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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
It does not change the fact that a 2016 release for Zen means them releasing them for any market Zen might be launching in. Bulldozer shipped in August 2011 to supercomputer customers like ORNL.

The problem with enthusiasts is that they instantly saw 2016 as the release date for Zen and instantly thought it was the AM4 release. You only have to blame yourself for made up hype that it would be launching now for enthusiasts.
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Yes the problem with enthusiasts is that we like to see what AMD themselves post and take it that when they show slides saying desktops Zen CPU's for 2016, we assume they actually mean desktop CPU's for 2016.

May 2015
zen2.jpg


Taken from this page. http://ir.amd.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=74093&p=irol-analystday

top image from the PDF link "AMD Computing and Graphics Segment Overview" (second link down on the right)
bottom image from the PDF link "Updated AMD Roadmaps" (second link from the top)

January 2016
zen3.jpg


So as you can see as of January, desktop Zen was suppose to arrive this year.
 
bru said:
Yes the problem with enthusiasts is that we like to see what AMD themselves post and take it that when they show slides saying desktops Zen CPU's for 2016, we assume they actually mean desktop CPU's for 2016.

May 2015
zen2.jpg


Taken from this page. http://ir.amd.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=74093&p=irol-analystday

top image from the PDF link "AMD Computing and Graphics Segment Overview" (second link down on the right)
bottom image from the PDF link "Updated AMD Roadmaps" (second link from the top)

January 2016
zen3.jpg


So as you can see as of January, desktop Zen was suppose to arrive this year.
Click to expand...

AMD roadmaps are subject to change without notice or obligations to changes
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Interesting that is only on the January slide.

Sure they might have guessed 2016 initially but now they're saying early 2017, it's not a major delay like skylake was.
 
Yutang13 said:
Interesting that is only on the January slide.

Sure they might have guessed 2016 initially but now they're saying early 2017, it's not a major delay like skylake was.
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Intel are so far ahead it doesn't matter, they're in a position of pure strength, AMD aren't, the lack of a 2016 AMD Zen CPU is surely a disappointment.

I think it's pretty dreadful that we're heading into the 5th year of Piledriver being AMD's "high end".
 
It's been well known that Zen is a 2017 product. I could find posts I made one year ago saying the same thing.

The problem is 99% of people have no idea how to google information themselves, or this would be common knowledge.

The most we'll get this year is a paper launch, or perhaps reviews will be seeded some samples. For retail availability it will be well into February/March at the absolute earliest.
 
Biggest development is really to do with software that can use multicores. And then pricing coming down on 22 core cpu, thats your real increase over the average user stuck on 4 cores now. It'll happen, but its way slower then the old high ghz route which was backwards compatible and immediate benefit
 
you want the simple answer.

zen wont be much.if it was they would be shouting from the roofs until launch.are they?

no.

there is your answer.just another amd cpu.pretty decently average.
 
~>Dg<~ said:
you want the simple answer.

zen wont be much.if it was they would be shouting from the roofs until launch.are they?

no.

there is your answer.just another amd cpu.pretty decently average.
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Please stop. With what certainty are you stating the above. Do you work for AMD? Do you have inside knowledge? You are merely going by past products. Way to shoot a company down even before their product is out.
 
maybe the last 15 years or so has kinda pointed to it. you dont need insider knowledge.its common sense.

during that 15 years or so since amd was last competitive in the cpu market nothing has changed. so why will it now ?

if the product is as good as many hope do you think they would not be crowing about it now ? of course they would.

the thing is its quiet.they not shouting about it so its going to be as always.

a reasonable cpu selection.

you dont just boom jump ahead.the time has been in place for amd to compete with intel.they cant.so they settle for the bargin sector.thats why they stay in that sector.

i like amd as a company far better than others.
 
~>Dg<~ said:
maybe the last 15 years or so has kinda pointed to it. you dont need insider knowledge.its common sense.

during that 15 years or so since amd was last competitive in the cpu market nothing has changed. so why will it now ?

if the product is as good as many hope do you think they would not be crowing about it now ? of course they would.

the thing is its quiet.they not shouting about it so its going to be as always.

a reasonable cpu selection.

you dont just boom jump ahead.the time has been in place for amd to compete with intel.they cant.so they settle for the bargin sector.thats why they stay in that sector.

i like amd as a company far better than others.
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I think your logic is flawed. Zen is a complete redesign. Maybe it won't compete toe to toe with Intel's Latest offerings but it should be close. AMD shouted from the rooftops about Bulldozer and look how it turned out. Maybe just maybe they have learned their lesson and are going to shout about it once the reviews prove that it is a good product.
 
