EBD ban.

Duke · 21 Jun 2011 at 14:30

I expect the lower teams are pushing for this to be banned, as it will cost them a lot to keep developing it when most of them are so far behind on it already. Should have been done before/after the season though really.

DBT85 · 21 Jun 2011 at 16:00

from Renault technical director James Allison via Autosport

"The FIA's note will cause all teams, whether or not they use a blown floor, to change their operation," said Allison.

"The headline changes for the Silverstone GP are as follows: when the driver lifts his foot fully off the throttle pedal, then the ECU maps must be set up so that the engine [to all intents and purposes] closes the throttle - previously it was possible to configure the engine maps to leave the throttle open and reduce the engine power by other means.

"Furthermore, when the driver lifts fully off the throttle, the ECU maps must be configured to cut off the fuel supply to the engine – this is intended to prevent so called 'hot blowing' where the energy of the exhaust gas is increased by combustion."

Allison, whose team pioneered the radical forward-exit exhausts this year, conceded it was difficult to know how the changes will affect the performance of its car.

"It is not easy to judge the effect of this change on our competitiveness. The loss for each blown floor car will come from two separate effects – how much downforce will you lose and, in addition, how much will the loss of this downforce upset the balance of the car.

"All blown floor cars will lose downforce under braking as a result of these new restrictions. Some teams will lose more and some teams less; it is hard to know exactly what relative loss LRGP will suffer.

"However, it is possible that we will suffer less on the balance shift side of the equation because our forward exit exhausts produce their effect quite near the middle of the car. This means that as the exhaust blow waxes and wanes, it does not really disturb the aero balance of the car too much.

"With a rearward blower, the downforce from the exhaust is all generated at the rear axle. As the new rules reduce the blowing effect on corner entry much more than corner exit, it is possible that the rearward blowers will tend to suffer more nervousness under braking and more understeer on exit as a result of the new restrictions. We will find out in Silverstone."

"We would have preferred the status quo to remain for the rest of the season," Allison added.

Glaucus · 21 Jun 2011 at 16:03

All though I don't think it should have been banned in season.

I can't wait for silverstone. Itll be interesting to see how each team reacts. Although as I said before i still expect RBR dominance.

dannyjo22 · 21 Jun 2011 at 16:08

I personally feel if the FIA want to change the goal posts mid season they should offer up a test session prior to the race where it happens.

I will laugh from silverstone to xmas if Red Bulls race pace in relation to the rest causes a bigger gap, so instead of scoring 1st and where ever Webbers been finishing they start locking down 1st and 2nd every race.

sunama · 21 Jun 2011 at 16:34

AcidHell2 said:
I can't wait for silverstone. Itll be interesting to see how each team reacts. Although as I said before i still expect RBR dominance.

And that my friend is why the FIA love to tinker and change things if/when they see fit.

Like you, I too am looking forward to Silverstone, if only to see how the cars do after the regulation change.

This unpredictability adds to the excitement.

Another thing I thought about, with regards to mid-season changes is that if the FIA make changes mid-season, it gets F1 in the newspapers, as the initial story will first get published and then subsequently teams give their opinions on the change, leading to further column inches. This leads to press coverage and increases the profile of the sport. Of course, I could just be getting cynical.

sunama · 21 Jun 2011 at 16:35

dannyjo22 said:
I will laugh from silverstone to xmas if Red Bulls race pace in relation to the rest causes a bigger gap, ...

This would be an amusing scenario.

Duke · 21 Jun 2011 at 17:02

I'm going to Friday practice at Silverstone, so will see how much they are moving around in the corners now

Tweaker · 21 Jun 2011 at 17:32

I think it will be interesting to see how teams will react in terms of new parts for Silverstone, with a change in rules, plus potential experimental parts going on, it will be interesting to see if the top 10 in Q3 are a mix bag. But we all know the dream is to see a British driver win Silverstone, hopefully we will see McLaren turn it up to 11 and show RBR what 2 British world champions can do

DBT85 · 21 Jun 2011 at 18:33

Tweaker said:
But we all know the dream is to see a British driver win Silverstone, hopefully we will see McLaren turn it up to 11 and show RBR what 2 British world champions can do

Well, "the internet" says crash into everyone and not drive fast enough unless its wet so who knows lol.

Really hoping for a strong McLaren run but I doubt RBR are finished despite the rule changes.

CaptainRAVE · 21 Jun 2011 at 18:49

Hoping this finally gets rid of RBR's advantage.

dannyjo22 · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:14

CaptainRAVE said:
Hoping this finally gets rid of RBR's advantage.

Really, that's how you want to see Red Bull get beaten? Keep changing the rules into you get them. They didn't break any rules, they built a car within the rules by spending money to develope a car. They have too much of an advantage so change the rules.

