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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

This is a rehash of my other post pretty much but sums up the current situation of Ryzen

1) Many reviews were done on non fresh installs of Win, infact some where straight hardware swaps.
2) Many reviews were not done on updated bios
3) Many reviews were not done with High Performance mode, HEPT disabled or SMT disabled
4) Many reviews were done on the Asus Motherboard, which it now seems is exceptionally flakey
5) Ryzen has Bios fixes and Windows patches to come to fix issues, including Thread priority, SMT Scaling, Memory stability
6) There are numerous Ryzen videos if you bother to look that show it competing with 7700k in real world scenarios, this is what matters, not artificially gimped scenarios that are never going to happen for the majority of users.
7) All of Intels CPU releases were flawless
8) Many games are coded towards Intel hardware, its a fact, due to the state of the market and AMDs inability to perform

I lied about one of those above points.

Personally i would not waste money on a 1800x or a 1700x these are leakier parts and as such run a lot hotter and are above the efficiency and optimal curve for these processors, the sweet spot seems to be the 1700 with around 3.9 - 4ghz clocked manually, with currently SMT disabled and a few windows tweaks.

Ironically with it setup correctly its within touching distance of the 7700k in many many games, once they fix the SMT issue and get some other stability and performance fixes in, i can see this chip being even better, infact i see it as the go to chip.
 
loxocemus said:
would u recommend it over the 7700k?
Click to expand...

Depends on your use. If your PC is mainly just a gaming and browsing tool, then I would advise the 7700K currently. However, if you do more than just game and your PC is used for/as:
  • DAW
  • Mass transcoding/converting
  • Rendering
  • Compiling
Basically anything where multiple threads for heavy workloads will benefit, then look at 1700/1700X/1800X depending on whether you want to overclock or not and your budget.
 
The battle continues, gentlemen. I'm feeling impatient so I'm going to go to a local PC shop after work (half day) and see what if anything I find in the way of motherboards.
 
SiDeards73 said:
This is a rehash of my other post pretty much but sums up the current situation of Ryzen

1) Many reviews were done on non fresh installs of Win, infact some where straight hardware swaps.
2) Many reviews were not done on updated bios
3) Many reviews were not done with High Performance mode, HEPT disabled or SMT disabled
4) Many reviews were done on the Asus Motherboard, which it now seems is exceptionally flakey
5) Ryzen has Bios fixes and Windows patches to come to fix issues, including Thread priority, SMT Scaling, Memory stability
6) There are numerous Ryzen videos if you bother to look that show it competing with 7700k in real world scenarios, this is what matters, not artificially gimped scenarios that are never going to happen for the majority of users.
7) All of Intels CPU releases were flawless
8) Many games are coded towards Intel hardware, its a fact, due to the state of the market and AMDs inability to perform

I lied about one of those above points.

Personally i would not waste money on a 1800x or a 1700x these are leakier parts and as such run a lot hotter and are above the efficiency and optimal curve for these processors, the sweet spot seems to be the 1700 with around 3.9 - 4ghz clocked manually, with currently SMT disabled and a few windows tweaks.

Ironically with it setup correctly its within touching distance of the 7700k in many many games, once they fix the SMT issue and get some other stability and performance fixes in, i can see this chip being even better, infact i see it as the go to chip.
Click to expand...

Too any excuses there I'm afraid. For one I'm sure CPU reviews on new intel hardware is done in a similar way, ie, the pre-installed bios only, not a reinstall of Windows. In fact I haven't read one review yet that states they didn't do a clean install anyway? With win 10 it's very easy to do. If games are coded towards Intel hardware (and I doubt it),that's the way it is - they should develop CPU's to take the Intel instructions and not do something different and use the fact nobody has implemented it as an excuse for lower performance (the new features should allow a boost but not make up for a deficit) Shouldn't have to tweak the setting you mentioned either. I'm not jumping on the negative bandwagon just pointing out a few things - too many excuses here.
Seems to be a bit of a rush out the door job despite being in development for however many years.......one of the issues I have with AMD stuff is the problems early adopters face.
As for the mobo's, maybe AMD not worked with them closely enough or gave them enough time to develop them properly.
I'm going to leave it a while before possibly picking up an 1800X to see how things pan out. Looking forward to see how forum members get on :D
 
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DarrenM343 said:
Too any excuses there I'm afraid. For one I'm sure CPU reviews on new intel hardware is done in a similar way, ie, the pre-installed bios only, not a reinstall of Windows. If games are coded towards Intel hardware (and I doubt it),that's the way it is - they should develop CPU's to take the Intel instructions and not do something different and use the fact nobody has implemented it as an excuse for lower performance. Shouldn't have to tweak the setting you mentioned either. I'm not jumping on the negative bandwagon just pointing out a few things - too many excuses here.
Seems to be a bit of a rush job despite being in development for however many years.......one of the issues I have with AMD stuff is the problems early adopters face.
Click to expand...

It was a rush job you are correct, but it is nowhere near as bad as the reviews have made out, not in one bit. Infact the majority of reviews are laughable.
 
labbby said:
thanks just deciding how much custom radiator volume i should slap in my machine...if i ever get a mobo that is lol
Click to expand...

Which chip you getting? in all honesty these Zen chips wont clock very high, its an architectural limitation it seems. I imagine future iterations will be better clockers potentially. Im looking at just using a 280mm AIO For mine at 3.9 / 4ghz once i get it.
 
Looking at the comparisons between the 7700k and the 1700, one thing is for sure, we have competition :) each is better at different things, so we have choices to make. Which I think is pretty positive, hopefully it lasts a long time and we won't simply be making our CPU choice based solely on budget :)
 
SiDeards73 said:
Which chip you getting? in all honesty these Zen chips wont clock very high, its an architectural limitation it seems. I imagine future iterations will be better clockers potentially. Im looking at just using a 280mm AIO For mine at 3.9 / 4ghz once i get it.
Click to expand...

The 1800x Im only looking for 4Ghz over all cores... Problem is i am a bit OCD when it comes to temps :D
 
labbby said:
The 1800x Im only looking for 4Ghz over all cores... Problem is i am a bit OCD when it comes to temps :D
Click to expand...

Ok your probably not going to like this, but send that 1800x back and get the 1700, it seems the 1700x and 1800x being leakier parts are around 20c on average hotter than the 1700 even when OC'd :( as 8Pack has said, they are designed for high cooling, if your going custom water loop you may find it reasonable, but i can also imagine, if your worried about temps, you probably wont be impressed by the temps of that CPU.
 
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