970's having performance issues using 4GB Vram - Nvidia investigating

[mmj_uk]

Can someone ELI5 why Nvidia gimped the memory on the 970? Why didn't they implement a full functioning 4GB?

It's like if you baked 100 cakes with a new recipe, how many of them would be flawless? 20? so you sell those 20 for the highest price (GTX980), the other 80 have some minor imperfections so you sell those much cheaper (GTX970) rather than having to throw them away.

The funny thing is if GTX970 had been a 3.5GB card initially without the deception it would have still been a better all-round card than anything AMD currently offer. NVidia might as well EOL it now and/or change the spec as it's tarnished by the hysteria surrounding what's happened.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

You're missing the point. If we can"just turn down a setting" then maybe we could have just spent less on a weaker card?. The card shouldn't need knocking down a notch that's the whole point, and why we paid more for this card over a weaker and cheaper one.

So basically if the problem had not been uncovered you would have kept the GTX970. Instead when the problem was uncovered and it was down to Nvidia being less than truthful about the specs,you just rewarded them with even more money. Yet,I bet many here would be the first to have a pot at people who buy Apple products!

if AMD had a better offering then I'm sure people would be happy to have an AMD card instead. Infact they probably would have bought AMD cards instead of a 970 in the first place.

Getting a bit boring listing to people complaining about 970 owners returning their cards for 980s.

Nothing to with AMD vs Nvidia at all. Its the fact that people are so weak consumers instead of demanding Nvidia do something about it they just reward them with more money. So they are just setting a precident. If Nvidia does the same in the future(heck,even AMD) there is really no need for them to care about fixing an issue - they will say just spend more money with us.

Now enthusiasts having given precidence for BOTH AMD and Nvidia to lie even more about stuff. Blasted on-goal if you ask me.

Like I said JHH and the Nvidia BOD must be doing a victory jig.

Not even Intel did that - they spent $1 billion of their own money fixing the SB chipset problem and given people fixed motherboards.

 

[Legend]

Personally, I have no brand loyalty to anyone. I buy what I consider to be the best for my needs, couldn't care less who makes it. But reputation will ALWAYS influence that decision, and Nvidia's has been tarnished. I would now certainly question what I was buying from them in the future, and whether it was EXACTLY what it said it was. There's no question that important information was omitted, and it's made worse by Nvidia refusing to acknowledge it... worse, they're back peddling from initial staff admissions of "messing up" and "getting it wrong", to now saying "that's how it's supposed to work"... it's pathetic really, and the whole thing leaves a rather bitter taste in my mouth. I would hardly say I'm NEVER buying Nvidia again, but I'd certainly think twice.

Whatever you want to say about the cards and how good they still are (or not), there's no excusing their behaviour, and once the dust settles it will be interesting to see how many customers they lose because of this. That said, people upgrading to 980's does seem to be more of a reward for Nvidia than it is for the person buying the card, because anyone who thinks a 980 is going to outlive a 970 long enough to justify the extra cost is living in dream world.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Its funny how people are justifying the GTX980 upgrades.

To put in context it would be the equivalent of Intel not fixing the SB chipset problem,which would have taken years to have an effect(if it even did) and saying,"hey guys we have another more expensive chipset which you can buy which is fine" ,but the rest will be the same as before.


Imagine how much hatred would have been directed at Intel if they did that??

They did the right thing which IMHO gave me a better view of them as a company.

But with graphics card companies,its almost as bad as blasted Apple,with the excuse making for iPhones.

Even then does someone really think 500MB is going to make the GTX980 magically outlive the GTX970 by a bazillion years.

You should be all buying Geforce Titans then!

Edit!!

Even in the photography world with major companies like Nikon and Canon if there are problems there seems to be a more proactive approach than AMD and Nvidia to issues. Just look at the D600 and D750 issues. Nikon offered to repair D600 cameras OUT OF WARRANTY.

 

[Coolasmoo]

Its funny how people are justifying the GTX980 upgrades.

To put in context it would be the equivalent of Intel not fixing the SB chipset problem,which would have taken years to have an effect(if it even did) and saying,"hey guys we have another more expensive chipset which you can buy which is fine" ,but the rest will be the same as before.


