Caporegime
"back into"? These lads were born in the UK. They're as much British citizens as I am and (I'm assuming) you are.
*** removed *** - Will Gill
Woolwich serious incident
- Thread starter Maccapacca
- Start date
"back into"? These lads were born in the UK. They're as much British citizens as I am and (I'm assuming) you are.
*** removed *** - Will Gill
Soldato
Anyone hear that interview with Anjem Choudary on BB R4 this morning? Only caught the first couple of mins.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...-4-interview-with-anjem-choudary-9017505.html
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...-4-interview-with-anjem-choudary-9017505.html
Everything is 'racist' by reflex these days
Soldato
- Joined
- 22 Feb 2008
- Posts
- 11,108
Watch it, that's racist.
"boot him out back into"
OK awkward choice of words, the addition of "into" as in "back into the net" was meant to differ it from saying something like "boot him back" what wasn't what I intended, which was in fact 'remove from here and into another country'.
Yes of course he's British, but he's obviously hates us and our democratic system of voting out policies you don't like. We don't decapitate civil servants just because Clegg did a U turn over student funding.
Clearly he would be happier in a Sharia state with a majority of people who agree with him, I wouldn't expect him to go to Australia would I?
He's already tried to leave the UK and join a militant group in Africa but the unhelpful people sent him back here, that totally ruined his holiday
As for the usual one sided censorship by our overwhelmingly liberal thinking mod team *sigh*
- most of Africa is sandy
- some African countries have a majority muslim population
- most of Africa is unpleasant
Soldato
Perhaps we should stop blowing up families around the world then perhaps people will not have genuine reasons to retaliate? Hardly surprising.
Unfortunately the (very slight) majority of people in the UK appear to agree with the stated aims of the war.
Personally I'd much rather we spent that $13 Trillion on Science rather than pee it over that {sandy}+{Middle Eastern}+{majority muslim}+{unpleasant, backward hole}.
An Afghan peasant's view of the war will indeed only extend to seeing his relatives getting killed, that's why we have governments which we elect in order to govern in line with the bigger picture. If peasants did the ruling they would go right back to Taliban and local warlord control*
*Which is exactly what is going to happen once we leave, the Afghan army will get it's ass handed to them and the country goes right back into the dark ages (sorry, glorious caliphate state )
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Soldato
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the majority were opposed to the illegal Iraq war (the one were we were peddled lies) and war in Afghanistan.
I agree with you I would have wished that amount of money was spent on science or something useful rather than on bombs and drones blowing up children in foreign lands (but I guess some must quench that lust for blood). Just imagine the pain the mother of this serving soldier has gone through and times that by 100,000s of deaths we as a nation are responsible for. It is not surprising some would lash out back at our nation for these heinous crimes.
Hold on a minute "we have governments which we elect" but because the majority of Afghans are poor (or peasants as you nicely put it) they should not be able to choose a government of their choosing which by the looks of it is the Taliban.
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I would have thought so too, but it appears to be 50:50 again
Culture comes into this, Afghan people are compensated for deaths so I'm wondering in culturally we are applying the same value to life here? China aborts loads of babies, America hangs people, cultures are different.
Often the first response is to send all their other sons to join the Taliban and perpetuate the conflict. It doesn't seem to dawn on any of them that we just want them to stop shooting and elect another corrupt government, so we can get the hell out of their stupid, backward country and back home for tea and cake.
A writer once suggested if a drone strike hit an American wedding they'd ground the fleet.
Did Poland/France complain when we liberated them during WWII but killed a bunch of civilians? We even shafted them after the war too ._.
With the expected intimidation and peasant narrow self interest that is what I think will happen, the Russians have been there before us and nothing changed then either. It's all a colossal waste of money on a culture that's never going to change.
$13 Trillion would have bought us Fusion power and their oil would become irrelevant.
What surprises me is the complete absence of a muslim political party in the UK, if you don't like something, stand up and say so.
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Soldato
I would have thought so too, but it appears to be 50:50 again
Everything I have seen suggests it was more against than for. On the other hand it would also mean those who were for bare some responsibility for these reactions.
