Am i in the wrong?

G|mp · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:47

I didnt think it was that bad how he was told about being late

He could have quite happily turned it around and made a joke out of it
instead of coming across as sulky kid

If he gets on with his boss out of work why couldnt he have taken the boss
to one side and said "look im sorry man, bit late had a nightmare getting here
wont happen again"

Pudney · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:52

G|mp said:
I didnt think it was that bad how he was told about being late

That's where our disagreement stems from. In my opinion saying things like "shouldn't you apologise........" is just plain rude, and is just goading. If he'd said something like "our clocks show that the time is gone 9 and you should be here ready to work by now" then that is a lot more reasonable.

Luke15 · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:55

Its not at all reasonable. He has his own clock, and cannot see the clock at his workplace from home.

Morba · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:55

Luke15 said:
What i hate is how they rob your time.

Like i do a saturday job, and when a customer complains about a till being shut, i have to do and extra 10minutes unpaid work.

why do you have to do it without being paid?
you shouldnt allow that.

Mickey_D · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:56

Yup. Boss is the one that wants to be "all work" in attitude and relationships when on the job, so he should be setting the example.

And to me the example he seems to be setting is one of a complete ARSE!! You set that example, don't expect much better in return.

Just because we're mates outside of work doesn't mean I'm going to let slide you treating me like **** on the job.......

Meh, 3:00 AM. Need to sleep. G'night.

theleg · 30 Mar 2006 at 09:57

Mickey_D said:
I agree with Pudney. Managers are not permitted to display attitudes with thier workers and then expect none in return. If you feel otherwise, then I hope I never have to work for you......

I agree with you, I just dont see the managers attitude...It sounds like its a small place so it would be pretty informal...The manager gave him a chance to apologise for being late and had he apologised then it probably wouldnt have escalated...

Luke15 · 30 Mar 2006 at 10:00

Morba said:
why do you have to do it without being paid?
you shouldnt allow that.

I even went to my manager, and asked if i get over time. She said if it was over 15 minutes. I said my contract states i only have to work 7 hours paid.

Basically i didnt get the overtime, and there isnt much i can do to persuade them to give me the extra money :mad:

Sparky191 · 30 Mar 2006 at 10:09

Phate said:
...
What do you suggest i do? and i am currently looking for another job.

Well being rude (and you were) isn't going to help. If someone is being that picky about time keeping, and other issues hes not going to change. Its simply their nature. Just be a professional and abide strictly by the rules. You don't beat people like that by butting heads. You beat them by being more professional and by being the better person. if your not sure of something get them to clarify it. It will avoid misunderstandings. Consider keeping a work diary in case it call goes pear shaped. keeping all the good things that happen, like achievements and extra effort you put in, not just problems, disagreements on issues and timekeeping. I tend to keep a record of work done, work to do, and where I'm unhappy with something, I keep the details of what was asked.

If you can counter an asertion that you are always late with a detailed record of your timekeeping that proves you are not, that can save a lot of grief.

Been in similar situations in the past, and no one wins. Best you can do is treat it as a good learning experience of life. Consider having a informal chat with the guy to see if you can clear the air and avoid the things that really bug him and you. Of course take all disputes into private, thats just being professional. BOTH of you should do that.

Dolph · 30 Mar 2006 at 10:09

Morba said:
why do you have to do it without being paid?
you shouldnt allow that.

Or alternatively you can show the company goodwill, and a good company remembers that.

I frequently stay late or arrive early if they ask (sometimes paid, sometimes not), in turn, the company returns that flexibility when I need it for various things.

Of course, this does require good companies with good management, but most companies do actually have that. The number of times I've heard people complaining about perfectly reasonable managers due to the fact that the manager actually expects them to do their job is insane...

dirtydog · 30 Mar 2006 at 10:11

Dolph said:
Or alternatively you can show the company goodwill, and a good company remembers that.

I frequently stay late or arrive early if they ask (sometimes paid, sometimes not), in turn, the company returns that flexibility when I need it for various things.

Hehe... some companies might. Plenty of companies expect the earth from their employees, but give nothing in return. ie. expect you to regularly stay 5-10 minutes late, unpaid, but when you ask for the slightest thing in return you get the short shrift.

Sparky191 · 30 Mar 2006 at 10:12

Luke15 said:
I even went to my manager, and asked if i get over time. She said if it was over 15 minutes. I said my contract states i only have to work 7 hours paid.

Basically i didnt get the overtime, and there isnt much i can do to persuade them to give me the extra money

Happens a lot. You'll neer get it. Just stop doing the extra work. I find a fake evening course works wonders for knocking that on the head. You HAVE to leave at a certain time etc. But offer to work extra overtime at the weekend or some equally "awkward" time.

AmDaMan · 30 Mar 2006 at 12:29

The o/p was totally justified imo, nothing that deserved any disipline at all.

Just another inexperienced boss on a powertrip. He wants to be known as the supierior and will be an arse to achive this.

