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AMD Zen 3 (Ryzen 4000) already in the works

Discussion in 'CPUs' started by Jamin280672, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. NinjaCool

    Hitman

    Joined: Mar 27, 2010

    Posts: 577

    Location: Denmark

    I guess the 4000 series will be known as the Intel killers :D
     
  2. humbug

    Caporegime

    Joined: Mar 17, 2012

    Posts: 32,316

    The problem with wording like "Intel killers" is it can be interpreted in a myriad of different ways.
     
  3. NinjaCool

    Hitman

    Joined: Mar 27, 2010

    Posts: 577

    Location: Denmark

    I meant it as in the 4000 series will likely be the tipping point where AMD also claims the gaming performance crown.
    Maybe some reviewers will use it since they do like big statements on places like Youtube :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  4. humbug

    Caporegime

    Joined: Mar 17, 2012

    Posts: 32,316

    Maybe :)
     
  5. Perfect_Chaos

    Mobster

    Joined: Aug 26, 2004

    Posts: 4,091

    Location: In dem hills

    If the 4000 chips are a good step up, which it seems like they will be, maybe I'll jump to one from my 3700x. Doing that i guess lets me see what Intel will come up with in 2021.

    Hard to know if buying into DDR5 is a good decision early on or wait 6-12 months for better speeds and pricing etc
     
  6. TrM

    Gangster

    Joined: Jul 3, 2019

    Posts: 450

    i wished the whole new ddr ram thing we had more of a overlap like ddr 4 and dd5 on same mobo. it would stop me buying ddr 4 2133 and 13 months later so much better speeds:)
     
  7. Praz94

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 28, 2018

    Posts: 1,146

    Location: London

    The fact the 16 core variant is called the Ryzen 8 is giving me the heebie jeebies.

    most likely fake but it seems reasonable given the current clock speeds of Zen2
     
  8. alec

    Gangster

    Joined: Dec 11, 2016

    Posts: 421

    Table coming from the authors of 5GHz at $300 or whatever it was about Zen 2. Makes no sense at any level.

    But the information coming direct from AMD looks very promising. Now design, IPC uplift "what you would expect from new architecture", and maybe slightly faster clocks.
    Pretty sure I will wait for Zen 3.
     
  9. Grim5

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 6, 2019

    Posts: 2,223

    16 core 5ghz

    Now that's a cpu I'd upgrade to

    finally a decent gaming upgrade
     
  10. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 4,459

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    5GHz 8 cores Zen 2 at $300 made perfect sense when AMD made their plans and when the leak was first revealed. In fact, the entire Ryzen 3000 leak made perfect sense at every level.

    But then a year later when it came to launch time, Intel completely fell off the grid with yet more broken 14nm+++++ dross and AMD's projections for where their competitor was sitting never panned out, so there was no need for them to be super aggressive with prices, super aggressive with binning and super aggressive with clock speeds. Actually charge proper money for superior kit, hell even gouge it a little bit.

    That is why Ryzen 3000 never hit the lofty heights of the leak, but it's still pretty damn close.
     
  11. DragonQ

    Soldato

    Joined: Jun 13, 2009

    Posts: 6,766

    Last time we saw an Excel table like that it was total nonsense so let's not start all of this again with at least 8 months to go, please.
     
  12. marms

    Gangster

    Joined: Nov 5, 2005

    Posts: 269

    Location: Lincolnshire

    Zen 2 can't do 5ghz on normal cooling, that has nothing to do with what Intel did or didn't bring out.
     
  13. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 4,459

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Says who? I take it you missed the part in my comment about "aggressive binning".

    What we have in our hands right now is arguably junk silicon. All of the best stuff was always dedicated to server anyway, but with demand for Rome much higher than AMD originally anticipated (again, they didn't project Intel being so woeful), all the 2nd best yields have been diverted to server as well. That leaves us peasants with 3rd or even 4th best silicon for our silly little home computers. Hell, the 3950X is evidence that desktop Ryzen is getting the lower quality yields. How can the 16 core part have a higher boost, lower temperatures and the same TDP as the 12 core part? BINNING.

    I guarantee you if you take a bunch of golden sample 6 and 8 core chiplets going into top-end Rome and slap them under a 360 AIO or massive Noctua then you'll get 5GHz boost.

    And yes, Intel have had a significant influence on this.
     
  14. alec

    Gangster

    Joined: Dec 11, 2016

    Posts: 421

    Even if they had (and missed) a 5 GHz target (which is unlikely, it sounds like clock gains from Zen+ to Zen 2 came as a surprise to AMD), there was no reason for those price points. The price target is always the competition.
     
  15. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

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    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    And in the absence of any competition AMD changed their pricing strategy because they didn't need to be as aggressive.

    Why do you think AMD had the stigma for being a "budget brand" for so long? They've had to undercut Intel a chunk to be attractive when they just didn't have the raw performance. And when AMD started on Zen 2 all those years ago, there was nothing to suggest that Intel would be unable to move past 14nm, to continually milk quad cores with little improvements. Zen 1 caught up with Haswell, Zen+ caught up with Skylake, but surely Intel would be FAR past Skylake and 14nm by the time Zen 2 lands.

    Surely?

    Nope. So when Zen 2 lands, is nip and tuck with Coffee Lake whilst offering more cores, lower heat, lower power and Intel have NOTHING to respond with, why in the blue Hell should AMD give their vastly superior kit away for pennies as they originally planned? Zen 2 can be competitive on its own merits, not the "price performance" "bang for buck" budget option.

    But yes, Intel's inflated pricing is still the target. AMD still price Ryzen 3000 to chop the legs off Intel at every price point.
     
  16. r22snapper

    Hitman

    Joined: Feb 15, 2014

    Posts: 553

    Location: Peterboghorror

    Bingo. Even if the suggested clock speeds were possible, the pricing would make zero sense unless Intel suddenly slashed prices across the board.
     
  17. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 4,459

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    If Intel remained competitive.

    If Intel had 10nm next-gen 10+ core CPU boosting to 5GHz and IPC significantly higher than Coffee Lake, AMD would have needed to push those clocks, hold back golden silicon for desktop and undercut prices just to be competitive. This is what AMD would have projected years ago. Reality proved to be quite different and AMD changed their plans.
     
  18. marms

    Gangster

    Joined: Nov 5, 2005

    Posts: 269

    Location: Lincolnshire

    If this golden silicon really existed AMD would've released an 8 core chip at 5 Ghz, even if they only made a few of them it would stop people from being able to say Intel have the fastest gaming CPU.
     
  19. LePhuronn

    Mobster

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    Sacrifice server revenue? For what? A niche market that doesn't actually make significant money? ePeen in the face of Intel die hards who think 720p gaming on a 2080 Ti actually matters?

    Not likely.

    Besides, a 5GHz 16 core does exist. It was shown in a private session at Computex running under water cooling. There's just not any need to cut into server revenues and release it.
     
  20. TNA

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 13, 2008

    Posts: 12,859

    Location: London

    I get what you are saying. ButI would have released say 100 or 1000 of them at a higher cost and a special name. Would do wonders for marketing imo. Think of them as titans or something.

    But maybe doing that would also have some negative consequences? But press is press these days. All the benchmarks would have looked awesome with AMD on top of gaming also.

    Does not bother me too much anyways. I am very happy with my 3600 which you could call a binned chip as it does 4.4GHz more efficiently than AMDs stock settings and results in over 10% free performance. 24/7 usage also at 1.275v :)