Any news on 7800 xt?

[Sgt_Major]

I've been having to use dlss bit more now my card is aging, and I flicked obsessively between fsr and dlss and found dlss better, would I pay high premium extra for it no , but would I pay like £50 more yes

If AMD really want to change mind share they need to offer something really really good, not just good , the upscaling/ RT that's one reason they price lower but they need to be more aggressive unless they can also catch up with them features

Its not just DLSS being better.

From my experience Nvidia drivers are more reliable, and playing games, some older ones too, just offers a smoother, trouble free experience, particularly on day one launch of a game.

Also from my experience, their cards are built better and last longer, I have had and seen multiple AMD cards die before or shortly after warranty. My last 2 Nivida cards, being a GTX 670 and GTX 1060, have both lasted many many years beyond their 3 year warranty, both being heavily overclocked too. Look at many AMD cards for sale on OCUK NEW!, not having a 3 year warranty, but sometimes 2 or even 1 year!, and this is not open box, this is NEW product!, even the makers have little faith in their lifespan...

AMD cards tend to always use more power and run hotter, which fits with the above, and tending to have a shorter lifespan...

 

[Grim5]

Its not just DLSS being better.

From my experience Nvidia drivers are more reliable, and playing games, some older ones too, just offers a smoother, trouble free experience, particularly on day one launch of a game.

Also from my experience, their cards are built better and last longer, I have had and seen multiple AMD cards die before or shortly after warranty. My last 2 Nivida cards, being a GTX 670 and GTX 1060, have both lasted many many years beyond their 3 year warranty, both being heavily overclocked too. Look at many AMD cards for sale on OCUK NEW!, not having a 3 year warranty, but sometimes 2 or even 1 year!, and this is not open box, this is NEW product!, even the makers have little faith in their lifespan...

AMD cards tend to always use more power and run hotter, which fits with the above, and tending to have a shorter lifespan...

Unfortunately the dlss image quality thing hurts AMD quite a lot

The reason is because it doesn't cost transistor budget. Dlss having better image quality is not because the Nvidia GPU has more transistors or anything like that and vice versa that means AMD can't catch up just by adding more transistors because FSRs image quality also is not related to transistor count.

As a whole this means Nvidia has an advantage in something that is unrelated and unaffected by manufacturing cost so this advantage simply provides Nvidia with more margin when customers will pay extra for it and that's tough for AMD to catch up to because Nvidia is getting better margins so they will have higher cash flow for more RnD to make stuff like Dlss even better and even harder for AMD to catch up

 

[humbug]

Difference in tone.

RTX 4080 review key words:
Mixed feelings
A very impressive product
While i absolutely love the performance and features its hard to get too excited when i know you guys have to stump up the $1200 asking price (can't even bring himself to say its over priced)
The 4080 would have been "Excellent Value" at $900 (still not)

7900XT review key words:
There is no reason to buy the 7900XT, it needs to be at least $200 less than the XTX.
It would have been something we could have recommended at $800, as it is you might as well just get the 4080 with superior RT and DLSS. (LOL)
The only advantage the 7900XT has is 20GB VRam, but honestly the 16GB on the 4080 is more than enough (really trying to sell that £1200 4080 here)
I have been so disappointed with the 7900XT that i have requested all AIB's refrain from sending me theirs as i have no interest in covering them (wow)
And with that i'm done with this review.
Please like this video.

 

[Troezar]

The smart move is buy what best fits your needs and budget at the time. I've moved between them as the market changed. I see very little in it, they both work, both cost more than a few quid now. I wanted a 7800XT, AMD took forever to release it and the 6950XT came up for a price and performance that NVidia couldn't compete with. I had a 1070 and a 3060Ti when AMD were lacking. Whatever AMD are thinking they are no where near Nvidia mindshare. Ryzen should tell them that it takes years of offering some compelling before you make you name in this space. I'd just cut my range and sell some good midrange cards for a good price in volume, leave Nvidia to the halo cards and APU's for the budget end.

 

[humbug]

The smart move is buy what best fits your needs and budget at the time. I've moved between them as the market changed. I see very little in it, they both work, both cost more than a few quid now. I wanted a 7800XT, AMD took forever to release it and the 6950XT came up for a price and performance that NVidia couldn't compete with. I had a 1070 and a 3060Ti when AMD were lacking. Whatever AMD are thinking they are no where near Nvidia mindshare. Ryzen should tell them that it takes years of offering some compelling before you make you name in this space. I'd just cut my range and sell some good midrange cards for a good price in volume, leave Nvidia to the halo cards and APU's for the budget end.

No one really challenges Nvidia's sociopathically deceptive marketing, it doesn't matter what AMD do they will never gain the sort fo market share where they can take a 20%+ hit below Nvidia, margins that would be quite thin so they would need that 40% share.