IPBA said:
I think your logic is flawed. Zen is a complete redesign. Maybe it won't compete toe to toe with Intel's Latest offerings but it should be close. AMD shouted from the rooftops about Bulldozer and look how it turned out. Maybe just maybe they have learned their lesson and are going to shout about it once the reviews prove that it is a good product.
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True, as soon as they say something people like to point it out if it ends up being different, this thread having many examples. Keeping fairly quiet and occasionally giving vague advertising is probably their best bet for now. Stuff like "an exciting new generation of performance" which gives literally nothing away and somethings that can't be used against them if they change something.
 
Dave2150 said:
It's been well known that Zen is a 2017 product. I could find posts I made one year ago saying the same thing.

The problem is 99% of people have no idea how to google information themselves, or this would be common knowledge.

The most we'll get this year is a paper launch, or perhaps reviews will be seeded some samples. For retail availability it will be well into February/March at the absolute earliest.
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You said it hadn't taped out when it had.

I can't believe people are still clinging to the idea that it could somehow be anywhere near Intel speeds... by AMD's own numbers it will be sub-Ivy. We have known that for what feels like years now. They simply don't have the money, just look what a hash they made of Poolaris. It's so expensive to make chips now that NV claims to have spent $7B on a die shrink of Maxwell.

Stop all this "it's not out, you don't know" talk. We know. About the best we can hope for now is that there is a major shakeup in how computers are made, leading to a new roadmap to replace the old semiconductor one and the monopolies fall and are replaced by a slew of new blood. Otherwise we will be stuck on Volta & Sandy IPC until 2025.
 
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IPBA said:
I think your logic is flawed. Zen is a complete redesign. Maybe it won't compete toe to toe with Intel's Latest offerings but it should be close. AMD shouted from the rooftops about Bulldozer and look how it turned out. Maybe just maybe they have learned their lesson and are going to shout about it once the reviews prove that it is a good product.
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my logic is flawed that in the last 15 years they havent once been out in front ? :confused:

is that not as logical as it gets ?

they arent shouting because they dont need to. why ? because it sits in the same place that all AMD cpus sit in. bargin platfrom.they arent going for the crown.some think they are.theyre not they just improving performance in the bargin sector which they sell to.

if it was faster than intel products you think they wouldnt be screaming about it ? of course they would. youd be marketing the hell out of how you got the better processor at a cheaper price. it would be a massive thing.

yet look we talking passively about it.with a touch of hope.
 
Orangey said:
Stop all this "it's not out, you don't know" talk. We know. About the best we can hope for now is that there is a major shakeup in how computers are made, leading to a new roadmap to replace the old semiconductor one and the monopolies fall and are replaced by a slew of new blood. Otherwise we will be stuck on Volta & Sandy IPC until 2025.
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WE don't know poopookaka as yet. Pure speculation unless you've got some figures to back that up.

I recall bulldozer launch - there was some dude from AMD posting on here (think he worked on the server side) - where's he at? ;)
 
Orangey said:
I can't believe people are still clinging to the idea that it could somehow be anywhere near Intel speeds... by AMD's own numbers it will be sub-Ivy. We have known that for what feels like years now. They simply don't have the money, just look what a hash they made of Poolaris. It's so expensive to make chips now that NV claims to have spent $7B on a die shrink of Maxwell.
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Sorry, what do we know? Maybe I missed something but all I'm aware of in terms of official data is AMD's own benchmark, which showed Zen marginally outperforming Broadwell-E clock-for-clock. Obviously they're going to show a best-case scenario but that's still much better than "sub-Ivy Bridge"; where does that come from?
 
~>Dg<~ said:
my logic is flawed that in the last 15 years they havent once been out in front ? :confused:

is that not as logical as it gets ?

they arent shouting because they dont need to. why ? because it sits in the same place that all AMD cpus sit in. bargin platfrom.they arent going for the crown.some think they are.theyre not they just improving performance in the bargin sector which they sell to.

if it was faster than intel products you think they wouldnt be screaming about it ? of course they would. youd be marketing the hell out of how you got the better processor at a cheaper price. it would be a massive thing.

yet look we talking passively about it.with a touch of hope.
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OK for the sake of peace I will agree with you but I hope you eat your own words when AMD produce a CPU product next year that is not "Budget" as you put it.

Side note: You keep banging on about the last 15 years. I believe the Athlon 64 CPUs were out within the last 15 years and were faster than the P4s. Maybe someone can correct me.
 
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