Assange to go!

[Roar87]

You literally just said you thought he did.

I said he probably did something to the condom, but that isn't rape, it's completely morally wrong and he shouldn't of done that. How many women have been charged with rape for ripping a condom so they get purposely pregnant? Would that be rape? If not, why not?

The act of rape though is penetrating someone with your penis without consent, he had consent for the sex, so it wasn't rape. You could argue that there should be a separate crime for not using protection but that crime shouldn't be rape, it's not the same severity and diminishes rape as a crime in general.

 

[StriderX]

I said he probably did something to the condom, but that isn't rape, it's completely morally wrong and he shouldn't of done that. How many women have been charged with rape for ripping a condom so they get purposely pregnant? Would that be rape? If not, why not?

The act of rape though is penetrating someone with your penis without consent, he had consent for the sex, so it wasn't rape. You could argue that there should be a separate crime for not using protection but that crime shouldn't be rape, it's not the same severity and diminishes rape as a crime in general.

Misleading the woman is rape if they were only doing it with protection, this isn’t difficult. If it was credible that she agreed regardless, that’s up to the court.

The fact is if he had gone to trial, proven his innocence, this wouldn’t be a issue.

 

[Roar87]

Misleading the woman is rape if they were only doing it with protection, this isn’t difficult. If it was credible that she agreed regardless, that’s up to the court.

The fact is if he had gone to trial, proven his innocence, this wouldn’t be a issue.

I don't think he was hiding in the embassy because of the Swedish charges funnily enough, even if he was guilty a few years in Swedish prison isn't exactly a big deal. He was quite obviously hiding to avoid extradition to the US for obvious reasons. Any self respecting liberal should not want him extradited on the grounds of releasing documents showing war crimes being committed, even Comrade Corbyn agrees with me on that, I finally found some common ground with the guy.

 

[Mr Jack]

I said he probably did something to the condom, but that isn't rape

Funnily enough your opinion is not legally relevant. Legally carrying out a non-consensual sex act is rape.

 

[Roar87]

Funnily enough your opinion is not legally relevant. Legally carrying out a non-consensual sex act is rape.

Yet a man wouldn't be prosecuted for rape if he proved a woman did that? Correct?

 

[Jokester]

Yet a man wouldn't be prosecuted for rape if he proved a woman did that? Correct?

You know this isn't an effective defense for Assange right?

 

[Roar87]

You know this isn't an effective defense for Assange right?

We aren't in court Jokester, we're discussing his crimes and whether what he did should constitute rape. I'm suggesting what he did is substantially no where near as bad as actual rape, I don't disagree that Sweden, given it's the incredible sway towards Feminism and Women's rights, would charge him with rape based on what he's done.

 

[Jokester]

We aren't in court Jokester, we're discussing his crimes and whether what he did should constitute rape. I'm suggesting what he did is substantially no where near as bad as actual rape, I don't disagree that Sweden, given it's the incredible sway towards Feminism and Women's rights, would charge him with rape based on what he's done.

Actual rape? err, right I'm out of this now.

 

[Roar87]

Actual rape? err, right I'm out of this now.

It's probably a good idea considering you seem to struggle with nuance

 

[Jokester]

It's probably a good idea considering you seem to struggle with nuance

Well you seem to struggle with what constitutes rape which is a bit worrying to be honest.

 

[Roar87]

Well you seem to struggle with what constitutes rape which is a bit worrying to be honest.

Why is it worrying, are you trying to suggest because I'm discussing the differences between severitys of sexual crime that I might rape women? Top level debate!

 

[Mr Jack]

We aren't in court Jokester, we're discussing his crimes and whether what he did should constitute rape. I'm suggesting what he did is substantially no where near as bad as actual rape, I don't disagree that Sweden, given it's the incredible sway towards Feminism and Women's rights, would charge him with rape based on what he's done.

I think it'd be helpful if we had better language to describe different grades of sexual offence, but that doesn't meant that Assange doesn't deserve significant jail time for the acts of which he is accused. I'm not familiar with the Swedish system but in most systems this kind of thing is dealt with by sentencing guidelines that consider mitigating and aggravating factors.

 

[-UnderClocker-]

I think Assange is right to be suspicious of the US and it's intentions. After all, he has plenty of proof of how far the US will go to get what it wants. It's obvious that the US will bend or break the law to achieve it's goals, which now includes getting hold of him.

 

[TJM]

It's probably a good idea considering you seem to struggle with nuance

Here's some nuance: consent to have protected sex with a man is not consent to have unprotected sex with him under English or Swedish law.

 

[Roar87]

Here's some nuance: consent to have protected sex with a man is not consent to have unprotected sex with him under English or Swedish law.

I haven't really disagreed with that, I said it wasn't the same as rape and also a woman wouldn't be prosecuted or viewed as a rapist if she did the same thing

 

[Werewolf]

Here's some nuance: consent to have protected sex with a man is not consent to have unprotected sex with him under English or Swedish law.

This to be honest.

Also consent to have sex once, given whilst awake is not consent to be woken up at some random time by that person having sex with you again regardless of if you're sharing the same bed.

I'm disappointed that adults are having problem with the idea of consent.

 

[dowie]

Agree with the condom thing but re: the other there is implied consent too.

Like if you have sex with a girl and then a few hours later have the nice, welcome feeling of being woken up with a BJ... should that stop now, because technically you haven't explicitly consented to any follow up yet and really she ought to wake you first and get you to verbally affirm that you consent to her doing that etc...

Where does the line get drawn? I mean if you've literally just had sex with that person and are together naked in bed then there is a sort of implied permission to at least initiate round 2 though of course that can be withdrawn at any time. Granted just sticking it in while they're asleep is rather dodgy and probably does cross the line, initiating foreplay though perhaps not....

 

[Jokester]

Pretty sure the line is drawn at her being unconscious.

 

[stockhausen]

Well you seem to struggle with what constitutes rape which is a bit worrying to be honest.

"Worrying" about how far you can abuse a woman without legal complications is one thing.

When someone (presumably male) appears to express concern about the possibility of being raped by a woman that goes way beyond "worry"

 

[Sankari]

I think Assange is right to be suspicious of the US and it's intentions. After all, he has plenty of proof of how far the US will go to get what it wants. It's obvious that the US will bend or break the law to achieve it's goals, which now includes getting hold of him.

But what exactly is he afraid of, apart from prison time? He's not a terrorist, they're not threatening him with a decade in Gitmo. His capture was achieved legally, and if he's extradited that'll be legal too.