Alec Baldwin fatally shoots woman with prop gun on movie set

Are blanks a different size/shape to real bullets? Or are you suggesting that they have blanks made that are a different size/shape? Also it seems like this would be a custom gun.
The blanks I have used were very obviously different to live rounds. On the left is a live and blank on the right. Some (Automatics) have a cardboard "bullet" that is shredded as its come out of the barrel.


L62S0fw.png
 
It depends on the blank though. A 5.56mm blank is nearly as long as the live round, and you could just seat the bullet lower and it would match the length, for that reason it just wouldn't work.

It's best to just do what's almost always been done: Don't bring live ammo on set, it's worked for thousands and thousands of shooting scenes in the movies without issue.
 
Are blanks a different size/shape to real bullets? Or are you suggesting that they have blanks made that are a different size/shape?

Blanks are a different size and shape to real rounds. Inherently so, because what makes a blank a blank is that it doesn't have the bullet on the end.

For example, guns that can only fire blanks are legal to buy in the UK and start from about £100. That's for handguns, which are so tightly controlled here that even the British Olympic pistol shooting team has to travel to another country to practice as even they're not allowed functional pistols in Britain. But blank-only ones are no problem. You can buy them online, along with the ammunition for them. What is required in the UK is that blank-only pistols are visually distinct, e.g. a different colour. But that's purely an aesthetic thing because accurate replica pistols are also de facto illegal here.

Also it seems like this would be a custom gun.

Yes, but that shouldn't be an issue for filming. The cost would be similar and would be trivial in the context of the budget for almost any production. It would only be an issue for the most shoestring budget amateur productions in which the people taking part have to supply everything themselves and the production doesn't really have a budget.

A firearms manufacturer could produce a small number of blank-only versions of their guns for sale to film and TV companies. They could look identical from the outside, which is what would matter in the context of film and TV.

It depends on the blank though. A 5.56mm blank is nearly as long as the live round, and you could just seat the bullet lower and it would match the length, for that reason it just wouldn't work.

Would it be possible to manufacture 5.56mm blanks that were significantly shorter than a real round and which would sound and look the same when fired? If so, blank-only 5.56mm guns would be a viable thing.

It's best to just do what's almost always been done: Don't bring live ammo on set, it's worked for thousands and thousands of shooting scenes in the movies without issue.

Yes, but it's possible for incompetence to result in people getting killed. I think a multilayered approach to safety would be a good idea. I think it's generally a good idea for safety procedures to take into account incompetence as much as possible.
 
I'm supprised that no one has invented a different low pressure formulation that burns with the same characteristics as gunpowder/smokeless powder (as appropriate).
Would remove the need for the blanks crimp and therefore massively reduce debris risk, seems like a no brainer!

They kinda have.
Fiocci do 8mm blanks that are used in BF-replicas of 9mm weapons. The blanks are about as long as an empty 9mm casing and have the open end curved over to hold a bright green plastic cap, similar to a shotgun shell.

What is required in the UK is that blank-only pistols are visually distinct, e.g. a different colour. But that's purely an aesthetic thing because accurate replica pistols are also de facto illegal here.

With the exceptions of things like theatrical, TV, film and re-enactment use, as specified in the VCRA...

A firearms manufacturer could produce a small number of blank-only versions of their guns for sale to film and TV companies. They could look identical from the outside, which is what would matter in the context of film and TV.
Easily done, especially with something that has a removable barrel. Really all you'd need is a solid barrel with a small hole for venting at the front. You'd need either sufficient resistance to cycle the action on blow-back type models, or appropriately modified gas parts to cycle the recoil versions.
There's a bit more to it, but it's perfectly viable for the majority of auto-loading weapons and even easier for those that aren't.

More likely, though, manufacturers themselves wouldn't be interested in just a few small quantities of modified weapons in what is more of a mass production set-up.
It's far easier for specialist armourers to make aftermarket modifications to suit. However, there may then be the issue over advertising revenue and product placement sponsorship deals, as there'd be no direct incentive for a manufacturer to sponsor a film, or for the film to choose specific weapons.
It's big money, sometimes, which will have an influence.
 
Would it be possible to manufacture 5.56mm blanks that were significantly shorter than a real round and which would sound and look the same when fired? If so, blank-only 5.56mm guns would be a viable thing.
Not really, firearms are designed to accommodate a particular cartridge, when you start changing the cartridge length it will result in feeding issues. The tips of the 5.56mm blanks mimic the shape of bullets to aid feeding. On non-automatic firearms such as the one Baldwin used this isn't an issue though. But with revolvers it's common to have each chamber open and visible with a bullet in it for realism.


Yes, but it's possible for incompetence to result in people getting killed. I think a multilayered approach to safety would be a good idea. I think it's generally a good idea for safety procedures to take into account incompetence as much as possible.
There are multiple layers, but they were all broken.

Live ammo shouldn't have been on set. It was fairly obvious live ammo was on set as several of the crew were using the live ammo and pistol that killed Hutchins to shoot cans. You would have thought the armourer was aware of this, but nothing was done?
The pistol was handled by at least 2 people prior to it being handed to Baldwin, neither of these 2 people bothered to check it was live. This is really basic stuff that every shooter knows, let alone an armourer. But if I remember rightly it wasn't even the armourer who got the revolver, it was some other woman, who then gave it to the second director, who then gave it to Baldwin.

People walked off set hours before this happened for a variety of reasons, including working conditions. Clearly this set was an absolute disaster.

As I said before, I just don't think the wheel needs to be reinvented here. There are systems in place that work, and have worked thousands of times. Most movie deaths are a result from car work or other stunts, the firearms aspect of it is remarkably safe because there are strict rules in place.
 
Last edited:
If she was my daughter I couldn't settle. No money would compensate for the loss and it would feel like selling my daughters life.
I totally see where you are coming from for some crimes....... but this was not deliberate, not done in malice and yes whilst there was blame to be found would there really be any good out of looking for someone to punish?

The most important thing imo is that changes come out of it.

Of course if it were my lad i would probably feel the same as you as well.

Did anyone ever get taken to task over the Brandon Lee accident?
 
Last edited:
I totally see where you are coming from for some crimes....... but this was not deliberate, not done in malice and yes whilst there was blame to be found would there really be any good out of looking for someone to punish?

The most important thing imo is that changes come out of it.

Of course if it were my lad i would probably feel the same as you as well.

Did anyone ever get taken to task over the Brandon Lee accident?

Having watched a couple of videos from the set immediately after the incident can't agree - there was a large amount of incompetence, laziness, etc. involved while maybe not deliberate it was avoidable, this wasn't just an unforeseeable or unfortunate accident.
 
The assistant director signed a plea agreement over the negligent use of a deadly weapon. The terms include a suspended sentence and six months of probation..

This is going to be like the Rittenhouse trail but for liberals, should be fun...
 
Back
Top Bottom