*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

[Boomstick777]

AMD roadmaps leaked:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37364181&postcount=566

FX and APU replacements on FM3 platform in 2016.

Edit!!

Looks like CPUs and APUs too. So the "high performance" parts will have no IGP it appears.

Links not working for me, did anybody save it or got another linky?

 

[Boomstick777]

Got a look at the roadmap, AMD coming out guns blazing in 2016. 8 core Zen CPU and 4 core Zen with updated GCN APU. Nay sayers were saying AMD wouldn't have traditional CPU parts, well there ya go. 8 core CPU for desktop, and separate APU line. This is good stuff.

Got a good feeling about these, red team is gonna come good next year. Want to see them do well again.

 

[Boomstick777]

Yeah. I remember the price if them, it was lol tastic. The 9590 is now like 170 isn't it?
Bulldozer was 250 quid when it launched too, but an i7 smashed it.

AMD have their price as it is due to a pposition of weakness. Not because they're good guys.

Again. No one really knows how this will play out, so I'm optimistic

+1

AMD will charge high prices if they think they can. Fair enough.

I'm optimistic about Zen as well, Jim Keller knows his stuff.

"AMD are on track to catch up on high performance cores"

- Jim Keller, Corporate Vice President and Chief Architect of AMD's Microprocessor Cores

With a competitive AMD and Windows that doesn't flop I think PC space could see growth in 2016+

 

[Boomstick777]

I think you are right Boom, DX12 will be a massive game changer as well if used correctly.

Something i was thinking earlier, AMD probably developed gaming orientated hardware to make the most from stuff like Mantle etc going forward as this was their intended plan until MS got enough nudges to make DX12, with that in mind i wonder if the delays on some hardware was to redesign slightly in some areas to make more use of this new API? obviously im only talking about gaming orientated stuff, nothing else.

Yeah not just that, but with GPU's also timed close to the actual Windows 10 launch this year. Windows 10 drops and AMD have all these new products to go with it, not a bad idea. Just a shame that the more hardcore AMD buyer has been left out in the cold in the meantime, been a long time for new AMD hardware.

With the budget I do think AMD do really well, there fighting two big battles with less budget then the guys they are battling. I really hope they come out strong next year. Happily give them money for decent products, they just need to deliver something worthy. I think they will.

 

[Boomstick777]

40% IPC boost over Excavator ! That's more like it AMD

 

[Boomstick777]

I'll see it when I believe it.
But AMD are onto a winner if it's anywhere near that much of an improvement.

+1

It's wise to be cautious on this one. Lest we forget Bulldzoer I've got faith that Jim Keller is going to deliver the goods though, so am cautiously optimistic.

Zen on 14nm next year, finally some progress !

 

[Boomstick777]

 

[Boomstick777]

Next platform is called AM4, for both FX CPU and APU.

*Update*

 

[Boomstick777]

So that's 40% above excavator, not piledriver - so I guess that's more like 50% up on the current FX line.

That 8 core 16 thread CPU is looking very attractive right now.

Yeah would happily move back to AMD next year, a decent 8 core / 16 thread CPU would be awesome, also Zen APU looks promising.

 

[Boomstick777]

I think people are right to be sceptical (Bulldozer) but to say 40% IPC improvement won't be enough to catch Intel is just ignorant.

Of course that will catch up to Intel, Intel's own chips have been 3% - 5% IPC improvements each year since Sandybridge, hardly anything to write home about either.

A chip that has 40% more IPC than Excavator with 8 cores / 16 threads will be very fast and much faster than 4770K etc, especially in multi-threaded programs and likely DX12 gaming.

Now we just need to see if AMD actually delivers that 40%, but if they do it will be enough to be relevant once again.

 

[Boomstick777]

You do know what IPC is?

Instructions per clock.

The number of instructions per second and floating point operations per second for a processor can be derived by multiplying the instructions per cycle and the clock speed (measured in cycles per second or Hertz) of the processor in question. The number of instructions per second is an approximate indicator of the likely performance of the processor.

The number of instructions executed per clock is not a constant for a given processor; it depends on how the particular software being run interacts with the processor, and indeed the entire machine, particularly the memory hierarchy. However, certain processor features tend to lead to designs that have higher-than-average IPC values; the presence of multiple arithmetic logic units (an ALU is a processor subsystem that can perform elementary arithmetic and logical operations), and short pipelines. When comparing different instruction sets, a simpler instruction set may lead to a higher IPC figure than an implementation of a more complex instruction set using the same chip technology; however, the more complex instruction set may be able to achieve more useful work with fewer instructions.

More info here can be found here >>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instructions_per_cycle

Hope this helps

 

[Boomstick777]

/dreams

So basically an AMD chip that goes head to head with the 5960x for a much cheaper price.......

If that happened I would be sooooooo happy

 

[Boomstick777]

The proposed Zen looks to be very good, but I'll put up my reservations on price. AMD don't price the way they do because they're a good company, it's because they're in a position of weakness.

Agreed, price changes everything. At the same time if they command a good price point, good on em. I'll pay for quality product if they have it. Now we just have about a year and a half to wait and see

 

[Boomstick777]

The price is representative of actual performance.
They're not pricing low because they care, they price it depending on what the market will pay.

Martini1991 already said this, if they have a product that is worthy and command a decent price then good on em. Speaking for myself I would be happy to pay for a decent AMD product just like I do with Intel / Nvidia.

Just in the past few years AMD haven't had the products, hopefully this will change next year... So far away though..

 

[Boomstick777]

Either way, people can throw about "An Intel core is 40-50% whatever percent faster than an AMD core" all they want. A possible 40% over Excavator in an 8 core package *should* be very good indeed.

