AMD RX 3000 series

jigger · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:37

Gibbo said:
It won't happen, AMD don't have that kind of money to bleed. VEGA lost them enough, they can't do it again.

I also know the costings on GDDR6 so I know those prices in the video are an absolute PIPE DREAM. Unless AMD plan to sell at huge losses, its totally not reality.

How much is 8gb of GDDR6?

RavenXXX2 · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:38

AMD CEO said she is gonna shake things up big time, she has done that with CPUs now it's time to rock that GPU boat. 7nm navi with GDDR6 will bring high end gaming to the masses, who is interest in Vega 64 performance at £400-500 in 2019.

Nexus18 · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:39

RavenXXX2 said:
AMD CEO said she is gonna shake things up big time, she has done that with CPUs now it's time to rock that GPU boat. 7nm navi with GDDR6 will bring high end gaming to the masses, who is interest in Vega 64 performance at £400-500 in 2019.

Same question could be asked for 290 owners in 2018.........

Only reason I got an upgrade from my 290 was because vega 56 was £300 with 3 free games, if it hadn't been, I would still be waiting for a worthy £300 upgrade........

Gibbo · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:40

ubersonic said:
There's this thing called "time" Gibbo

If Nvidia brought out a card that performed 15% better than the 8800 Ultra and charged £560 for it people would consider that a rip off too.

Lets just say I am experienced in this market and know costings and AMD, they can't and won't release a VEGA 64 performing product for same price as RX 590, certainly not in six months, doubtful even in 12 months, maybe after, but in 12 months a lot can happen, NVIDIA could even do a price drop, miracles have happened.

Gibbo · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:41

RavenXXX2 said:
AMD CEO said she is gonna shake things up big time, she has done that with CPUs now it's time to rock that GPU boat. 7nm navi with GDDR6 will bring high end gaming to the masses, who is interest in Vega 64 performance at £400-500 in 2019.

We already shake it up with Vega 56 at £299.

ltron · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:45

Gibbo said:
Why?

Vega 64 is £399 for our cheapest one, Sapphire is £479 and Asus over £500, they are all flying off the shelf, hence why we have to put prices up to try and secure more to slow the damn things down from selling out. Were still pretty much the cheapest even with higher prices.

If AMD bring a faster product for same money, why does it need to be cheaper? It does not!

If you want cheaper for whatever reasons they have RX590, 580, 570 and 560 all for less which are also very capable performing products.

Also 590 just released, its $250, anyone who thinks AMD is releasing a card with double the performance nearly for same money, must be smoking something really good.

I don't want cheaper, I want faster. I have a GTX 1080 now and spending £500 for just an extra 15% more performance a year from now doesn't make sense to me. AMD said they will compete in the high end and to me that means at least against the 2080 and 2080 Ti if not the Nvidia 3000 series or whatever they'll call them which may well be out by then. I want a choice, I don't want to automatically have to go with Nvidia.

Don't forget that these cards are not expected to have ray tracing, so there is a feature advantage for Nvidia too particularly if the next Nvidia cards are much better at this than the 20 series. Of course this is all speculation on my part as I don't know anything beyond these rumours, I'm just telling you how things look from my perspective.

ubersonic · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:47

jigger said:
Maybe AMD are going after mass volume. Torpedo everything else on the market and sell all they can.

AMD could be looking at an angle some haven't considered, because most Vega cards were bought by miners nobody really knows how many AMD actually sold apart from AMD and when they begin to flood the market (I mean farms emptying not bedroom miners giving up because their electric bill got too high) that kind of a flood of used high end cards will have an impact on new pricing (as AMD buyers are normally the more price/tech savvy, and paying 3x as much for a new card with the same performance will be hard for many to justify).

It could be that chart is were AMD see the price/performance landscape in a years time (if it were real anyway

).

Gibbo · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:51

Hi there

I've just checked the cost for GDDR6 and its $12-14 per gigabyte. Thats the cost to the board partner direct from memory factory (Samsung) for 100k plus.

That means any card with 8G, the memory cost alone is $112. Ad in GPU cost, component cost, board partner margin, disti/reseller margin, you then get a better idea. A board partner will want 7-10%, a reseller will want 8-12%.

Also inventory held on RX 570 and RX 580 is huge, so no new product is coming soon at same price, they will either wait to clear it or new product will be higher price.

bru · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:55

Ok so if AMD are going to showcase these new Navi based chips at CES, what sort of timeframe do we honestly expect before they actually arrive on the shelves?
Bear in mind Vega showcased last year at CES and didn't arrive till August. Even though I doubt it would take that long this time around.

