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AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1
- Thread starter Doom112
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Soldato
Yeah, i just really wish AMD could do a launch, but they can't, its just poor performance, because of poor drivers, no drivers, BIOS problems, this, that and the other, the Furys, not as good as expected, the 480s, not as good as expected, Ryzen, yeah, i'll admit, they've done a fantastic job to get where they are from where they were, but they messed the launch up, with the windows drivers, the BIOS problems sorted, they probably could have been so much better reviewed, and looked much better, which were no doubt going to see, when the reviewers go back to them, after AMD have ironed all the problems out, but it'll be too late then, as already lost sales, just like their graphics cards, poor performance on release day, as drivers not up to scratch, so cards are looking worse than they are, then 6/8 or whatever months down the line, after a few more drivers have trickled out, they are miles better than they were when reviewed, and actually matching, and beating the cards they are competing with, that were much better/faster than them when they were reviewed upon their releases, but by that time, again, they've lost sales, as everyones already bought the much better Nvidia cards, its such a shame
Used to draw my eyes off the screen a few years ago when scone and an other guy can't remember his name(who was very anti AMD) said AMD had little to no budget going forward but looking back on what's went on-they were right.
Mucking up launches is the AMD way but I don't think it's all down to incompetence though, cash, or lack of has lots to do with all your points you raised.
Maybe things will change maybe they won't but budget is massive.
Caporegime
So any new news?? 
Not just about cash though - they really need to work on strategic vision/forward planning and the last few years they seem to have missed big chances when either nVidia are on a lull or seasonal, etc. markets when they could have boosted sales - the Fury/390 launch was very sub-optimally executed and they could have capitalised on the sales building upto Christmas just gone with a 480 revision (GHz style) even if it was just cherry picking cores for a small performance/efficiency bump (as there seems to be quite a variation of quality in the yields).
Soldato
Agree with you but I said it's the AMD way(incompetence) and cash.
I tend to personally use incompetence in a more insulting fashion when someone could be doing better but too lazy, etc. hah - with AMD I feel its more a casualty of structure, feels like the willingness is there but the structure not quite - it needs someone (product and reporting to director level rather than executive/director level) with better long term vision tying it all together.
That's exaxty what a ton of people (including myself) are looking for.
Quite, I don't doubt many people would be more than happy with that... but you'd be happier still if it were even faster but for the same price lol!
Associate
Quite, I don't doubt many people would be more than happy with that... but you'd be happier still if it were even faster but for the same price lol!
I'm kind of expecting/hoping Vega to match (or maybe be slightly faster) than the 1080, but cost 15%-20% less.
I don't think they'll compete with the 1080ti, but you never know!
Associate
They need to bring out a card that can compete with 1080 Ti, by time Vega launches it'd be NEARLY 2 YEARS since Fury X launched, if they launch a card around 1080 performance, 1080 is only around 35% faster than Fury X at 4k? if it takes them 2 years to get an additional 35% performance increase on the previous flagship then it's a massive fail. This NEEDS to offer 1080 Ti performance
Soldato
What if they just said we aren't interested in the £700+ segment, and instead went back down to sensible price, power and performance levels? So normal 1080 performance, for £350, with other cards tiered below that? Maybe they want to grab volume shipments, not the tiny market that is the uber high end. Go look at the GPU useage on Steam etc, and then tell me where the money is, is it performance or a combination of price and performance?
Soldato
It looks like the most plausible option, to be honest. Also Raja on the last video did said while showing some graphics on the screen, that we might need 2 Vegas.
Going forward they might be able to do that in subsequent generations - but they simply can't drop a 1080 circa performance card right now (with the relative market saturation of the 1070 and 1080) and make the money they need to be making going forward - people forget that for instance development and production costs are going up a lot for 10 and 7nm and that will take a chunk of their money - IIRC development costs for 28nm was somewhere in the region of $50m while 7nm is looking like being in the region of $300m.
You can't ignore consumer perspective either - without a certain amount of competition in the higher ends it makes their mid-range and lower offerings look less attractive sub-consciously to the mainstream consumer even when infact they are the better offering.
Soldato
Consumer perspective, what is best for my money - that is the biggest one. Also lets face it, the mainstream consumer (card in a box) market is tiny, weeny little insignificance compared to the OEM and system builders of the world.
As for making money, when have AMD worried about that for the last 10 years? As long as they can bring their APU's and more importantly Xeon equivalent workstation CPU's to the forefront again, then they can worry about making money after gaining some market share, because at the end of the day bigger % share = investment and share price increase = money to invest etc.
Soldato
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Fine with me, then just fkin say so OMG they treat consumers like they have time to burn and not a care in the world. We all want to know and AMD is like...
"I'm covering my ears like a kid,
when your words mean nothing I go La La La...."
AMD has said they have a 4k ready card if its sub 1080Ti performance then see you in 4yrs time tbh, if they have something worth showing then show it now imho.
Associate
Well, having a 4k card ready means nothing if you don't know any details
. For all we know if might be only capable of 4k in Doom, which won't impress many. This said if would be a pretty big jump to go from a 480 to something that can come even close to a 1080 TI. Maybe I underestimate them, I just don't see it.
Don't underestimate the "Apple" factor though - which nVidia tends to tap into in the mainstream arena. AMD can't afford to cut their margins back that far they can significantly pull perspectives around on just the consumer's wallet at a given tier.
AMD can't be forever bleeding money especially not from other areas that are doing ok to prop up the GPU side if they are to invest the money they need to going forward to stay competitive.
Nobody saw Ryzen coming either, sure not the best for gaming yet, but great overall as a CPU. Minimum I expect is a 1080 beater for £400.Well, having a 4k card ready means nothing if you don't know any details
This said if would be a pretty big jump to go from a 480 to something that can come even close to a 1080 TI. Maybe I underestimate them, I just don't see it.
The 480 to be frank is quite a gimped product compared to what is possible on a fully upto speed, 2nd revision, 14LPP process - I fully expect to see the full spec Vega product capable of significantly faster performance than the 480 at 4K - I'm not just talking a few dozens of percent more but 100s of percent more.
Soldato
Why do you think they will be pulling in margins that far? They've almost already announced that they will (probably) be using half of the memory of other cards, which is the second most significant cost in the card. Also I think that they deals they have with Microsoft and Sony will be propping up the GPU side for many years to come, not just revenues from the CPU side of things.
I do not think AMD will remove the 'Nvidia' factor, as you said they seem to have a lot of people convinced that if you chose anything else you are dumb, or not getting the best, a la Apple.
Ultimately time will tell, and I do not think for one minute that we will see AMD cards at the top of the performance tree, not this generation at least, but then again I've always supported VFM over peeing away cash for a few % extra performance.
HBM2 isn't cheap - competing with GDDR5 and GDDR5X cards with HBM2 isn't going to go well profit wise. The console income is good but its not highly lucrative for AMD (despite what some would claim) and they can't afford to be bleeding from that to largely subsidise GPU development and production going forward.
Sales into the 1070 and 1080 arena are starting to slow up or there wouldn't be a chance of nVidia making moves with the 1080ti to shuffle prices down there without external pressure from AMD.
Sales into the 1070 and 1080 arena are starting to slow up or there wouldn't be a chance of nVidia making moves with the 1080ti to shuffle prices down there without external pressure from AMD.
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