Afghanistan - 20 years on

Tweets that don't age well.

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Biden has done what many believed impossible.
 
cu3ed said:
Engineers putting in water pumps only to come back 2 weeks later and thr metal ripped out and the Taliban seal it upx leaving them with no fresh water. People seem to think we changed things. We didn't we never did we never where going to change the minds of tibal communities with 50 bloody leaders in each one. Most must think it was like a mini US state or so thing.
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Not that I think we should have stayed another 20 years but another 20 years aspects like this would probably have changed - a lot of the younger generation especially are very different to Afghan of the 90s - even within the Taliban there are obvious lines between the younger ones and older more hardline elements which will likely manifest in the weeks and months ahead as internal strife.

cu3ed said:
Maybe, gonna be year to see the actually physical removal of bases and troop removal etc. Their was no way though to remove bases without breaking a chain in defence and risk lives though. Honestly, bandaid rip is possibly the best way.
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Most of the hard work was done in that respect - trying to extricate the final elements from Hamid Karzai is going to be challenging. (Bagram for instance was drawndown in July).
 
Rroff said:
Not that I think we should have stayed another 20 years but another 20 years aspects like this would probably have changed - a lot of the younger generation especially are very different to Afghan of the 90s - even within the Taliban there are obvious lines between the younger ones and older more hardline elements which will likely manifest in the weeks and months ahead as internal strife.
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That was thr thinking, its not outside of cities we are taking stone age living. Poor destitute areas and compounds and villages. Taliban walk in show a little good etcx plenty of new recruitment's to brain wash.
No is a very good example of how mindsets don't change in a few generations. Villages where electricity and water and plumbing had been fitted by our engineers where being ripped out from villages as little as 4 month ago. About then all work from engineers was stopped due to the leaving plans.
 
cu3ed said:
That was thr thinking, its not outside of cities we are taking stone age living. Poor destitute areas and compounds and villages. Taliban walk in show a little good etcx plenty of new recruitment's to brain wash.
No is a very good example of how mindsets don't change in a few generations. Villages where electricity and water and plumbing had been fitted by our engineers where being ripped out from villages as little as 4 month ago. About then all work from engineers was stopped due to the leaving plans.
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Seeing it with a lot of the videos even from the isolated rural villages, etc. a lot of the younger Afghans, even the Taliban, are diverging from the old school Taliban/Afghan mindset. Even those in quite remote places still have relations in the cities, etc.

Not to underestimate the huge amount of tribal and legacy issues and the sheer destitution many live in, etc. but I think in another 20 years things would and to an extent will be very different (obviously to an extent that goes without saying as it happens anywhere). But I think there would be a lot less who'd want to drag things backwards.
 
Ayahuasca said:
Well, that's a bit different then, isn't it?
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In my mind? No. It's on hierarchy to embrace bottom up intervention. It's not different, that's a holistic, new and better vision on how flexible and successful management of productive work places function. If you deny a conversation with your absolutely lowest level representatives then you deny your ability to grow and progress. It's simple theory on synergy work ethics and if you believe that you don't feel you're encouraged to team in such productive ways then you're in a rubbish environment where you need to rethink your carer path.
 
I blame the Americans and Tony Blair, and then our government for following them for so long.
IMO everything thing is much worse than when they went in.
 
It is the military who are getting it done - many of them going above and beyond and enduring things most of us can barely imagine.

The cost of this operation both its toll on the human side and cost financially are going to be astronomical.
 
Sankari said:
More than 70,000 evacuated now. Biden is getting it done. What an absolute chad.

:cool:
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Wouldnt it have been better to get all of those out first before pulling the troops out? And better still, inform ones allies before sodding off in the middle of the night. Or better still.. Negotiate to leave when it not a mysteriously named thing as "The fighting season"

As was said in the Rory Stewart interview, they gave Biden the usual 3 choices. Two totally muppet ones and the "right answer".. He is so out of touch with reality(even more than Trump) he chose one of the muppet ones.

Mind you, historically the US has a history of screwing over its allies when it's expedient to do so. Just we are all so naive to think they won't do it this time
 
RoboCod said:
In my mind? No. It's on hierarchy to embrace bottom up intervention. It's not different, that's a holistic, new and better vision on how flexible and successful management of productive work places function. If you deny a conversation with your absolutely lowest level representatives then you deny your ability to grow and progress. It's simple theory on synergy work ethics and if you believe that you don't feel you're encouraged to team in such productive ways then you're in a rubbish environment where you need to rethink your carer path.
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None of which I’ve disagreed with, what you’ve wrote there is a bit different to people challenging and questioning everything.

I was sad enough to search your previous posts and you’ve written on this before and said yourself there’s an appropriate time and place. There’s only so much time in the day and both parties should be picking their battles. For you, it’s different as you’re paid to do this for most of your working hours.
 
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That Jen Psaki or whatever she is called, does she deliberately come out and just talk absolute rubbish? I thought Trump and them lot spoke rubbish, but this new bunch have taken BS to a whole new scary level.

It's a huge success all of this. We need a serious shake up of politicians in the west because christ they are hugely disappointing, no wonder people stop voting.

If only we cared enough about defence we could just sort this evacuation out ourselves without the new US balloon knots.
 
I'd be interested to know how the US and allies will evacuate their own soldiers. Unless you've literally got 20 planes full taking off at the same time, you'll be leaving the last bunch of soldiers vulnerable.

Presumably they'll also be reliant on the Taliban to secure the airport so that there's not a rush by Afghani's at the end to try and get on a plane.
 
lemonkettaz said:
We need a serious shake up of politicians in the west because christ they are hugely disappointing, no wonder people stop voting.
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Unlikely to happen without a French revolution style uprising.

Politicians these days (in all parties) are in it for money and power not to server the people.

A few that do want to genuinely server the people are either pushed aside by their party or get corrupted like the rest.

This so-called war on terror which was an excuse to invade Afghanistan cost the US taxpayers billions, much of which went into the pockets of US military companies and US contractors.
 
Rroff said:
It is the military who are getting it done - many of them going above and beyond and enduring things most of us can barely imagine.

The cost of this operation both its toll on the human side and cost financially are going to be astronomical.
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Unlike the invasion and subsequent defeat which cost very little?
 
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