why all the hate for hs2?

[Freakbro]

That's already happening. This isn't the only goverment project happening.

It is? Oh cool, I didn't realise there was anything planned nationally after the 21CN upgrade

 

[peterattheboro]

And remind me, how exactly will I benefit from this? I use the train perhaps once a year....

You live in Durham

I'm all for it. Not sure why they are doing it to Birmingham though because it's a ****hole but if they are going to do London > Brum > Manchester > Newcastle then that's a good idea I suppose.

I figured they'd just do London to York.

 

[4T5]

i'd imagine that anywhere within a decent radius of a station on the new line will see a fair rise as people look at new places to commute into the capital from

It'll be going 220mph+ Good luck stopping it.

 

[Jonny69]

Looking at the timescales involved, this is for a future benefit, not immediate. So people seem to be thinking that the huge costs involved have to be stumped up right now rather than be spread over the next decade. I foresee the world is going to be a very different place in a decade and London can't sustain much more growth. Any infrastructure improvements that help the growth occur in other cities (and which do not rely on the roads) can only be a benefit both economically and environmentally.

 

[MrMoonX]

Personally I think using this money to invest in a nationwide fibre broadband network would bring more benefits to the country.

Needing to travel to meetings is so 20th century....

This

£32bn to shave 30mins off a train journey, just wow, more tory fail

this won't cost £32bn it will take longer and cost more, anyway do that many people get the train from london and birmingham, surely the way train fares are its cheaper to drive and park

 

[Ricochet J]

I'm for it. But it's taken too long and a lot of red tape to get it through.

 

[doodah]

HS1 (the link between the channel tunnel and London) was delivered on time and within budget - not every major infrastructure project in this country goes the way you suggest.

I am sure that is true and would never suggest all projects in the UK go that way. I will eat my Olympic hat if this is delivered in 2026 for £17bn .

 

[233]

This

£32bn to shave 30mins off a train journey, just wow, more tory fail

hate to burst your bubble but it was a labour project, they started it before the tories came into power

 

[sven256]

For me it would have been better spent on a new fiber network or renewable energy research / installation.

As this benefits far more people and will help the country a lot more in the future.

 

[doodah]

Why are Labour mouthing off then? Or are they just toeing the opposition line?

 

[cu3ed]

This

£32bn to shave 30mins off a train journey, just wow, more tory fail

this won't cost £32bn it will take longer and cost more, anyway do that many people get the train from london and birmingham, surely the way train fares are its cheaper to drive and park

Isnt it about taking also all the poeple off the usual trians to free up space in that way, and giving poeple the direct line option ( I assume it a very populr point a to point b jouney?)...so teh time thing makes no sense, in the furutre its going to have a very real impact for the better.

 

[Stinger53]

This

£32bn to shave 30mins off a train journey, just wow, more tory fail

this won't cost £32bn it will take longer and cost more, anyway do that many people get the train from london and birmingham, surely the way train fares are its cheaper to drive and park

gotta agree, whats the point in spending soo much, to save 30mins, better of spending it on something better. like the upkeep of the current roads n train services

 

[233]

Why are Labour mouthing off then? Or are they just toeing the opposition line?

as far as i can tell labour want a different route and different cities served although they all seem to agree to this in principal

 

[Freakbro]

hate to burst your bubble but it was a labour project, they started it before the tories came into power

Which is true, but just listening to the minister deliver the statement to the house, she was trying to take all the credit for that anyway by saying how in 2007 when labour revealed their 30yr plan for the railways it did not include anything about hs2 until they reluctantly added it in later from cross party pressure

I'm sure if it goes **** up it will be all labours fault though

 

[JAzz]

I'm all for this, about time there was a bit of a shake up when it came to transportation links in this country. As always at the time seems like a rip off but in years to come the benefits will be clear.

This

£32bn to shave 30mins off a train journey, just wow, more tory fail

this won't cost £32bn it will take longer and cost more, anyway do that many people get the train from london and birmingham, surely the way train fares are its cheaper to drive and park

I'm pretty sure HS2 is actually Labour's idea....

[edit] Beaten to it!

 

[Craig1981]

Personally I think using this money to invest in a nationwide fibre broadband network would bring more benefits to the country.

Needing to travel to meetings is so 20th century....

This. Broadband speeds throughout most of Scotland are a joke. I long for decent download speeds.

 

[ubersonic]

It's been quoted as costing £32Bn

When did the last large scale government project come in on time, on budget?

It'll probably cost more like £100Bn in reality, which is money we don't really have to squander around.

And remind me, how exactly will I benefit from this? I use the train perhaps once a year....

Its been quoted as that yes, in truth it will (allegedly) cost £15.8 to £17.4 billion for the London-Birmingham link and if its then extended from Birmingham to Leeds and Manchester the whole project will rise to £32 billion.

In contrast the cost of "Upgrading existing lines from London to Birmingham instead of building the new HS2 will cost more (£20bn) and will provide only two-thirds the extra capacity of HS2" (according to Lord Adonis).

Its worth noting however that in 1988 the Eurofighter project was projected to cost £7 billion (plus planes) and ended up late and costing £37 billion (inc planes). By comparison instead of 160x Typhoons for £37 billion we could have got 160x F-22 Raptors for £15.5 billion or 160x Su T-50s for £4.96 billion.

So if the Train project follows the Eurofighters lead it will be late, cost approx £170 billion, and be inferior to cheaper options

On the plus side people said the Motorway system was silly, a waste of money and would not benefit the UK...

 

[doodah]

What is (1988) £7bn worth now? As if it was going to cost that much in the first place! No wonder the MOD have a black hole equal to their budget. I doubt the US would have sold us F-22s though.

What types of trains will they use?

 

[Morbius]

We could use a decent East to West line instead. If you want to go from Norwich to Birmingham, you have to go through London.

 

[clv101]

i see it as a major infrastructure building project that is going to get the country moving create tens of thousands of jobs and from the figures i've read be a boost to the economy overall (well long term anyway)

Or it's a vastly expensive vanity project that will be used by a few thousand people a day. If we have that kind of money to spend (which we don't but that's another story), it would be better to build a couple dozen smaller projects. Light rail like this proposal for Bristol, or dramatically improved cycling infrastructure so the UK no long languishes at the bottom of Europe's cycling league table.

Our public transport need isn't to make the London - Birmingham route a little quicker. The need is to address the millions stuck in urban traffic jams every morning and evening.

It's just a shame that lots of smaller projects, bringing benefit to more people, aren't as sexy as one big shiny project.