations are due to be finished soon.

With no railway in place, I wonder what purpose they will be put to.

HS2 is an embarrassment IMO

 

[200sols]

I heard that some of the stations are due to be finished soon.

With no railway in place, I wonder what purpose they will be put to.

HS2 is an embarrassment IMO

Not really due to be finished soon. The terminus at Euston hasn't even started yet, the tunnel boring was on hold last I heard. The station at Old Oak Common is underway and due for completion and testing etc 2029-2033. Curzon Street in Birmingham was due earlier but that was pushed back to 2029-33 as well, presumably now these dates are pushed back again..