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*** AMD "Zen 4" thread (inc AM5/APU discussion) ***
Err, get the Ryzen 9 5900X today and upgrade in the next 5 years.
You don't need to wait till the end of 2022 to get the first iteration of the new AM5 platform.
No surprise:
https://www.techpowerup.com/285771/...ays-gigabytes-leaked-socket-am5-documentation
Although desktop is one thing, Genoa might be another.
One more set of PCIe 4.0 x4 ports earmarked for USB4 but could be for NVMe.
New chipset looks like it will have PCIe 4.0 too although with everything shared by the chipset over a x4 connection.
https://www.techpowerup.com/285771/...ays-gigabytes-leaked-socket-am5-documentation
Although desktop is one thing, Genoa might be another.
One more set of PCIe 4.0 x4 ports earmarked for USB4 but could be for NVMe.
New chipset looks like it will have PCIe 4.0 too although with everything shared by the chipset over a x4 connection.
Don't forget AMD is the premium band now so I doubt any cost savings will be passed to consumers.
I haven’t even seen any data on on PCI-E 5.0 devices yet. PCI-E 4.0 SSD’s can get a little power hungry and hot under load.
Soldato
We haven't even got PCI-E 4.0 SSDs fully sorted yet,and now its PCI-E 5.0 all of a sudden.
Yes, it can be ignored in the next at least 3-4 years.
TBH I'm happy with PCIe gen 3.0 until there's a valid reason to upgrade, would rather have double the capacity for the same price as a gen 4.0 drive as an extra 1TB is more noticeable than any speed increase currently.
Added power draw means better designs are needed that drive costs.
and mboard/psu are two things one dont want to skip quality on
Yep, double the capacity or a bit more mostly theoretical speed? That's an easy choice for most sane people. Someone who is trying to run a production database which has to serve millions of transaction or something similar, or sometime who absolutely "must" have the latest and fastest even if theoretical: let them either extra for PCIe 4.0 drives or even more for PCIe 5.0 drives.
Sure, if you need PCIe 5.0 you have to spend extra. For those of us who don't "need" PCIe 5.0, there are better places in a build to spend that money on.
Llano and Cezanne, and Renoir say hello.
I think AMD will begin to lose sales because Alder Lake will be more competitive, while AMD itself will start losing its performance advantage retargeting and wasting transistors for functions which are not needed.
The APUs are always slower.
The APUs so far have been monolithic dies, which leads to things like lower cache, yes they're often slower although the margins are also pretty small. 5600X vs 5600G is pretty close really. The main point though is that Zen4 will never be monolithic.
More transistors sure, almost certainly in the IO Die that has no real effect on CPU speed and is due a die shrink anyway so not really going to change much.
The skies not falling down just because they add a few GPU cores, overreaction much...
More transistors sure, almost certainly in the IO Die that has no real effect on CPU speed and is due a die shrink anyway so not really going to change much.
The skies not falling down just because they add a few GPU cores, overreaction much...
Instead of making one large IO die, they could have offered chiplets with more cores.
The integrated graphics part WON'T be small.
Actually, if you look at the die shots, you will see that it takes 40-50% of the die area of the monolithic chip!
Not sure it makes much (business) sense to have 10/12/16 core chiplets, they already provide 6 to 64 cores with an 8-core chiplet, and rumours are they'll bump that to 96 cores maximum just by extra chiplets. Increasing the size of the chiplet makes it unfeasible to sell the lower chips, if you've got a 12 core chipset you're not going to want to fuse off half of it to sell a 6 core chip... And whilst as a consumer it'd be great if the low end bumped up to 8 or 10 cores there's no 'need' for it and it just increases costs/decreases the cpus they can make...
Hell, you even are comparing them to Intel and the competitiveness with Alder Lake, Intel aren't due to have more than 8 'P-Cores' for several generations.
As for die shots, that's not what this shows: https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-5000g-cezanne-apu-first-high-res-die-shots-10-7-billion-transistors/ that's not 40% of the die area...
Use the Intel die shots, this above doesn't provide much information on the parts because there are grey zones with unknown functions.
AMD has to offer chiplets with more cores, that is how the die shrinks has always worked, look at the graphics cards, each generation gets double the shaders count.
Going from N7 to N5 is exactly this. Make the chiplet with more cores and give the low-end more cores - we need to go up from the primitive 4-core configurations.
Don
Why? For 90% of the PC market (i.e. excluding gamers, and "professionals" with specific software/hardware needs) even 4 cores is enough (e.g. for web browsing / facebook / youtube etc)
Better to further improve IPC and other aspects of the chip iteratively, and then gradually increase core counts over generations. It wasn't long ago that "make moar corez" was meme worthy
Cores on the IO chip?
While only 50-60% of the monolithic chips are the CPU cores, a lot of what you've lumped in as GPU is things which used to be considered either northbridge chipset or southbride chipset and would be in the IO die regardless.
Won't think we have any indications of big this iGPU would be. It could be a relatively small with 3 or so CUs and all the various display drivers and video codecs.
Like the built-in USB BIOS flashing, for enthusiasts it's mostly nice to have. Although on a multi-monitor setup, I like running peripheral monitors off the onboard as long as the resolution and refresh rate it supported.