I'd think it is fair to say, that pretty much, the pain of losing a loved one is a universal one.
Send, or choose? I would also think that is a natural reaction not exclusive to Afghanis. Perhaps they don't share your ideals and want justice to be served however it may be. I don't think many would play ball with the wishes of a murderer who has just wiped out your entire family, so they (the murderer) can go home for some tea. (them awfully nice people just want tea and cake)
Perhaps we should recognise life is precious where ever it is.
Yes that really is the same, not.
Perhaps we should stop trying to change cultures? Poor people thinking about themselves, who would have thought.
It's a universal issue not tied to Muslims, proven by the fact the majority of this nation are opposed to these wars our elected governments take us to. We stand together as people rather than our individual races or religion.
[TW]Fox;25517541 said:
Marine A knowingly broke the rules of engagement, LOAC and his orders. He is a disgrace both to the Royal Marines and to himself...what he did was in my subjective opinion actually worse (not implying that either have any mitigation at all here) than the murderers of Lee Rigby did because he was trained to know better and act better. The murderers of Lee Rigby were just idiots indoctrinated by peer and media pressure into thinking they were warriors fighting oppression, when in fact they were acting out a fantasy.
They both deserve to be incarcerated for the rest of their natural lives (unless they can be realistically rehabilitated, which I doubt)...Marine A also got what he deserved, despite various internet and facebook campaigns to the contrary.
I think it's something to do with a culture of an eye for an eye, when really the only rational thing to do when faced with a Superpower is to do what the Superpower says so it will go home. France rolled over, preserved its culture and got it all back when Germany went home. Vietnam resisted, the US slaughtered some half million. France - win, Afghan/Iraq/Vietnam - retarded.
Fighting a Superpower is retarded unless you have some inherent cultural defect about martyrdom.
I agree, it appears to be only the West that doesn't understand that Islam is fundamentally incompatible with our concept of Democracy.
Just so long as they can vote in another backwards Theocratic Fascist state and go back to beheading Christians for giggles, that's all is required by these countries.
We probably need sources if you are going to say this position is proven, I couldn't point to anything reliable one way or another.
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Do you really think Marine A is beyond rehabilitation?
As for being worse, really? I understand that it was against everything he'd been trained to do but the man was almost certainly dying anyway. He'd just been shot by a gunship after all.
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Marine A will be eligible for Parole after 10 years. People are calling for full life terms for the murderers of Lee Rigby.
Yes worse..the action by Marine A, because of who he was and his responsibility raises the level at which we should judge such actions. I think he is a total and utter disgrace to his uniform and others who have died wearing it. I'm more disgusted by his actions than I am those of the murderers of Lee Rigby...like I said I am not mitigating the actions of either or lessening the horrific way in which Lee Rigby was murdered either..only judging the actions of the individual from the perspective of that individuals responsibility, not the actual actions themselves.
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I understand completely that what he did was illegal and the sentence was just, but in a war against irregular fighters if you let them go they're just going to come back and kill you tomorrow. What are you supposed to do about that?
Edit: Out of interest if they'd just left the man there to die what would have happened?
Edit: Out of interest if they'd just left the man there to die what would have happened?
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You don't kill them, you either let them go or they become POW and all the rights that accords them...simply executing them, as Marine A did makes you no better than they are. ROC and LOAC exists for a reason.
He was a soldier, not an executioner.
He should have been medical assistance and appropriate action taken as regards his disposition as a POW depending upon the exact situation on the ground.
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In principle we should apply the same ethics to the Police when they are caught doing something bent, in practice we don't really.
I've only seen documentaries on this war and I don't know what this guy's experiences have been, but if I'd had my friends killed by IEDs and sniper fire with the tacit support of the population, then I would not be entirely respectful of the rules of warfare either.
I'd also like to hold up such principles as being good and proper, but it appears to me that everyone is damaged by war whether they make it out alive or not. I can't see that it fair to expect 100% rational and fair conduct from anyone in a warzone, all the time.
And yet Soldiers do it every single day.