Imagine how much hatred would have been directed at Intel if they did that??

They did the right thing which IMHO gave me a better view of them as a company.

But with graphics card companies,its almost as bad as blasted Apple,with the excuse making for iPhones.

Even then does someone really think 500MB is going to make the GTX980 magically outlive the GTX970 by a bazillion years.

You should be all buying Geforce Titans then!

Why does it bother you so much what we do with our money

 

[Mei]

its interesting
everyone only seems angry at nvidia not the hardware reviewers
and the reviewers i havent seen voice any anger either
maybe if they had to take some of the blame they would be lol

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Why does it bother you so much what we do with our money

It bothers me since you are just rewarding Nvidia for issues which they should be solving for free - you are giving them an incentive for them to not bother solving things. In the end next time AMD and Nvidia have issues they will be now far less likely to solve problem which does AFFECT ME if I am buying card due to consumers who cannot stand up for their own consumer rights.

People like you are screwing me over.

What is hilarious with people,is that I bet you would be up in arms if Intel had not spent 1 billion dollars to solve the SB chipset issue.

The same with camera companies like Nikon and Canon who have even repaired cameras like my D600 OUT OF WARRANTY due to problems that have surfaced which were design defects.

All BIG market leaders in their fields with multi-billion sales all took the financial hit since they valued their customers.

Yet it appears when it comes to phones and graphics cards,there seems to be a whole "the consumer needs to accept what a company can give me,pretty please".

 

[Orangey]

If the market can't correct itself we lose big time.

 

[james.miller]

nVidia will end up taking the hit on the returned cards. It's not quite the rosy situation you imagine, I'm sure.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

nVidia will end up taking the hit on the returned cards. It's not quite the rosy situation you imagine, I'm sure.

Not so much if a decent percentage if people just buy a more expensive card??

Plus its hilarious if no-body had found the "issue" then people would be happily fine with the GTX970.

The funny thing is what is the bet Nvidia will find away to get round the issue in the next month??

Then people will be buying the GTX970 as normal.

What are they going to do?? Make the GTX970 EOL??

But then I don't fall prey to random upgradetitus every 2 seconds,so maybe I am preaching to the wrong crowd.

 

[james.miller]

so nvidia end up with a marginal profit because of 980's sold to previous 970 users who got a full refund on their card. so what? just as many people who returned cards went for a 290x instead, im sure, so nvidia gets nothing at all for that. I very much doubt the minuscule profit nVidia might make has been worth the negative press and hassle of dealing with this situation. The idea that nVidia is sitting there, rubbing it's hand's with glee is frankly astonishing to me. Their silence either means they know they are untouchable, or, they are ******* bricks. I don't think they are that confident somehow.

But then I don't fall prey to random upgradetitus every 2 seconds,so maybe I am preaching to the wrong crowd.

You know, this is obviously something you are quite passionate about. That's fine, but do you have to try and be so insulting? Can't you just discuss the situation without the 'you people's and assuming we're all morons who upgrade every 2 seconds?

 

[easyrider]

so nvidia end up with a marginal profit because of 980's sold to previous 970 users who got a full refund on their card. so what? just as many people who returned cards went for a 290x instead, im sure, so nvidia gets nothing at all for that. I very much doubt the minuscule profit nVidia might make has been worth the negative press and hassle of dealing with this situation. The idea that nVidia is sitting there, rubbing it's hand's with glee is frankly astonishing to me. Their silence either means they know they are untouchable, or, they are ******* bricks. I don't think they are that confident somehow.



You know, this is obviously something you are quite passionate about. That's fine, but do you have to try and be so insulting? Can't you just discuss the situation without the 'you people's and assuming we're all morons who upgrade every 2 seconds?

Did you return yours mate ?

 

[pieman109]

It doesn't depend on anything. Nvidia lied and people were mislead on the specs.

Whether or not it runs game x or y means nothing and trying to justify the lies on that basis is a waste of Internet.