^^ This, Martini got it spot on.

I think we can take from this that at least AMD are focusing on traditional CPU performance space over other things, i.e prioritised over Zen APU and K12 ARM which are coming later in 2017.

This renewed focus along with a potential 40% uplift are promising.

Whether AMD can deliver it we'll see at launch but at least they are focusing here again. 2016 is a long ways off so until then it's Intel all the way, but good to know what AMD are trying to achieve.

 

[Boomstick777]

AMD to Emphasize on "Generation" with Future CPU Branding



http://www.techpowerup.com/212353/amd-to-emphasize-on-generation-with-future-cpu-branding.html

AMD is planning to play a neat branding game with Intel. Branding of the company's 2016 lineup of CPUs and APUs will emphasize on "generation," much in the same way Intel does with its Core processor family. AMD will mention in its PIB product packaging, OEM specs sheets, and even its product logo (down to the case-badge), that its 2016 products (FX-series CPUs and A-series APUs) are the company's "6th generation." 2016 marks prevalence of Intel's Core "Skylake" processor family, which is its 6th generation Core family (succeeding Nehalem/Westmere, Sandy Bridge, Ivy Bridge, Haswell, and Broadwell). AMD is arriving at its "6th generation" moniker counting "Stars," "Bulldozer," "Piledriver," "Steamroller," and "Excavator," driving its past 5 generations of APUs, and the occasional FX CPU.

 

[Boomstick777]

Interesting write up on Seeking Alpha regarding Zen and AMD's renewed foucs on the high end space.

(Some of the comments are funny to)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

AMD: This Intel Ankle-Biter Is On Its Way To Substantial Profits

Summary

AMD’s new focus could lead to huge price gains by the end of 2017.

AMD’s management team is concentrating on just a few profitable areas.

The AMD-Intel performance gap is about to shrink substantially.

AMD predicts $.50 earnings in 2017. I predict at least a $1.00.

Overview:

On May 6, Advanced Micro Devices (NASDAQ:AMD) had an investors' day conference where it outlined its future direction for products and sales. During this presentation, it made several points that I think will lead to a bright and profitable future. In recent weeks, AMD's stock price has dropped to about $2.30/share giving it a market cap of only $1.8 billion. That's barely 1% of Intel's (NASDAQ:INTC) $155 billion market cap.

In this article, I will review what was presented and why it will result in a whole new AMD in the next 2-3 years. I will also explain how this new concentrated focus should lead to substantial profits.

point is that AMD does not need to beat Intel with Zen, it only needs to narrow the performance gap and it will certainly do that.

So if we assume Intel x86 sales go from $47 billion to $55 billion in 2017 and AMD only picks up a very modest 4% share from Intel, we are looking at $2.2 billion in incremental sales. For a small cap $5 billion revenue business like AMD that's a very large sales increase and a hardly noticeable sales loss for a behemoth like Intel. As the much smaller player in the x86 duopoly, AMD stands to benefit enormously by an enhanced competitive product like Zen.

Risks:

AMD's decade-long problem has been execution and that is the biggest risk. It just does not deliver the products as described on time.

Because of the distorted market shares the little guy can greatly improve the outcome by picking up just a small piece of the big guy's market. Zen is a product that can do that.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/317...le-biter-is-on-its-way-to-substantial-profits

 

[Boomstick777]

I'll wait until the benchmarks come out before I buy any shares.

I think the point is to buy shares now (Cheap) watch the value grow as Zen re takes some market share (VS Risk).

I was reading the other day that Zen won't quite make the same per thread performance as the Intel, but, will be far closer than before.

So for me it's all about core count. If they can knock out a 8c 16t CPU with 80% per core of the 5960x for half the price (say around £450) then they're onto a bloody winner.

Thing is I just fitted my 8c 16t 2ghz Ivy Xeon and my FPS are amazing. So now I am wondering if I will even need Zen. With games going the way they are I doubt I will, but I will remain open minded.

+1

If the performance core VS core doesn't match Skylake for example, but is decent, the key being that with AMD you get '8/16' VS '4/8' Intel for similar cost still think Zen would be a better option.

They can def find a market with higher performance CPU's. I will build with Zen for sure. Jim Keller won't let us down.

AMD not bringing them to market in time might let us down though Hopefully AMD get the execution right with Zen.

 

[Boomstick777]

The cake is a lie!!!

Here will be NO AMD Zen APU in 2016!!!

Benchlife leaked AMD desktop roadmap.

http://benchlife.info/amd-bristol-r...e-to-use-excavator-cpu-architecture-06122015/

Spoiler

Bristol Ridge is not based on Zen core but based on improved Excavator core.

Bristol Ridge will target July 2016 launch and Summit Ridge with true Zen core will target Oct 2016 launch.

Bristol Ridge in FM3 wont take advantage of x16 PCI Express Gen 3 as it limited to x8 PCI Express Gen 3.

Oh well very extremely disappointed, really very difficult to see the high end Zen regain marketshare alone. If not then AMD is finished dead and doomed in 2016.

Yeah the Zen APU + GCN part is coming in 2017, the Zen (Same architecture) CPU only parts are coming in 2016. AMD have chosen to focus on the more profitable high end parts first and bring the better budget parts later on. This strategy makes sense, and desktop CPU is the area AMD really need to regain some ground.

 

[Boomstick777]

Please could a mod change the thread title to >>> *** AMD Zen CPU / APU ***

Because we now know Zen will come on AM4 and CPU + APU will both work on same socket, that thread title would make more sense