You are there early almost everyday
You work an extra day
More than likely your day runs over

Yet you arrive 1 minute!! 1 minute late and he gives you attitude, yes he's the boss but with actions like that what was he expecting? I'm glad you're not a sheep that takes stick like that and not do anything about it (like my last place of employment) The only way to sort it is by talking to him (probably better outside of work) Otherwise he won't know any better.

SaBBz · 30 Mar 2006 at 12:32

Kill him on Eve.

Phate · 30 Mar 2006 at 12:54

SaBBz said:
Kill him on Eve.

lol i would but i have a thrasher and he has a ferox, and for those who don't no the ferox is just a tad more destructive

Phate · 30 Mar 2006 at 13:01

at work atm on lunch break, and him and brown nose (the other techie) are doing an intelligence test atm, but im willing to bet when lunch ends at half 1 they will carry on doing it.

I think tomorrow when the other techie is out on callouts ill have a word with him, so far today hes only yelled at me once...was for leaving the hard drive unplugged in one of the test rigs because i was ghosting a drive to a seperate one, thing is though i was going to plug it back in like 30 seconds later to run a virus scan on a different hard drive.

But today like any other day this morning he hasnt really done a lot of work, his daily morning routine will be.

Arrive late.
sit down on the server
write on his blog
login to netvibes and go through all his usual news feeds (there are about 30) this usually brings us upto about 12 o clock, then he will start checking the emails etc opening the mail. and then its lunch time.

now i don't no how you look at it, but thats not "managing" at all thats just a manager who because technically he is higher up he feels he doesnt need to do the work. and what really makes me laugh is when hes reading his news feeds that he has a go at me if i turn a pc on and wait a minute for it to boot up.

ill post back later if he has another yell....

i like the idea of keeping a work diary though.

Amoeba · 30 Mar 2006 at 13:13

I often did early morning shifts in the shop I worked in, and one particular person always arrived either EXACTLY when his shift was supposed to start, or a few minutes late. This meant that there was never enough time for him to get his jobs done before start of trade, which in turn meant keeping the shop shut for a few extra minutes.

If your contract says you start work at 9, then you arrive in time to get your coat off, get to the shop floor / whatever in time so that when 9 comes, you can start working. No use in still being in the staffroom when you are supposed to be doing a job.

Sparky191 · 30 Mar 2006 at 13:24

Phate said:
....

i like the idea of keeping a work diary though.

Handy for wage discussions. I started doing it when I had a PIA boss who was always looking for you to account for all your time. Made good reading because it proved that the manager was miss-managing us by constantly changing what we were doing so we couldn't get anything finished. Also if the network was down for a few hours, it puts taking 10mins longer on lunch that day in perspective.

It came in useful on one day, because I came in 30-60mins early. Managed a record number of data migrations, and system setups, despite a 3 hour stoppage in the middle of the day due to network issues (out of our control), then being docked for leaving 15 mins early to catch a train. :rolleyes:

When I started contracting, and was billing per hour a work diary was invaluable, and help when creating reports on progress etc. Kept you focused on your objectives too. Another thing is a task list in Excel. With stuff like, request by, est time to complete, actual completion time, priority of task, deadline, milestones, etc. useful data to monitor of your own productivity, and the ineptitude of others.

Sparky191 · 30 Mar 2006 at 13:25

Amoeba said:
I often did early morning shifts in the shop I worked in, and one particular person always arrived either EXACTLY when his shift was supposed to start, or a few minutes late. This meant that there was never enough time for him to get his jobs done before start of trade, which in turn meant keeping the shop shut for a few extra minutes.

If your contract says you start work at 9, then you arrive in time to get your coat off, get to the shop floor / whatever in time so that when 9 comes, you can start working. No use in still being in the staffroom when you are supposed to be doing a job.

When I worked in Germany as student, all staff had to be on site waiting to start at 6am. Shift started at 6.15. Oddly enough we did the same in the afternoon. Finished at 3.15pm sat waiting till 3.30pm then left.

Morba · 30 Mar 2006 at 14:24

Dolph said:
Or alternatively you can show the company goodwill, and a good company remembers that.

I frequently stay late or arrive early if they ask (sometimes paid, sometimes not), in turn, the company returns that flexibility when I need it for various things.

Of course, this does require good companies with good management, but most companies do actually have that. The number of times I've heard people complaining about perfectly reasonable managers due to the fact that the manager actually expects them to do their job is insane...

ive got a flexible working contract, but even prior to that it was always agreed that my role was flexible in most terms anyway.
however i have a role that allows me to be like that. Im sure a checkout person wouldnt have the same. they have set hours that should be adhered to (much like a CSA) at all times.
Of course there is always a degree of give and take, from the posters post it seems like it is all take take take which clearly isnt being recognised.

Morba · 30 Mar 2006 at 14:28

Sparky191 said:
Another thing is a task list in Excel. With stuff like, request by, est time to complete, actual completion time, priority of task, deadline, milestones, etc. useful data to monitor of your own productivity, and the ineptitude of others.

MS Project does me fine in that respect