Firstly, I'm not trying to justify anything, Just illustrating that these cards can be made to run on "older" games at 1440 without lowering settings that much and someone might find the info useful, whats the problem with that?
Also I suggest you read the last couple of lines of my post, you'll see I agree with you 100%

 

[james.miller]

Did you return yours mate ?

Haven't done yet, but if i cant solve the stuttering with reduced clocks then it will be going back

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

so nvidia end up with a marginal profit because of 980's sold to previous 970 users who got a full refund on their card. so what? just as many people who returned cards went for a 290x instead, im sure, so nvidia gets nothing at all for that. I very much doubt the minuscule profit nVidia might make has been worth the negative press and hassle of dealing with this situation. The idea that nVidia is sitting there, rubbing it's hand's with glee is frankly astonishing to me. Their silence either means they know they are untouchable, or, they are ******* bricks. I don't think they are that confident somehow.



You know, this is obviously something you are quite passionate about. That's fine, but do you have to try and be so insulting? Can't you just discuss the situation without the 'you people's and assuming we're all morons who upgrade every 2 seconds?

You mean like when Apple was silent about problems?? How many problems through terribad QC have they had in the last 5 years?? Many, and yet their loyal customers still will end up buying their stuff meaning Apple can leisurely decide when it can be bothered or not to do anything about it. Like the iPhone where instead of a recall with a fixed model,they just handed out bumpers and even then the stores were instructed to try and avoid handing them out.

Don't worry,buy the next more expensive iPhone...!

Didn't stop people doing anyway and the response does annoy me,because like I said if that had been the case with SB or companies like Nikon or Canon,people would not be so quick to instantly give them MORE money. They would expect the problem to be fixed which companies like Intel,Nikon and Canon did.

I had a Canon prosumer compact(it cost more than £300+ at the time) which was out of warranty which Canon fixed since it was design fault with the Sony sensor.

This is the thing - when you actually look outside the microsm of phones and graphics cards,to the wider field of consumer electronics,its hilarious that in these areas,people will just reward companies.

Look at the ATI/AMD GSOD,Nvidia bumps issues and so on. The response from the companies was less than stellar,and it screws everyone over.

 

[Legend]

Plus its hilarious if no-body had found the "issue" then people would be happily fine with the GTX970.

The "issue" was found because there was one to find. It's not been fabricated or concocted out of thin air. There IS an issue with these cards when the VRAM hits the 3.5-4 range, for many people, particularly in SLI. Had the configuration of the cards been known about upon release, it would most likely have been uncovered then, and the 970 would not have been the runaway success that it has been... or at the very least people would have bought it knowing full well what they were getting. Doesn't make it any less powerful a card, just makes it less capable than we originally thought. To what % is up for debate.

 

[easyrider]

I'm glad I haven't bought another for when I upgrade my monitor in march

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The "issue" was found because there was one to find. It's not been fabricated or concocted out of thin air. There IS an issue with these cards when the VRAM hits the 3.5-4 range, for many people, particularly in SLI. Had the configuration of the cards been known about on the release, it would most likely have been uncovered then, and the 970 would not have been the runaway success that it was... or at the very least people would have bought it knowing full well what they were getting.

So instead of forcing Nvidia's hand to try make a software fix,or even release a fixed model hardwarewise which can switched for the current cards,people just spend more money on a GTX980??

Thats like saying,oh my D600 had the shutter oil issue. But don't worry Nikon refund my camera- I will buy a D800 instead!! Solved! :SARCASM:

Looks like Intel must be the customer service champions of the PC parts world together with Logitech.

 

[Orangey]

AFAIK NV are not coughing up for the refunds, it's OcUK stepping up. So NV keep all the money and get to sell a whole bunch of 980s they otherwise wouldn't have, which also happens to be a huge margin SKU. Talk about having your cake.

 

[easyrider]

AFAIK NV are not coughing up for the refunds, it's OcUK stepping up. So NV keep all the money and get to sell a whole bunch of 980s they otherwise wouldn't have, which also happens to be a huge margin SKU. Talk about having your cake.

NV have no morals the have just greed for $ at the expense of their customers...at the end of the day a company is only as good as its customers