XIM2 or 3 for xbox 360

[Bevysters]

No different to when I'm using surround sound to play, I can still hear people from all directions. If they are using ninja it doesn't matter what headset you are using.

You can still hear ninja with astros although the volume needs to be up a bit more and its not really footsteps your listening for so valid either way tbh.

I agree with demon, although I might not like these devices coming along they are no different to the advantages given to people using wheels on f1 or arcade sticks. I wouldn't buy one but I wouldn't mind a go with one to see how good it is in comparison. That video did nothing for me I watch my nephew play quick scope and he hits people like that anyway. I'd like to see how good it is using other weapons.

Its massively different in terms of being fair compared to someone using a steering wheel or arcade stick. Could you imagine playing an rts with a controller against someone using a mouse. Even for fps games its the insane level of instant precision it gives with the added auto aim that makes it complete bull playing against anyone using one of these.

If you play F1 or GT on standard settings you will find its a pretty level field steering wheel wise and as for the idea of the arcade stick I agree with kreeee completely we played sf2thdr last night and i beat him occasionally using the controller and he beat me with the arcade stick but it came down to experience and me constantly jumping and using light attacks and grapples with cammy. But still you see what i mean.

£50 says you can't get those kills with a steering wheel

Could manage a few knife kills Can you aim with a manual gearstick lol

A claim you just cannot back up I doubt all the people in the street fighter thread bought Arcade sticks to put into arcades or comfort, they got it because the 360 pad is rubbish for those types of games. Clearly you cannot deny that.

Its not the best but it just about holds it own with a bit of patience although there was the sf4 controllers that were reasonably comfy to use. a lot of people get the sticks because its what they know and they are comfortable to use and pretty cool aswell when made with decent parts. It all comes down to personal preference.

 

[TheGamingGeneral]

Where exactly do you draw the line? If we consider that a wheel in a racing game, doesnt make you better, but for me, it certainly makes it easier to atain a certain level of performance, say, a 1:30 lap of suzuka in F1 2010 vs 1:40 on a pad.

It isnt deemed you are cheating in this example surely?

Contrast that with a pad vs m+kb for an FPS. I'd be lucky to have a postive K : D on a console FPS, I ******* hate the pad for FPS. But with a M+kb I manage a 3:1 for example. That is cheating?

So at what point does it become cheating?

You can then start to look at it mathmatically. If someone is 10% better using a wheel in Forza 3 vs a pad, that is acceptable. If someone is 50% better at using a m+kb on an FPS vs a pad, that isnt? At what point does it go from being acceptable to a cheat?

 

[dannyjo22]

That's quite a different topic, as the 360 pad is the exception, rather than the "cheat device".

We are talking about one tool that artificially boosts performance, not one that is sub par.

It's not a different topic at all, how about just answering the question?

What's the better device for playing fighting games, an Arcade stick or the 360 gaming pad?

It doesn't matter that the 360 game pad is sub par for fighting games, you are still gaining an advantage by using a stick over the pad.

Exactly the same as wheel users over pad users for F1 2010.

All will be used to gain an advantage.

 

[Demon]

That's quite a different topic, as the 360 pad is the exception, rather than the "cheat device".

We are talking about one tool that artificially boosts performance, not one that is sub par.

People I know that have spent good money on arcade sticks certainly are very vocal about how gimped the 360 pad is, and how disadvantaged they feel it is. They also are quite vocal about how the classic arcade button layout allows them much better combo control and other such stuff, but it might all be just justifacatory twaddle to cover the cost of purchase..

I can't comment myself, I just get my ass kicked on SFIV no matter what I use..

 

[orderoftheflame]

Where exactly do you draw the line? If we consider that a wheel in a racing game, doesnt make you better, but for me, it certainly makes it easier to atain a certain level of performance, say, a 1:30 lap of suzuka in F1 2010 vs 1:40 on a pad.

It isnt deemed you are cheating in this example surely?

Contrast that with a pad vs m+kb for an FPS. I'd be lucky to have a postive K : D on a console FPS, I ******* hate the pad for FPS. But with a M+kb I manage a 3:1 for example. That is cheating?

So at what point does it become cheating?

You can then start to look at it mathmatically. If someone is 10% better using a wheel in Forza 3 vs a pad, that is acceptable. If someone is 50% better at using a m+kb on an FPS vs a pad, that isnt? At what point does it go from being acceptable to a cheat?

Maths nothing. Forza is programmed to work with a steering wheel.

FPS games on consoles are programmed to work with a pad alone, hence why console games get an amount of snap aiming compared to PC versions, in order to compensate for the difficulty in aiming.

Using a mouse and keyboard with snap aiming is cheating, end of. It's no different to using a tuned down aim-bot.

The amount of acceleration and accuracy given by a mouse is a massive unfair advantage over pad players.
With a pad, the amount of time it takes to start turning, turn, and stop turning is finite based on sensitivity, with a mouse it's as fast as your arm can move.

