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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

Ah, then I got it. So tricky to keep order on all the names and abbreviations flying around here at times, specially when you are quite new to getting computer stuff sorted. It could be quite interesting to see what is coming then :)

I'm hoping there would be some more info about the new Zen stuff by early december to see what I shall get myself for a christmas present :P :D
 
neviditelny said:
Ah, then I got it. So tricky to keep order on all the names and abbreviations flying around here at times, specially when you are quite new to getting computer stuff sorted. It could be quite interesting to see what is coming then :)

I'm hoping there would be some more info about the new Zen stuff by early december to see what I shall get myself for a christmas present :P :D
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Indeed so many names. Here's a quick summary over what you'll likely see over the next 6 months ish:

  • Zen - AMD's new high-end desktop CPUs, coming in the next couple of months.
  • AM4 - AMD's new motherboard platform, which Zen will use. Also the 'X370' chipset is supposed to be the top-end one.
  • Vega - AMD's new high-end graphics cards, competing with GTX 1070 and above. Coming in 4+ months.
  • Raven Ridge - AMD's new APUs using Zen core. Up to 4 cores + graphics, coming in 6+ months.
  • Kaby Lake - Intel's new mainstream CPU's, coming in the next couple of months. Up to 4 cores, with the fastest IPC of any of Intel's chips.
  • Z270 (and others) - Intel's new motherboard chipsets for Kaby Lake. These will have support for Intel's next 2 CPU families over the next 2 years also.
  • Xpoint or 3D Xpoint memory - Intel and Micron's new type of memory. It is like SSD memory but massively faster. It will bring hyper-fast SSDs, and potentially replace system RAM over the next few years. First SSDs made with this should be available within 6 months, and require a Kaby Lake chipset motherboard (like Z270) to use.
  • Volta - Nvidia's upcoming graphics cards, which are supposedly a drastic redesign. These are rumoured to come out in 2017 but no confirmation.
 
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Thank you for the explanation. Looks like it could be a very interesting end of the year. I had pretty much made up my mind to get an Intel i7 6700K, and then bam... AMD comes with an upcoming release of new CPU's.. So then I thought it is just to hang on and wait to see how they will fare before buying something new.

So hopefully I'll get some nice stuff as a christmas present for myself lol.
 
AllBodies [* said:
Z270 (and others) - Intel's new motherboard chipsets for Kaby Lake. These will have support for Intel's next 2 CPU families over the next 2 years also.
[/LIST]
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What 2 CPU families will Z270 support for the next 2 years? Plus won't that mean the z170 motherboards will also support the next 2 years CPU's (after bios update). I am sceptical about this.
 
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=XDC=FluphyBunny said:
What 2 CPU families will Z270 support for the next 2 years? Plus won't that mean the z170 motherboards will also support the next 2 years CPU's (after bios update). I am sceptical about this.
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Z270 will support Sky Lake, Kaby Lake, Coffee Lake, and Cannon Lake. Or it should anyway.

Z270 was confirmed to have Cannon Lake (on 10nm) support in future before they slotted in 14nm Coffee Lake in between.

And Z170 was also confirmed to not support Cannon Lake, so again likely won't support Coffee Lake.
 
Martini1991 said:
I don't know why when AMD delay, people suddenly forget. :confused:
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I think you also forget even Bulldozer appeared in commercial systems(one of the supercomputers) months before retail release. IIRC,it was at ORNL.

So,how do you know whether they will do the same and have a limited commerical release this year followed by the consumer release later one?? After all an 8 core 16 thread CPU sounds more like something which is targetted towards commercial use rather than the gaming market.
 
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CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
I think you also forget even Bulldozer appeared in commercial systems(one of the supercomputers) months before retail release. IIRC,it was at ORNL.
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You might be thinking of the former national machine, HECToR.

HECToR phase 3 had 5,632 Interlagos (16-core Bulldozer Opteron) CPUs when it was complete in Dec 2011. (I.e. nearly 60k cores.)

http://www.hector.ac.uk/news-events/news/2011-12-07-Phase3Up.php

Not before launch but shows they probably got a pretty big delivery at or before the launch to get them all installed at that time.
 
joeyjojo said:
You might be thinking of the former national machine, HECToR.

