AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1

[Curlyriff]

I think the only point was that you can go buy a brand new 1080 for £400 today. One off deal or not. That is how much it costs.

Cmon now, you know bringing used prices into this isn't relevant.

I saw the two deals you are on about They are very limited offers compared to the average. That is what should be looked at. Generally speaking you are still on about a GPU with sale value of £450+ and some places have the same card you are on about at £480 anyways.

One of them is stating 50+ in stock so that to me woudl suggest they are trying to offload stock and so taking a hit.

 

[Matkinson]

Maybe but that doesn't provide reason to why people here who know the score still think that AMD should suddenly undercut by £100. We are still talking generally about a £45 undercut as it is which is a good 13% price difference. At what level does this value suddenly get seen as reasonable?

That is a big chunk of margin that AMD are already loosing out on.

I guess it's also as it's a year later than Nvidia. People that want that performance will likely have already bought their 1070, 1080 whatever.

Same reason next year Nvidia will release something that is new and improved again, presumably more than 13% or so.

It's not an easy question to answer as it comes down to subjectivity, what you want to pay etc.

I personally can't see it taking a decent chunk of market share unless its considerably cheaper and or considerably more powerful.

 

[Curlyriff]

You didn't bothered to read the post did you, these prices have been available for over a month, on different brands from different sellers, and I'm not talking about the cashback deals.

But we'd be allowed to compare the prices if OCUK did a one off deal right?

The average price is way above though bar a few outlying sales going on and company taking hits on margins due to stock levels.

We are talking much closer to

1070 = £345
1080 = £470

Which is what they are being sold at. AMD are not going to price their GPU according to these couple of stores selling stock at below average price.

 

[Curlyriff]

I guess it's also as it's a year later than Nvidia. People that want that performance will likely have already bought their 1070, 1080 whatever.

Same reason next year Nvidia will release something that is new and improved again, presumably more than 13% or so.

It's not an easy question to answer as it comes down to subjectivity, what you want to pay etc.

Nope I am just trying to understand how they expect something that cost more to produce (due to memory), performs the same and is being released at a 13% undercut isn't good value. I have held onto my 980's for this long waiting to see what AMD bring to the table and I know a good number have done the same.

 

[JediFragger]

AMD are not going to price their GPU according to these couple of stores selling stock at below average price.

Then they won't sell, end of. With the rumoured shortages anyhow I'm guessing they will want to keep the prices on the higher side to stem the flow somewhat.

 

[Journey]

The average price is way above though bar a few outlying sales going on and company taking hits on margins due to stock levels.

We are talking much closer to

1070 = £345
1080 = £470

Which is what they are being sold at. AMD are not going to price their GPU according to these couple of stores selling stock at below average price.

Ok, so call the average £450 as people clearly don't class shopping around and getting the best value for money as a priority, Nvidia could just lop £50 off the 'official' GTX 1080 price after Vega launches and then the AMD would be priced too high.

 

[Matkinson]

Ok, so call the average £450 as people clearly don't class shopping around and getting the best value for money as a priority, Nvidia could just lop £50 off the 'official' GTX 1080 price after Vega launches and then the AMD would be priced too high.

Exactly this, which is why I still say a Vega 1080 equivalent needs to be under £400. Even if only slightly.

 

[Curlyriff]

Then they won't sell, end of. With the rumoured shortages anyhow I'm guessing they will want to keep the prices on the higher side to stem the flow somewhat.

Yes they will.

There are all of 2 cards available from 2 companies that require cash back to get them down to the £400 mark.

Other stores have them at £470+ still.

They will not price to those two stores offering a special price below the GPU RRP. That is not Nvidia pricing you are talking about. It would be no different to a store offering AMD cards below the RRP we are talking about. I think people are oblivious to this point.

 

[Curlyriff]

Ok, so call the average £450 as people clearly don't class shopping around and getting the best value for money as a priority, Nvidia could just lop £50 off the 'official' GTX 1080 price after Vega launches and then the AMD would be priced too high.

I just gave you the average price at £470. That is taken from the lowest price card for the 1080 across 10+ companies via google and then working out the average.

There is no way Nvidia can just lop of £70 from their RRP in response. It doesn't work that way.

 

[Nexus18]

You didn't bothered to read the post did you, these prices have been available for over a month, on different brands from different sellers, and I'm not talking about the cashback deals.

But we'd be allowed to compare the prices if OCUK did a one off deal right?

Well you must be happy to be shopping from dodgy low rated retailers then as I've been monitoring the prices of 1080's over the last 2 months and I haven't seen any reputable site offer a 1080 for anywhere close to £400 (excluding cashback deals), even "one off" deals haven't been that low, at least not for a somewhat decent 1080....