The only reason devices like these aren't banned is that they're undetectable due to the way they work, otherwise they'd be no reason to develop the XIM to work through a modified controller.

It's not a different topic at all, how about just answering the question?

It's completely different when the games are designed to work with peripherals. If a game designed to support a M+K game out (for example UT3 on PS3) it's a different story.

Not to mention that the advantage between a pad and a stick is nothing compared to the difference to a M+K.

 

[Demon]

It's completely different when the games are designed to work with peripherals. If a game designed to support a M+K game out (for example UT3 on PS3) it's a different story.

Not to mention that the advantage between a pad and a stick is nothing compared to the difference to a M+K.

I am not that fussed whether a game is designed for a specific peripheral or not, if that peripheral gives any advantage, it's still an advantage, why would the disadvantaged accept it any more?

However, I agree, the XIM seemingly offers quite a reasonable advantage, and I understand why people think it's cheating. However I temper that with DannyJo's comments about F1 2010, the level of advantage a wheel gives is quite large as well, but because it's an officially supported controller it would seem many in this thread are happy to accept that? I just see it as inevitable that some forms of control are better in some situations, and if you want to be that competitive, you will buy the 'kit' that elevates you a little, Surround sound headset/better pad/steeringwheel and I guess XIM.

 

[Kreeeee]

It's not a different topic at all, how about just answering the question?

What's the better device for playing fighting games, an Arcade stick or the 360 gaming pad?

It doesn't matter that the 360 game pad is sub par for fighting games, you are still gaining an advantage by using a stick over the pad.

Exactly the same as wheel users over pad users for F1 2010.

All will be used to gain an advantage.

"Lol" is about the only response I can give to this post. I think we're done here.

People I know that have spent good money on arcade sticks certainly are very vocal about how gimped the 360 pad is, and how disadvantaged they feel it is. They also are quite vocal about how the classic arcade button layout allows them much better combo control and other such stuff, but it might all be just justifacatory twaddle to cover the cost of purchase..

I can't comment myself, I just get my ass kicked on SFIV no matter what I use..

It's more comfortable, certainly, and allows them to play for longer periods of time with less strain. In that respect it allows them to become better players quicker (I'm assuming these guys are all onlinewarriors and haven't entered any tournaments?), and a pad will feel gimped onece they are used to a stick. Just like a stick feels horrible when you first use it as you're used to a pad.. But... if a pad is comfortable to you then there is nothing holding you back from being equal to any stick player with a pad.

 

[Bevysters]

I am not that fussed whether a game is designed for a specific peripheral or not, if that peripheral gives any advantage, it's still an advantage, why would the disadvantaged accept it any more?

However, I agree, the XIM seemingly offers quite a reasonable advantage, and I understand why people think it's cheating. However I temper that with DannyJo's comments about F1 2010, the level of advantage a wheel gives is quite large as well, but because it's an officially supported controller it would seem many in this thread are happy to accept that? I just see it as inevitable that some forms of control are better in some situations, and if you want to be that competitive, you will buy the 'kit' that elevates you a little, Surround sound headset/better pad/steeringwheel and I guess XIM.

I always thought it was about wanting a generally authentic gaming experience myself......

 

[orderoftheflame]

I am not that fussed whether a game is designed for a specific peripheral or not, if that peripheral gives any advantage, it's still an advantage, why would the disadvantaged accept it any more?

Sorry, but I think the advantage for a Wheel or stick is minimal compared to the difference created by an XIM.

With a wheel or a stick, a bad player is still a bad player. If you don't understand to follow the racing line, or you don't know any moves, you still suck. You're still limited to how fast your car can turn, or the speed at which you can react.

With an XIM a bad player should easily do better than a pad player because of auto-aim assists that the game provides for pad players, and the fact that their accuracy does not degrade as they increase their sensitivity for speed..

 

[Bevysters]

Sorry, but I think the advantage for a Wheel or stick is minimal compared to the difference created by an XIM.

With a wheel or a stick, a bad player is still a bad player. If don't understand to follow the racing line, or you don't know any moves, you still suck. You're still limited to how fast your car can turn, or the speed at which you can react.

With an XIM a bad player should easily do better than a pad player because of auto-aim assists that the game provides for pad players, and the fact that there accuracy does not degrade as they increase their sensitivity for speed..

You ever feel like her beating a dead horse? Your spot on btw

 

[dannyjo22]

"Lol" is about the only response I can give to this post. I think we're done here.

Yeah you were 'done' when you couldn't answer the questions in the first place. Clearly I've learnt my lesson not to debate points with someone without the intelligence to come up with a more convincing point than lol.

Lesson learnt.

 

[dannyjo22]

Sorry, but I think the advantage for a Wheel or stick is minimal compared to the difference created by an XIM.

With a wheel or a stick, a bad player is still a bad player. If you don't understand to follow the racing line, or you don't know any moves, you still suck. You're still limited to how fast your car can turn, or the speed at which you can react.