Until some one says Nvidia marketing is all but a lie and DLSS is not worth a significant premium AMD will never do a Ryzen in the GPU space because AMD will never give over 30% of the GPU's rasterisation die space to get 10% better looking upscaling. How the #### did we get to the situation where we think Nvidia doing that is a good thing?

 

[humbug]

That's the problem, we think Nvidia pushing us off with lower res fake frames in place of rasterisation and at a premium is great.

 

[Sgt_Major]

That's the problem, we think Nvidia pushing us off with lower res fake frames in place of rasterisation and at a premium is great.

No one cares about fake frames or DLSS3, just regular DLSS2 is superior to FSR2.

Also, none of the above matters, reviews do not matter. What matters is the fact if users have a better gaming experience on Nvidia, then that's that. And for this people will pay a bit more.

AMD refuse to not put themselves right alongside Nvidia as a 1-1 competitor, when they do not offer the same quality. They simply do not want to take market share, and refuse to be the value proposition, right now they basically cost the same or close enough. Also, they are ALWAYS late, they NEVER launch first. Like I said many times, where was their 7900XT for £700 a year ago? before Nvidia 4000 series, nowhere, and when it did come it was overpriced rebadged and should have been a 7800XT for £650-£700.

I do not care what HUB say on youtube or any other reviewer, I do not need their input to know, from a customers perspective, MY perspective, AMD ae their own worst enemy and NEVER give me as a customer, a compelling reason to buy their product.

 

[humbug]

No one cares about fake frames or DLSS3, just regular DLSS2 is superior to FSR2.

Also, none of the above matters, reviews do not matter. What matters is the fact if users have a better gaming experience on Nvidia, then that's that. And for this people will pay a bit more.

AMD refuse to not put themselves right alongside Nvidia as a 1-1 competitor, when they do not offer the same quality. They simply do not want to take market share, and refuse to be the value proposition, right now they basically cost the same or close enough. Also, they are ALWAYS late, they NEVER launch first. Like I said many times, where was their 7900XT for £700 a year ago? before Nvidia 4000 series, nowhere, and when it did come it was overpriced rebadged and should have been a 7800XT for £650-£700.

I do not care what HUB say on youtube or any other reviewer, I do not need their input to know, from a customers perspective, MY perspective, AMD ae their own worst enemy and NEVER give me as a customer, a compelling reason to buy their product.

In what way is it a better gaming experience on Nvidia?

 

[Sgt_Major]

In what way is it a better gaming experience on Nvidia?

It offers a more stable, trusted gaming experience. Nvidia have MINDSHARE. This is probably factual, performance and reliabiliy wise, but there is also the psychological factor.

People feel more "secure" and "safe" with a Nvidia GPU in their system, it's what has always been there for them, reliably running their games smoothly and without issue.

For AMD to break through that they need to offer a "too good to be true/pass deal", and they refuse to do that, so they will continue to be looked over and treated as a lower tier product.

Nvidia is premium.
AMD believe they are premium, they price themselves as premium, after always coming to market AFTER Nvidia.

They do not know how to run a GPU business.

 

[Joxeon]

they are ALWAYS late, they NEVER launch first

They don't know the price until Nvidia has set it this is why they will never launch first, You can bet if the rumours of an RTX5000 delay into 2025 are true then AMD will almost certainly delay RDNA4.

 

[Troezar]

It offers a more stable, trusted gaming experience. Nvidia have MINDSHARE. This is probably factual, performance and reliabiliy wise, but there is also the psychological factor.

People feel more "secure" and "safe" with a Nvidia GPU in their system, it's what has always been there for them, reliably running their games smoothly and without issue.

For AMD to break through that they need to offer a "too good to be true/pass deal", and they refuse to do that, so they will continue to be looked over and treated as a lower tier product.

Nvidia is premium.
AMD believe they are premium, they price themselves as premium, after always coming to market AFTER Nvidia.

They do not know how to run a GPU business.

It mostly runs on people just buying what their mates buy. I've seen no material difference between them. Most issues in both directions seem to be the clueless not knowing what they are doing installing drivers or using underpowered PSU's or other basic mistakes. I see resale on Nvidia being a factor because the masses buy them and want them, just like iPhones. As you say it's not a real reason. The average consumer is unthinking, does no research and has no interest in the detail. The herd instinct is strong and is why so much overpriced rubbish is sold to people. I agree AMD will struggle to break that unless they offer those deals you mention, then as time goes buy you raise prices as your mindshare grows. They know this they have done it with Ryzen. Their attention must be elsewhere...