I think the only point was that you can go buy a brand new 1080 for £400 today. One off deal or not. That is how much it costs.

Cmon now, you know bringing used prices into this isn't relevant.

Well no not really tbh, if people want a bargain 1080 then I know myself and most others would rather buy from the members market here than from some dodgy sites or have to jump through cashback.

A deal's a deal imo, can be bought right here right now and not in weeks and weeks. With the pound having a little strength of late I can see more coming through.

Yes a deal is a deal and if you are set on a 1080 for whatever reason then go for it but if you are wanting to compare price to performance (which is how this discussion originated) then you need to set aside these currently "rare" one off deals and compare like for like i.e. official going rate, which is not £400-450 for a 1080.....

The average price is way above though bar a few outlying sales going on and company taking hits on margins due to stock levels.

We are talking much closer to

1070 = £345
1080 = £470

Which is what they are being sold at. AMD are not going to price their GPU according to these couple of stores selling stock at below average price.

Yes they will.

There are all of 2 cards available from 2 companies that require cash back to get them down to the £400 mark.

Other stores have them at £470+ still.

They will not price to those two stores offering a special price below the GPU RRP. That is not Nvidia pricing you are talking about. It would be no different to a store offering AMD cards below the RRP we are talking about. I think people are oblivious to this point.

^^

This guy gets it....

 

[Matkinson]

I just gave you the average price at £470. That is taken from the lowest price card for the 1080 across 10+ companies via google and then working out the average.

There is no way Nvidia can just lop of £70 from their RRP in response. It doesn't work that way.

No but they may be able to knock off £50, meaning they would sell for £420, meaning if Vega was £380, a £40 difference. Which might just be enough, but maybe not.

When you're spending £400 ish on a GPU, you might be likely spend the extra £40 to get the one you perceive to be better anyways.

 

[Journey]

So I suppose the Zotac 1080Ti AMP! at £620 is not a 'real' price from a 'proper retailer' I'd suggest you spend more time learning how to shop, and less time arguing about what you think is a real price.

 

[Curlyriff]

So I suppose the Zotac 1080Ti AMP! at £620 is not a 'real' price from a 'proper retailer' I'd suggest you spend more time learning how to shop, and less time arguing about what you think is a real price.

What has that got to do with anything I posted? Nothing

 

[Journey]

I just gave you the average price at £470. That is taken from the lowest price card for the 1080 across 10+ companies via google and then working out the average.

There is no way Nvidia can just lop of £70 from their RRP in response. It doesn't work that way.

Can you tell me how it works then? I mean how does a manufacturer reduce prices, oh right that's it they use rebates back to the retailers.

 

[Journey]

What has that got to do with anything I posted? Nothing

Multi-quote failed... but nevermind.

 

[opethdisciple]

My brain is just very very confused at the moment.

Waiting patiently for Vega, but at the end of the day I am more comfortable with Nvidia. But I now own a Ryzen.... ahhh the confusion!!

Buying Vega locks me out of the Nvidia ecosystem due to monitor upgrade which will happen at the same time.

Have AMD turned a corner? Is Vega gong to be the start of something new from them? They seem to be on the right road with Ryzen....

For example if I had been a 290/390 owner and had a Freesync monitor waiting until now to get a proper upgrade would have been painful.

Then again.... I currently have a 970 with a crappy monitor that tears like crazy so i am already in that situation....

I just hate the fact that a monitor purchase locks me in to the Green or Red ecosystem.

 

[Curlyriff]

Can you tell me how it works then? I mean how does a manufacturer reduce prices, oh right that's it they use rebates back to the retailers.

But the rebate is on the RRP of £480 for that card. The store selling it at £445 with rebate is taking an additional £35 hit on top of the rebate to get that price. Further to that it certainly appears to be because they have stock excess with 50+ units not shifted where as most other stores are sold out of them or very low stock.



Now going back to the price of the 1080Ti you brought up then. I have no idea where you got the £620 price (a quick google suggest that card is £700+ from the top retailers), however the price indicated for AMD equivalent is £465 at exchange rate.

The AMD prices are actually shown in UK then as:

RX Vega "Core" - RRP: $399.99 (1070 perf or better) = £310

RX Vega "Eclipse" - RRP: $499.99 (1080 perf or better) = £390

RX Vega "Nova" - RRP: $599.99 (1080TI perf or better) = £465

So shale we start again where that would suggest on average the "Nova" will be cheaper than a 1080? and undercut the 1080Ti by almost £150 then?

If you want to do a quick check on prices of cards check out nowinstock.net and you will see the price for a 1080Ti on average £680. Making it even better value for the "Nova" being that would make it £215 below the 1080Ti on average.

The average undercut for "eclipse" would actually be £90 once properly calculated.