With an XIM a bad player should easily do better than a pad player because of auto-aim assists that the game provides for pad players, and the fact that their accuracy does not degrade as they increase their sensitivity for speed..

Understood, you would have to see the advantage the wheel gives you in f1 2010 to be able to appreciate the similarity in the debate. I would have normally agreed with you 100% until now I'd say if anything in driving games the pad had the advantage. This game though is a completely different story as though the game was designed around the wheel and the pad is secondary. A huge advantage.

We know the pad is nowhere near as good as an arcade stick for fighting games (360) as has been said the only discussion is how much of an advantage is too much.

 

[orderoftheflame]

Understood, you would have to see the advantage the wheel gives you in f1 2010 to be able to appreciate the similarity in the debate. I would have normally agreed with you 100% until now I'd say if anything in driving games the pad had the advantage. This game though is a completely different story as though the game was designed around the wheel and the pad is secondary. A huge advantage.

We know the pad is nowhere near as good as an arcade stick for fighting games (360) as has been said the only discussion is how much of an advantage is too much.

I've seen the difference between a pad and wheel on F1 2010 (on the PC at least, but there's no difference) but I still don't see it as remotely comparable to this.

 

[Demon]

Sorry, but I think the advantage for a Wheel or stick is minimal compared to the difference created by an XIM.

With a wheel or a stick, a bad player is still a bad player. If you don't understand to follow the racing line, or you don't know any moves, you still suck. You're still limited to how fast your car can turn, or the speed at which you can react.

With an XIM a bad player should easily do better than a pad player because of auto-aim assists that the game provides for pad players, and the fact that their accuracy does not degrade as they increase their sensitivity for speed..

to be fair, I may be underestimating the impact of XIM, but your argument about bad players also applies to the XIM, Just because they have a mouse doesnt turn them into uber players, there is much more to an FPS then aiming.

Its not that Im remotely saying the xim usnt a reasonable advantage, I just see disparity with normal games and official control methods happeneing all over the place, and pragmatically, the only reason to be against it is on grounds of its competitiveness,which if its that important, then you can use it yourself. In the same way that in F1 2010, if you want to be competitive in the leaderboards, you are invariably much better off using the wheel.

To answer someone else, A wheel can be about wanting an authentic experience, thats not the argument here, which is about fairness. I actually always use a wheel, even when it disadvatages me.

This is just my opinion, which is perfectly valid, I just dont moan because my favourite/chosen control method is suddenly disadvantaged, If it bothered me that much, Id get an xim myself and kick their asses.. (If I had the skill to do it)

 

[orderoftheflame]

to be fair, I may be underestimating the impact of XIM, but your argument about bad players also applies to the XIM, Just because they have a mouse doesnt turn them into uber players, there is much more to an FPS then aiming.

I agree there's a lot more to FPS than just the control method, but it is the core gameplay. For every encounter against a mouse and keyboard you win because of superior tactics or better use of sound, you'll get a straight confrontation where none of that matters and you'll lose because you can't react with a controller with the same precision and speed as a mouse..

Microsoft attempted cross-platform gaming and the results they found caused them to scrap it pretty quickly. Even the worst M+K players were destroying the best pad players. And this is without the aim assists that XIM players benefit from.

Sood says that Microsoft even pitted "mediocre" PC gamers against "the best" console gamers in testing, and the results were unchanged: the keyboard and mouse prevailed.

http://www.techspot.com/news/39738-...because-pc-gamers-wrecked-console-gamers.html

If the worst M+K players are winning against the best pad players. What happens when you get a good M+K user playing?
I think the video before summed up the ridiculousness of that pretty well, they become pretty hard to beat in a standard 1v1 encounter.

Id get an xim myself and kick their asses.. (If I had the skill to do it)

At $204 each? You can buy an Xbox for that much. Why should anyone have to spend that kind of money to be able to play a game they've bought on the same level as some people.

One of the best selling points of consoles is the even playing field they create imo.

 

[pinkacidbootson]

I think there's going to be a UK distributor for the XIM3 when its released (the place that's like a lemon type fruit)

I'm stumped. Limes?

 

[Zensuji]

Sounds about right.

 

[Macky]

Apparently Black Ops has the ability to turn aim assist off so we may start seeing some people who are actually good. I for one will be turning it off.

 

[craptakular]

is a steering wheel a hack? Is a Guitar Hero guitar a hack when playing that? What about the mic in Lips?

Are 3rd party xbox 360 pad clones a hack?

Is having a bigger screen over someone else hacking? is maxing my brightness hacking? is having 5.1 DD hacking?

I'll consider buying one of these adapters, they seem awesome!

 

[craptakular]

I've seen the difference between a pad and wheel on F1 2010 (on the PC at least, but there's no difference) but I still don't see it as remotely comparable to this.

play a proper racer like rfactor, iracing and live for speed