What you saw today, is typical F1. Overtaking has always been difficult.
If you want more overtaking, you need to make cars narrower, not wider. The aero does need to be reduced, though.
Bahrain Grand Prix 2010, Sakhir - Race 1/19
- Thread starter Duke
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What you saw today, is typical F1. Overtaking has always been difficult.
If you want more overtaking, you need to make cars narrower, not wider. The aero does need to be reduced, though.
The limited engine rule is just as bad, someone commented earlier that Hamilton should slow down to conserve his engine - that's just not racing... there was a time when F1 was all about lapping every single lap as fast as possible and overtaking anyone in your way, how did it turn into a namby pamby fight to babysit the car to the end of the race without a hope in hell of getting passed anyone?
It seems like everything the FIA introduce is "anti-racing".
It seems like everything the FIA introduce is "anti-racing".
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Soldato
LOL at how god damn awful that "Race" was.
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Dull, wasn't it?
I hope to God the racing gets more interesting as the season progresses
I hope to God the racing gets more interesting as the season progresses
Buttons race was ruined by his qfy. He lost all his time due to being stuck behind a slower car. I dont believe he would have been that far off hamilton had they been directly placed next to each other on the race track. After all neither him or hamilton made great inroads. Hamilton just had a bit more clean air and a far better qually. Hamilton was not reeling people in anymore than button was.
Yet again there's no way for a faster car to get close, so they just sit on second behind to save tyres.
You compare that to Alonso but the ferrari is a better car and only had one car bulking his pace. You lose far more time when your cars slower and your way down.
I'm wondering if we're looking at perhaps a similar start to last season.
A pair of very good teams (Ferrari/RB compared to Brawn/RB last year) with Red Bull threatening all the time, especially with Vettel, but ultimately faltering with niggles and mistakes that let Ferrari pull a lead. Meanwhile McLaren and Mercedes squabbling for the remaining places.
A pair of very good teams (Ferrari/RB compared to Brawn/RB last year) with Red Bull threatening all the time, especially with Vettel, but ultimately faltering with niggles and mistakes that let Ferrari pull a lead. Meanwhile McLaren and Mercedes squabbling for the remaining places.
Can't sya i'm at least surprised with the sever lack of over taking. Nothing even in midfield which is usually pretty busy.
No refuelling, was never going to create overtaking unlike what most people thought. Cars are just to heavy and as such have to nurse, brakes, engines and tyres.
Only way we will see a bit more over taking is if teams start doing two stops.
great result for Ferrari and I was surprised I was actually cheering when they over took Vettle. Think Red Bull is my new most hated team. Or maybe Mercedes as they have MS. Shame webber did so bad.
No refuelling, was never going to create overtaking unlike what most people thought. Cars are just to heavy and as such have to nurse, brakes, engines and tyres.
Only way we will see a bit more over taking is if teams start doing two stops.
great result for Ferrari and I was surprised I was actually cheering when they over took Vettle. Think Red Bull is my new most hated team. Or maybe Mercedes as they have MS. Shame webber did so bad.
I said this all along last year. When they introduced re-fuelling in 1994, they did it to make the races mroe exciting. IMO, it worked.
Without refuelling, the overtaking that would normally happen during the pitstops, has also been taken away.
In 2010, it would appear that as long as you are one of the first 3 cars to make it into the first corner of the race, and don't make mistakes, you will get a podium. This was the problem pre-1994 and given the dependence on aerodynamic downforce in 2010, the problem is even worse now than it was in pre-1994.
No refuelling = boring races. I think even MS said the same thing in a round about way - when your car is so heavy, you are limited with the way you can drive and overtaking is nigh on impossible, unless the car in front is much much slower than you are.
Apart from the odd race I've always said there has been enough overtaking in f1 in recent years and that if you want out and out over taking you are watching the wrong sport.
I think ,many pf the issues with f1 is with regulations on development. They have been restricting mechanical development, this is totally the wrong end to restrict.
They should be allowing mechanical development which can filter down into road cars or other industries, whilst restricting aerodynamics.
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Even when they were both in clear air Hamilton was consistently the quicker of the two, by around half a second or more, Button was clearly outpaced today.
On saying that, he should improve over the season, but I really don't see anything to indicate that he has the ability to challenge Hamilton, extremely good as a number 2, and in the right car at the right time he proved last year he could win the title, but Hamilton is just better...
Soldato
Some eagle eyed viewing by someone to spot on the rear view camera a bit flying off Vettels car!
Good stuff from Ted as well showing where the bits come from.
Good stuff from Ted as well showing where the bits come from.
Qualifying pace is VERY important. Especially now. This is part of the make up of a driver.
If you are the fastest race car driver, but the slowest car driver, overall, you will not be able to win races. You have to be fast in qualfiying and fast in the race. The best drivers (Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel), all meet these requirements. As you have pointed out, Button does not.
Also, a lot of you stated that, the heavy fuel loads are going to work against Hamilton and work for Button. Today, we saw no evidence of that. What we did see is Hamilton out qualify his team-mate (which is what he did to Heikki). And in the race, we saw Hamilton get a podium, while Button languished in 7th place (which is what Heikki used to do).
Heikki came for some serious criticism last year. I stuck up for Heikki stating that the reason why Heikki is looking bad is not because he is bad, but because Hamilton really is that good.
I also stated that the only way to see a team-mate up close to Hamilton, in terms of speed/lap-times/points, would be to re-introduce Alonso back into the team. Button will just get beaten up, just as Heikki did. Vettel may also give Hamilton a close run at McLaren. I don't see any other drivers in F1 in the same category.
I stand by all those comments and saw nothing this weekend that will change my mind. The only dissapointing thing is that while Hamilton does battle with Alonso (which I'm sure we will see this year), Button won't be fighting with Massa, as he just isnt fast enough.
One thing that I've noticed about Button is that when the car is "perfect", he does get the most out of it, but when the car is even slightly less than perfect, Button falls behind very quickly. In particular we saw this in the 2nd half of last year when he was falling behind his team-mate, as the car seemed to lose its balance.
Agreed. 100%.
Why does everyone hate Red Bull?They're one of the few teams on the grid with a bit of character about them among a sea of boring corporate behemoths.
RedBull are great. They are a small team and are competing against teams with much larger budgets. They have nurtured Vettel and now that he is peaking, they are going to get some great results this year. The only problem for them is that Ferrari have produced a good car and have Alonso.
Its got nothing to do with how heavy the cars are that makes a lack of over taking. Why are ONE race is everyone all of a sudden clinging to that notion?
Last year had about 4 interesting races from the whole year. Most years are like that.
Regardless of fuel levels this will always be the case until they sort out Aero against mechanical grip. All multi fuel stops did was not allow a faster car to get stuck for more than 20 laps.
There was plenty of over taking prior to fuel stops coming in and no one cried too hard about starting on a heavy car.
Last year had about 4 interesting races from the whole year. Most years are like that.
Regardless of fuel levels this will always be the case until they sort out Aero against mechanical grip. All multi fuel stops did was not allow a faster car to get stuck for more than 20 laps.
There was plenty of over taking prior to fuel stops coming in and no one cried too hard about starting on a heavy car.
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Red Bulls budget is huge as is the amount of people they employ. They are far from a small team.
I like red bull but for some reason vettel gets up my nose with his german smugness. That no1 finger wagging action he has is right up there with the MS gay jump.