The only one that doesn't look like this epic amazing value people want is the "Core" and that is likely due to smaller margins on a lower end product whilst production costs are similar.

 

[Nexus18]

So I suppose the Zotac 1080Ti AMP! at £620 is not a 'real' price from a 'proper retailer' I'd suggest you spend more time learning how to shop, and less time arguing about what you think is a real price.

It really is as simple as this:

- 1080 going rate across reputable sites is around £500 (if you want to buy from somewhere with little to no ratings then be my guest)
- These special 1080s that you keep mentioning that are supposedly from "reputable" sites for decent 1080s are <£440? And these are through either discount, cashback or whatever form of deals, right?

So do you really think that AMD are going to price vega to match a "limited" special one off deal that is on some unknown/not very popular site? If so then lol, that is all


Here is another simple example to explain "official" pricing, the "official" price is £679.99 and the "deal" is £518.99, ignoring other retailers and other 1080 models for a minute.... which price tag should AMD try to match? Limited time deal or the "standard" going rate?



You also have to remember that lots of people, myself included would rather pay a bit more to shop somewhere that has proven great customer service experience such as ocuk.

No but they may be able to knock off £50, meaning they would sell for £420, meaning if Vega was £380, a £40 difference. Which might just be enough, but maybe not.

When you're spending £400 ish on a GPU, you might be likely spend the extra £40 to get the one you perceive to be better anyways.

I would still pick vega over a 1080 (even if it was 5% slower in dx 11 stuff) if the price difference was only £40 for these reasons:

- prefer the drivers especially crimson UI
- ages better i.e. just look at how well the likes of the 290 have aged....
- far cheaper and far larger choice of freesync monitors + TVs in the future
- superior low level API vulkan/dx 12 performance, which is the future despite what all the dx 12 nay sayers would like you to think
- less issues with IQ/missing effects in games


EDIT:

As for the zotac 1080ti card for £620, yet again, buying abroad.... Yup this sure is considered the "norm" isn't it

 

[opethdisciple]

It really is as simple as this:

- 1080 going rate across reputable sites is around £500 (if you want to buy from somewhere with little to no ratings then be my guest)
- These special 1080s that you keep mentioning that are supposedly from "reputable" sites for decent 1080s are <£440? And these are through either discount, cashback or whatever form of deals, right?

So do you really think that AMD are going to price vega to match a "limited" special one off deal that is on some unknown/not very popular site? If so then lol, that is all


Here is another simple example to explain "official" pricing, the "official" price is £679.99 and the "deal" is £518.99, ignoring other retailers and other 1080 models for a minute.... which price tag should AMD try to match? Limited time deal or the "standard" going rate?



You also have to remember that lots of people, myself included would rather pay a bit more to shop somewhere that has proven great customer service experience such as ocuk.



I would still pick vega over a 1080 (even if it was 5% slower in dx 11 stuff) if the price difference was only £40 for these reasons:

- prefer the drivers especially crimson
- ages better i.e. just look at how well the likes of the 290 have aged....
- far cheaper and far larger choice of freesync monitors + TVs in the future
- superior low level API vulkan/dx 12 performance, which is the future despite what all the dx 12 nay sayers would like you to think
- less issues with IQ/missing effects in games

As it stands yes. But come Volta, I'm pretty sure Nvidia will be well on top of DX12 and probably the ones leading the development.

 

[Tolemac]

But the rebate is on the RRP of £480 for that card. The store selling it at £445 with rebate is taking an additional £35 hit on top of the rebate to get that price. Further to that it certainly appears to be because they have stock excess with 50+ units not shifted where as most other stores are sold out of them or very low stock.



Now going back to the price of the 1080Ti you brought up then. I have no idea where you got the £620 price (a quick google suggest that card is £700+ from the top retailers), however the price indicated for AMD equivalent is £465 at exchange rate.

The AMD prices are actually shown in UK then as:

RX Vega "Core" - RRP: $399.99 (1070 perf or better) = £310

RX Vega "Eclipse" - RRP: $499.99 (1080 perf or better) = £390

RX Vega "Nova" - RRP: $599.99 (1080TI perf or better) = £465

So shale we start again where that would suggest on average the "Nova" will be cheaper than a 1080? and undercut the 1080Ti by almost £150 then?

If you want to do a quick check on prices of cards check out nowinstock.net and you will see the price for a 1080Ti on average £680. Making it even better value for the "Nova" being that would make it £215 below the 1080Ti on average.

The average undercut for "eclipse" would actually be £90 once properly calculated.

The only one that doesn't look like this epic amazing value people want is the "Core" and that is likely due to smaller margins on a lower end product whilst production costs are similar.

We pay 20% VAT here in the uk don't forget that so it wont be exchange rate price