 

[humbug]

It offers a more stable, trusted gaming experience. Nvidia have MINDSHARE. This is probably factual, performance and reliabiliy wise, but there is also the psychological factor.

People feel more "secure" and "safe" with a Nvidia GPU in their system, it's what has always been there for them, reliably running their games smoothly and without issue.

For AMD to break through that they need to offer a "too good to be true/pass deal", and they refuse to do that, so they will continue to be looked over and treated as a lower tier product.

Nvidia is premium.
AMD believe they are premium, they price themselves as premium, after always coming to market AFTER Nvidia.

They do not know how to run a GPU business.

I think all of that is psychological, AMD and ATI before them have tried, it didn't work, it got ATI bankruptcy.

People only want cheaper AMD cards so they can buy cheaper Nvidia cards, If AMD always have to be 30% cheaper all Nvidia have to do is wait until AMD are out of money, that's exactly what they did to ATI.

 

[Klo]

All I can say at this point is, AMD are incompetent and have no idea how to run a GPU business.

Also, RDNA 3 is the last time I even remotely get hyped for a GPU launch, and will now assume all AMD GPU launches will be far below expectations, overpriced at launch, buggy drivers and making **** poor price/performance gains, oh and a year late to the party.

As far as I am concerned AMD are dead to me, and I will just wait and continue to use this GTX 1060 6GB until Nvidia offer me better price/performance, without skimping on Vram or offering me a cut down rebadged DIE.

Nvidia screwed me over for ages, and AMD had PLENTY chances to take my money, but they rejected it at every opportunity, instead choosing to match Nvidia's dodgy tactics.

So since they are just as bad as Nvidia, I might as well wait and buy the better GPU.

Nvidia make me a better priced/performance GPU and I will buy it, unless Intel has something to surprise me with, price & performance and driver wise it better be amazing and I will give it a go!

But AMD?, you cried wolf too many times, go get ***ked, shut down you're GPU division, could'nt care less anymore....

You shouldn't get so emotional over a company.

Just buy the best product for you at the time. I go AMD because I hate the feeling of being ripped off, and with Nvidia I feel that more than AMD. But if you don't feel that, get whatever you need.

 

[Sgt_Major]

They don't know the price until Nvidia has set it this is why they will never launch first, You can bet if the rumours of an RTX5000 delay into 2025 are true then AMD will almost certainly delay RDNA4.

Yeah and that is just ONE of their problems. It's also anti consumer by AMD, instead of offering a product at a fair price where they profit and the customer gets a good value, they wait to see what overpriced Nvidia card will launch, then proceed to overprice their own product too, but just later...

Imagine if AMD launched 1-2 months before Nvidia, with a 7900XT being the 7900XTX for £850 and a 7800XT being the 7900XT for $650. They would have sold like hot cakes and been OOS for months, who cares what Nvidia was going to do or price their product. A company that always waits for their competitor to move first has zero confidence in their own product, so why should consumers have confidence in them?...

Also, AMD never commit, they never actually buy enough allocation of wafers to supply enough cards, so even if they did launch first, with a good product at a good price, their stock would be an issue....

Like I said, AMD are a 2nd rate GPU business overall, they do not take themselves or the market seriously, so why should customers take them seriously?

 

[humbug]

Yeah and that is just ONE of their problems. And is anti consumer by AMD, instead of offering a product at a fair price where they profit and the customer gets a good value, they wait to see what overpriced Nvidia card will launch, they proceed to overprice their own product too, but just later...

Imagine if AMD launched 1-2 months before Nvidia, with a 7900XT being the 7900XTX for £850 and a 7800XT being the 7900XT for $650. They would have sold like hot cakes and been OOS for months, who cares what Nvidia was going to do or price their product. A company that always waits for their competitor to move first has zero confidence in their own product, so why should consumers have confidence in them?...

Also, AMD never commit, they never actually buy enough allocation of wafers to supply enough cards, so even if they did launch first, with a good product at a good price, their stock would be an issue....

Like I said, AMD are a 2nd rate GPU business overall, they do not take themselves or the market seriously, so why should customers take them seriously?

This assums AMD can chose to launch before Nvidia, i don't think it works like that, if it did Nvidia could chose to launch the day after.