This isn't suppose to be Wrestling.

What about all this cost cutting that they are supposed to be doing. This is hardly going to be cheap.

If this was happening to mclaren people on here would be in uproar. Funny how they can leave the F duct alone and double decker diffuser until the end of the season but this get's tackled now.

Skeeter · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:15

Hang on.

Theres a fundamental thing that has been missed here. I thought parc ferme rules meant you couldn't make any major chances to a cars setup at all between the start of qualifying and the start of the race? Short of tyre pressures and wing angles, there little the teams can do. How has something as sophisticated as engine mapping been allowed so far anyway? With the standard ECU it would be easily policed? Are the FIA patching yet another hole in their regulations?

I'm more shocked to hear that qualifying only engine maps were even allowed in the first place, rather than the fact they are being banned. Red Bull advantage or not, it looks like an oversight by the FIA in my eyes.

Glaucus · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:15

I Am in uproar about it.

dannyjo22 · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:30

Skeeter said:
Hang on.

Theres a fundamental thing that has been missed here. I thought parc ferme rules meant you couldn't make any major chances to a cars setup at all between the start of qualifying and the start of the race?.

Pure guesswork because I'm not totally upto what they are allowed to do with the ECU maps but I'm guessing they aren't touching it in parc ferme. Run the Qualifying lap on setting no1 selected on the steering wheel for example and switch it to the race setting on the in lap?

It's must be selectable from the steering wheel because Brawn had that special setting radio call and didn't he say that was a map for a certain cicumstance?

Isn't the map then locked for a certain number of laps on the start so they don't run a special setting for launch control?

So it can't be a loophole if they already had a ruling locking you into a map for the start of a gp??

CaptainRAVE · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:38

The fact is, all teams will be under the same new rule. If it affects RBR more than any other team, I do not have a problem with it.

Like many ideas before it, it was very clever, but now the FIA have decided it is against the rules. Hard luck really.

Skeeter · 21 Jun 2011 at 20:40

The changing maps on the wheel is nothing new, and its just one of a selection of maps. What they talk about it reloading maps using a laptop which I assume means a complete remap.

The fact anyone is getting anywhere near an ECU with a laptop between Qualifying and the Race confuses me.

But yes, there may be the potential to have one of their maps on the steering wheel set to the Qualifying mode, and then switch it off. I don't think they could stop the teams changing engine settings from within the car, as they are used to cope with varying track conditions and fuel levels, etc.

DBT85 · 21 Jun 2011 at 21:15

Skeeter said:
But yes, there may be the potential to have one of their maps on the steering wheel set to the Qualifying mode, and then switch it off. I don't think they could stop the teams changing engine settings from within the car, as they are used to cope with varying track conditions and fuel levels, etc.

This was my question earlier. Are the dials on the wheel not used to change the map and in fact just used for changing the max rpm, fuel mix etc?

CaptainRAVE · 21 Jun 2011 at 21:22

It will be interesting to see the impact on RBR following this. If they suddenly lose all of their pace, it will certainly throw last years championship into question.

I really dislike the FIA, they make up the rules as they feel like it.

Tweaker · 21 Jun 2011 at 21:30

CaptainRAVE said:
It will be interesting to see the impact on RBR following this. If they suddenly lose all of their pace, it will certainly throw last years championship into question.

I really dislike the FIA, they make up the rules as they feel like it.

I suppose the question is whether they are making up rules to suit the fans, or closing loopholes. It is said time and time again that F1 engineers are clever and push the rules to the limits, there seems to be a fine line between tightening the rule book and making a new rule to create excitement.

dannyjo22 · 21 Jun 2011 at 21:39

CaptainRAVE said:
Like many ideas before it, it was very clever, but now the FIA have decided it is against the rules. Hard luck really.

It's not hard luck, it's try to influence the outcome of the result. Lets say Mclaren next year develope a perfectly legal part that gives them 50% better fuel economy. The FIA allow the method until Mclaren is leading the title by 100 points. Then they decide it's still not illegal but they change the rules to make it illegal.

That's not hard luck, thats re-writing the rules to suit. Whats the point of developing anything that gives you an advantage if it gets taken away from you if you are dominant.

F1 might as well become a single spec series.

CaptainRAVE said:
It will be interesting to see the impact on RBR following this. If they suddenly lose all of their pace, it will certainly throw last years championship into question.

I really dislike the FIA, they make up the rules as they feel like it.

How does it impact last years title or even this years. They haven't broken any rules, they haven't been caught cheating. The rule book has changed to make it illegal. Just the same as the DD diffuser was banned at the end of 09 it didn't mean it impacted on the legitamacy of the Brawn world championships.

I find it harder to accept a title now won by someone else, as they banned something previously legal to try to change the outcome.

Trying to rig the results.