Tesla Model X P100D

Jonnycoupe · 3 Mar 2019 at 16:13

Desmo said:
The S handles surprisingly well. The last guy in a 911 who tried to lose me just couldn't...and this was on some very nice windy and twisty back roads. Now I'm not stupid enough to think that a Model S handles as well as a 911, but put two average (or even slightly better than average) drivers in the cars and you'll be surprised at how close it would be.

You were quoting a reference to the I-PACE as the eco choice rather than an S. Not sure why Masher edited it?

Desmo · 3 Mar 2019 at 19:46

Jonnycoupe said:
You were quoting a reference to the I-PACE as the eco choice rather than an S. Not sure why Masher edited it?

Ah right, assumed he was still talking Tesla.

McPhee · 4 Mar 2019 at 01:08

Nasher said:
A comparable priced petrol performance car will be genuinely quick, not just at the traffic lights. Which you can only do a few times before you need to let the motors/batteries cool.

The cooling was completely redesigned on the Model 3. From what I've read, it doesn't seem to suffer the same issues as the S and the X, and is capable of more than just quarter-mile drag races. Telsa have been working on a "Track Mode" for it over the past few months, with interesting results:

www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2019/tesla-model-3-performance-track-mode-release-version-review

https://www.insideevs.com/video-tesla-model-3-performance-track-challenge

However these aren't long tracks. It'll be interesting to see what happens when someone tries Nürburgring, as that's where the S was utterly humiliated (low power after a third of a lap).

Ten years ago, who would have thought this would even be a conversation? We're a long way from the old milk float stereotype now

Jonnycoupe · 4 Mar 2019 at 03:57

Model 3 is also 21700 cells rather than the 18650 format.

Nuremburg is a totally different place to where you are thinking...

ahar · 4 Mar 2019 at 05:34

Had a poke around a model X at the weekend. Looks so bland, like a large Citroen MPV. For that cash there are so many better options.

Model 3 price point I can see works, though lack of chargers for my typical long trips mean it'll be ICE for me for a while.

McPhee · 4 Mar 2019 at 07:24

Jonnycoupe said:
Nuremburg is a totally different place to where you are thinking...

The joys of autocorrect :rolleyes:

pioneer2000 · 4 Mar 2019 at 07:28

ahar said:
Had a poke around a model X at the weekend. Looks so bland, like a large Citroen MPV. For that cash there are so many better options.

Model 3 price point I can see works, though lack of chargers for my typical long trips mean it'll be ICE for me for a while.

Like?

Desmo · 4 Mar 2019 at 07:29

It's funny how a lot of people see the cars as bland....that was a big plus for me. I like the "plain" styling, I didn't want anything too brash, flash or in your face. I also love the minimalist interiors. I jump in the wife's A6 and there's buttons and knobs everywhere...starts to fry my brain now.

Nasher · 4 Mar 2019 at 08:12

satchef1 said:
The cooling was completely redesigned on the Model 3. From what I've read, it doesn't seem to suffer the same issues as the S and the X, and is capable of more than just quarter-mile drag races. Telsa have been working on a "Track Mode" for it over the past few months, with interesting results:

www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2019/tesla-model-3-performance-track-mode-release-version-review

https://www.insideevs.com/video-tesla-model-3-performance-track-challenge

However these aren't long tracks. It'll be interesting to see what happens when someone tries Nürburgring, as that's where the S was utterly humiliated (low power after a third of a lap).

Ten years ago, who would have thought this would even be a conversation? We're a long way from the old milk float stereotype now

Not just the Nürburgring afaik, it struggled on much smaller tracks too :/

For the Nürburgring I think it will be a long time before we see the light, high power to weight ICE cars knocked off the top. EVs just aren't quick in the corners yet.

Jonnycoupe · 4 Mar 2019 at 08:22

You missed the NIO EP9?

https://www.evo.co.uk/electric-cars...rcar-specs-details-and-n-rburgring-lap-record

The fact they have the potential for full 4 wheel positive/negative torque control is quite something.

jpaul · 4 Mar 2019 at 08:22

austere (amish?) interior - to what degree is interior design a function of budget and disproportionate drivetrain/battery costs versus an ICE design.
( cant't find an answer here say https://cleantechnica.com/2018/07/22/peeking-behind-teslas-cost-of-materials-curtain/ )

Desmo · 4 Mar 2019 at 08:32

@Nasher ...I like your deleted post I got through on email

I can see why you edited the post...what a load of guff

Nasher · 4 Mar 2019 at 08:33

Jonnycoupe said:
You missed the NIO EP9?

https://www.evo.co.uk/electric-cars...rcar-specs-details-and-n-rburgring-lap-record

The fact they have the potential for full 4 wheel positive/negative torque control is quite something.