 

[eeii]

Back on topic videocardz have an article on the 7800xt on Mobile at the mo so cannot link with my sausage fingers

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Back on topic videocardz have an article on the 7800xt on Mobile at the mo so cannot link with my sausage fingers

AMD RDNA3 GPU family has finally been pictured together - VideoCardz.com

AMD Navi 3X GPUs as presented by PowerColor Thanks to the leak from PowerColor, we can now take a look at the full Navi 3X lineup. The full disclosure of the RDNA3 desktop lineup was nearly complete, with only one GPU missing – the Navi 32. However, a recent leak from PowerColor confirmed that...

videocardz.com

PowerColor leaks Radeon RX 7800 XT Red Devil, Navi 32 with 3840 cores and 16GB confirmed - VideoCardz.com

Red Devil RX 7800 XT has been revealed by PowerColor PowerColor has made a huge mistake by revealing their Radeon RX 7800 XT graphics card before AMD. The new RX 7800 XT Red Devil graphics card boasts a new RDNA3 GPU equipped with 3840 Stream Processors, just as many cores as the last-gen RX...

videocardz.com

The RX7800XT will use Navi 32,which is the replacement for Navi 22 used in the RX6700XT. The RX7800XT will have only 60CUs against the RX6800XT which has 72CUs because its made from the larger Navi21 chip. It has the same number of CUs as the RX6800 non-XT. The RX7800XT appears to have a boost clock speed around 400MHZ~450MHZ higher than an RX6800,which is around 20% higher. So unless the RX7800XT can boost to around 3GHZ,it looks like RX6800XT level performance!

I really hope it is faster than an RX6800XT by a decent amount. All I can see them do is price it lower than the RX6800XT,and close to an RTX4070 and have a technical victory!They can spin its 20% faster than an RX6800 and cheaper than the RX6800XT!

Basically AMD have done an Nvidia and pushed the RX6700XT replacement one tier upwards.

 

[Grim5]

No one really challenges Nvidia's sociopathically deceptive marketing, it doesn't matter what AMD do they will never gain the sort fo market share where they can take a 20%+ hit below Nvidia, margins that would be quite thin so they would need that 40% share.

Until some one says Nvidia marketing is all but a lie and DLSS is not worth a significant premium AMD will never do a Ryzen in the GPU space because AMD will never give over 30% of the GPU's rasterisation die space to get 10% better looking upscaling. How the #### did we get to the situation where we think Nvidia doing that is a good thing?

If dlss looks better because it's using more transistors as you say, then why does XeSS running on amd also look better than FSR?

 

[uroboros]

Yeah and that is just ONE of their problems. And is anti consumer by AMD, instead of offering a product at a fair price where they profit and the customer gets a good value, they wait to see what overpriced Nvidia card will launch, they proceed to overprice their own product too, but just later...

Imagine if AMD launched 1-2 months before Nvidia, with a 7900XT being the 7900XTX for £850 and a 7800XT being the 7900XT for $650. They would have sold like hot cakes and been OOS for months, who cares what Nvidia was going to do or price their product. A company that always waits for their competitor to move first has zero confidence in their own product, so why should consumers have confidence in them?...

Also, AMD never commit, they never actually buy enough allocation of wafers to supply enough cards, so even if they did launch first, with a good product at a good price, their stock would be an issue....

Like I said, AMD are a 2nd rate GPU business overall, they do not take themselves or the market seriously, so why should customers take them seriously?

I think AMD have been through enough cycles now to realise that it doesn't make a difference what they do with the pricing of their products. It makes more business sense to just follow the leader with slightly lower prices to make as much profit as possible.
Why should AMD significantly reduce their prices to increase sales when the majority will buy Nvidia regardless of what they do. Just get ready for increasingly expensive GPUs gen on gen or at best minimal performance uplift for the same price.
Personally I've had more issues with Nvidia drivers and hardware over the years but neither are perfect.
I also have always preferred to support a company that isn't so dependent on built in obsolescence such as limited VRAM. What turned me off Nvidia completely was the memory scam with the 970, I've not been back since. Although the pricing for the products of either company has stopped me upgrading. I just cannot justify spending around £700 for a midrange card and the current details on the 7800XT model doesn't look much better than the 6800XT. Worst case I was hoping for at least 6800XT performance with significantly better efficiency but the specs are not suggesting that is the case if 800w is the PSU requirement

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

If dlss looks better because it's using more transistors as you say, then why does XeSS running on amd also look better than FSR?

One has to ask why is AMD using Navi 32 as the RX7800XT,which has less shaders than the previous generation Navi 21? Why not use a cutdown Navi 31?

Who is "forcing" AMD to follow Nvidia in jacking up midrange chips to high level pricing? Navi 22 used 335MM2 of 7NM silicon. Navi 32 only uses 200MM2 of 5NM silicon and each MCD is 37.5MM2. AMD could easily make something as fast as an RTX4070 for well under £500.People keep forgetting the RTX4070 was 40~45% faster than an RTX3060TI for 60% more money.It should have been a card well under £450.

Instead they price way too near to Nvidia,so Nvidia's "value added features" become a consideration. But they might give you some more VRAM. So another technical victory.

Its like saying one energy provider being 2% cheaper than the other is a deal when energy prices have been jacked up massively already.