HECToR phase 3 had 5,632 Interlagos (16-core Bulldozer Opteron) CPUs when it was complete in Dec 2011. (I.e. nearly 60k cores.)

http://www.hector.ac.uk/news-events/news/2011-12-07-Phase3Up.php

Not before launch but shows they probably got a pretty big delivery at or before the launch to get them all installed at that time.
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http://www.pcper.com/news/Systems/C...A-Tesla-GPU-Supercomputer-Capable-50-Petaflop

ORNL Jaguar.

According to AMD they started shipping Bulldozer based Opterons in August 2011,which was months before the late October release of the FX8150:

http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2107487/amd-launches-interlagos-bulldozer-chips

It makes sense since commercial CPUs probably will be sold at a higher price than those which will be sold to us mere plebs!! :p

As I have mentioned before,I expect the first Zen CPUs to sample to commercial customers this year before we see retail availability on consumer platforms. The fact that the first Zen release is 8C/16T indicates what market they are aiming for. The APU is the one which is actually more relevant to the consumer market,ie,laptops and prebuilt desktops,but it sadly looks like it is a year away.

OFC,it is quite possible even the commercial release of Zen might be delayed if GF has issues,but AMD only needs to actually ship some chips to commercial customers this year to say they released it this year.
 
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CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
I think you also forget even Bulldozer appeared in commercial systems(one of the supercomputers) months before retail release. IIRC,it was at ORNL.

So,how do you know whether they will do the same and have a limited commerical release this year followed by the consumer release later one?? After all an 8 core 16 thread CPU sounds more like something which is targetted towards commercial use rather than the gaming market.
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Doesn't mean anything to us. It's rather moot. Either way, AMD plan something, and it more than often doesn't pan out that way as far as dates go.
I always says availability doesn't actually mean that we'll be able to buy it, as it's consumers last.

AMD announced a 30-90 day Window for Bulldozer and missed it for us (Since you mentioned Bulldozer)
 
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Martini1991 said:
Doesn't mean anything to us. It's rather moot.
I always says availability doesn't actually mean that we'll be able to buy it, as it's consumers last.

But you must be forgetting AMD announced a 30-90 day Window for Bulldozer and missed it for us.
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It does not change the fact that a 2016 release for Zen means them releasing them for any market Zen might be launching in. Bulldozer shipped in August 2011 to supercomputer customers like ORNL.

The problem with enthusiasts is that they instantly saw 2016 as the release date for Zen and instantly thought it was the AM4 release. You only have to blame yourself for made up hype that it would be launching now for enthusiasts. Except,the last few AMD releases like Interlagos,etc were server chips repurposed for desktop - they all launched to commercial customers beforehand(think the Phenom II X6 was the same).
Are you honestly that naive,that a 8C/16T chip is being developed for consumers like us first or for servers,etc which are higher margin markets??

Just like the same people who actually misread what Intel said and actually thought that SB would replaced by IB on desktop in a year and Haswell would replace IB in a year too. They hyped it up themselves,when it was quite clear Intel was talking about mobile chips launching for select systems.

Told them that was the case,and it was the case.

The issue is enthusiasts read into any small rumour or leak and run with and its their built up hype of when these things launch and how well they perform which means they have unrealistic expectations. Just look at the RX480 - people were hyping it to be a Fury X beater FFS. Every hint from AMD themselves pretty much indicated where it would land,ie,lets take R9 290/R9 390 level performance and make it cheaper(in USD).
 
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Martini1991 said:
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=29918417&postcount=1472

I didn't expect to buy it this year.
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Which still does not make it "delayed" - an 8C/16T chip without an IGP is quite obviously a server/supercomputer chip being repurposed for a higher end desktop market. It makes sense,that an early production chips would be pushed to commercial customers. Heck,they need to only literally ship 1000 of them to one customer to say they have hit a 2016 release.

But for consumers like us,I am not sure if 8C/16T Zen chips will be make much difference to that market. Most of the laptops and desktops will still be served by Bulldozer derived CPUs until late next year. Zen might make a dent in the higher end AMD desktop market as TBH after 4 years,as it will be faster than the FX8350,but TBH my main worry is if clockspeeds of any 4C/8T or 6C/12T parts will be high enough compared to what Intel has in Kaby Lake.

This is why I told one of my best mates to buy a Core i7 6700 two to three months ago,and not wait for Zen as I expected AMD would push a limited commercial release this year as a priority and he needed an upgrade. The fact that the APU version is late next year pretty much shows what market they are after IMHO.
 
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