Yea but it's not road legal and needs it's own pit crew

Might as well use an F1 car and smash the record.

bimbleuk · 4 Mar 2019 at 09:00

Assuming Tesla are going to integrate super capacitors fairly quickly then you can reclaim a lot more energy from braking and reuse that on the next straight. Should help to shrink the battery pack and cooling requirements with the resulting reduction in weight. So I can see some exciting developments happening in a fairly short period of time.

ahar · 4 Mar 2019 at 09:02

pioneer2000 said:
Like?

Depends on requirement.

For me and my requirements, if it had to be EV and SUV like, I'd get a Jag ipace and something small and light to have fun with (like my Caterham, or an Elise), and still have change from the likely £100k a model X costs.

If not an SUV, there are plenty of EV or hybrids at much lower cost (like Tesla's own model S) that are far cheaper. And look much better.

If it didn't have to be an EV, then maybe an E class estate, and a kick ass Caterham for fun, and still not spent £100k!

pioneer2000 · 4 Mar 2019 at 09:09

ahar said:
Depends on requirement.

For me and my requirements, if it had to be EV and SUV like, I'd get a Jag ipace and something small and light to have fun with (like my Caterham, or an Elise), and still have change from the likely £100k a model X costs.

If not an SUV, there are plenty of EV or hybrids at much lower cost (like Tesla's own model S) that are far cheaper. And look much better.

If it didn't have to be an EV, then maybe an E class estate, and a kick ass Caterham for fun, and still not spent £100k!

Eh? The long range model X is £80k, so not sure where all that change is coming from over an I-pace.

Even the ludricous model x is only £90k.

An e-class estate is a totally different vehicle, might as well just say you could get a ford transit instead.

Desmo · 4 Mar 2019 at 10:35

And isn't the iPace more like a general 4 door saloon inside? It's in no way comparable to the Model X in vehicle class.

ahar · 4 Mar 2019 at 15:46

Jag call it an SUV, as do the motoring press.

Price wise, model X is 90k for longer range plus options so around 100k .I pace is 65k plus options so 75k. 20k for Caterham, 5 k change.

On the other stuff, like I said it depends on requirements. Substitutes in buying a car are not just within a narrow defined category, nor are they specifically one to one . If the requirement is to waft around in luxury with lots of passenger and boot space with a great badge, then the model X has to compete against all sorts of cars, not just SUV.

If the requirement is SUV and has to be pure EV then the number of competitors is lower, but I suspect few people will have requirements that specific where the model X is the answer.

Joe T · 4 Mar 2019 at 17:15

ahar said:
Jag call it an SUV, as do the motoring press.

Price wise, model X is 90k for longer range plus options so around 100k

Now only £80k

pioneer2000 · 4 Mar 2019 at 17:34

ahar said:
Jag call it an SUV, as do the motoring press.

Price wise, model X is 90k for longer range plus options so around 100k .I pace is 65k plus options so 75k. 20k for Caterham, 5 k change.

On the other stuff, like I said it depends on requirements. Substitutes in buying a car are not just within a narrow defined category, nor are they specifically one to one . If the requirement is to waft around in luxury with lots of passenger and boot space with a great badge, then the model X has to compete against all sorts of cars, not just SUV.

If the requirement is SUV and has to be pure EV then the number of competitors is lower, but I suspect few people will have requirements that specific where the model X is the answer.

This is the problem lately, the level of knowledge is lacking and the ill informed are making sweeping statements about Tesla without understanding the facts of the matter.

The model X long range is £80k with the premium package and autopilot. The equivalent I-pace is around £75k for a similar spec.

If you want to compare to non-SUV then the model S must be used. In the 4 door saloon segment once again much like the mode X argument, there aren’t many offerings from other manufacturers that can compare on a price/performance/efficiency/technology level.

The model 3 does the same at the compact executive car bracket. The roadster will do the same again for the supercar segment.

Electric is the future and the traditional manufacturers are struggling to compete.