Gregster · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:57

TNA said:
Gregster with AMD hardware in his PC? Computer says no! Just does not compute... Lol

Kidding Gregster. If zen 2 is as good as we are expecting, that would be a nice upgrade. I know there is a high probability I will be going for one

Gotta try and slip that past the Mrs but should be able to do it

bru · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:58

Thinking about it a bit more, I cannot be too soon, as if it was what was the point of releasing the 590, it would make the 3060 and 3070 pointless.

TNA · 5 Dec 2018 at 15:59

Gregster said:
Gotta try and slip that past the Mrs but should be able to do it

Poneros · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:13

bru said:
Ok so if AMD are going to showcase these new Navi based chips at CES, what sort of timeframe do we honestly expect before they actually arrive on the shelves?
Bear in mind Vega showcased last year at CES and didn't arrive till August. Even though I doubt it would take that long this time around.

No sooner than autumn imo, I base this on the fact that they've said it's 7nm HPC CPUs first next year, then 7nm CPUs (Ryzen - summer), and THEN GPUs, with lower-end ones first. So for the Navi 10 card probably Sept-Oct. availability.

Kaapstad · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:16

Good to see GDDR6 being used on the cards.

Gibbo · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:22

bru said:
Ok so if AMD are going to showcase these new Navi based chips at CES, what sort of timeframe do we honestly expect before they actually arrive on the shelves?
Bear in mind Vega showcased last year at CES and didn't arrive till August. Even though I doubt it would take that long this time around.

If they preview, more likely to be CPU, not GPU.
But a timescale can always be preview at CES, then a product launch or further preview at Computex.

Nelly · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:25

I hate to be negative, but if AMD price these too high then they won't prise people off current Vega cards or Nvidia cards, no sales off people currently using GTX 1070 etc including me. Second hand price of GTX 1070 by next year will probally £200, what's the point in paying more double for miniscule performance increase.

Also as mentioned in the previous thread, AMD can build these cheaper? I thought memory pricing is dropping and reports from DigiTimes has mentioned pricing dropping further across the board. Also memory makers been taken to court for price fixing.

Steve Burke at Gamers Nexus | Posted: 25 August 2017 said:
Vega - $150 on HBM2 and $25 on the interposer, putting us around $175 cost for the memory system. $100-$130 more than 8GB of GDDR5 cost to build. This is also ignoring other costs, like incalculable R&D or packaging costs.

Source: Gamers Nexus

Steve Burke at Gamers Nexus | Posted: 28 March 2018 said:
GDDR6 will be about 20% more expensive in manufacturer cost than GDDR5 at launch.

Source: Gamers Nexus

jigger · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:42

ubersonic said:
AMD could be looking at an angle some haven't considered, because most Vega cards were bought by miners nobody really knows how many AMD actually sold apart from AMD and when they begin to flood the market (I mean farms emptying not bedroom miners giving up because their electric bill got too high) that kind of a flood of used high end cards will have an impact on new pricing (as AMD buyers are normally the more price/tech savvy, and paying 3x as much for a new card with the same performance will be hard for many to justify).

It could be that chart is were AMD see the price/performance landscape in a years time (if it were real anyway ).

Maybe 7nm yields are fantastic.

Calo · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:50

This is all very fascinating. But fact is, for 4k gaming, (which is the future!) a 2080TI is your only option. Mainstream will always be mainstream with some choice and a bit of wiggle room for prices, what we really need is a top end competitor and its not going to be AMD next year judging by this 'leak' and recent comments from their CEO - that is probably the most accurate prediction anyone can make right now.

jigger · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:54

Calo said:
This is all very fascinating. But fact is, for 4k gaming, (which is the future!) a 2080TI is your only option. Mainstream will always be mainstream with some choice and a bit of wiggle room for prices, what we really need is a top end competitor and its not going to be AMD next year judging by this 'leak' and recent comments from their CEO - that is probably the most accurate prediction anyone can make right now.

What the industry needs is realistic prices. Without that PC gaming is finished.

That said, this RX 3080 would probably hold up well with a 4K Freesync monitor.

Calo · 5 Dec 2018 at 16:58

jigger said:
What the industry needs is realistic prices. Without that PC gaming is finished.

Exactly. but while the top end is allowed to balloon unchallenged, it drags up all the mainstream prices too.