Bakers refuse Gay wedding cake - update: Supreme Court rules in favour of Bakers

The Geezer said:
The Equality Act says otherwise, if you are open to the public and providing a public service then follow the law. Simples really
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Just because something is legal does not mean its right. Slavery was legalized at one time as well and homosexuality was illegal as well, doesn't make either of them were right or ethical. Equality laws are the only oppression in this scenario.
 
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TheLegendOfMart said:
You're on the wrong side of history. What're you going to do when homosexuality is fully protected by law and true equality happens?



You're the dense one if you think you can't separate the two. The person behind the counter accepted the order to make the cake, it's the manager/owner that then phoned up the client to say no.
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That is irrelevant. There was no issue until the gay activist that was probably going around looking for a bakery that would refuse to make a silly gay cake to make a big scene about it, in order to ramp up public discussion about the topic of gay marriage. So because some selfish gay man didn't get the cake he wanted he literally sought to ruin the business and lives of a humble Christian couple.

What do you have to say about that? you say that is perfectly fine. So what more is there to discuss.
 
anything I don't mind said:
No it is not because the bakers have no power to prevent gay marriage or to prevent the gay from being gay. All they have (should have) power over was deciding what messages they will put on cakes that they make. It is the gay that are taking the denial of a message on a cake as an attack on their entire identity and rights as human beings.
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Read the judgement the Ashers would have provided a cake promoting heterosexual marriage they refused to promote homosexual marriage. Not quite equal is it ?
 
The Geezer said:
Read the judgement the Ashers would have provided a cake promoting heterosexual marriage they refused to promote homosexual marriage. Not quite equal is it ?
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I never made the claim that it was equal.

What i said was that the bakers should have the right to make the cakes that they want to even if that means they discriminate in doing so.
 
anything I don't mind said:
In my opinion it is far worse of a thing to force a gay maker to make a cake that he does not want to, regardless of the reason. Than it is for a cake maker to refuse to make a cake with a message than they disagree with.
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Worse for a bigot to have to do something against his bigotry than for someone from a persecuted group to be denied service for their sexuality?

Why?

Why should we protect those who wish to treat some groups differently, and deny them rights, above protecting the groups they wish to discriminate against?
 
The Geezer said:
There we have it bring back the dark ages :rolleyes: What's wrong with viewing every member of society as equal to one another
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So because a baker doesn't want to make a cake that endorse bum sex we are back in the dark ages? you don't think that is a taking it a bit extreme?

I think asking government to force your opinions about sexuality on to other people is exactly what the gays had a problem with in history. So they are hypocrites. They spent 100s of years trying to get their sexual activity seen as socially acceptable, now that they have that, that is not enough. Now they want gay cakes and anything else they can think of that reaffirms their identity.

Society is made up of individuals with different values and principles. Not everyone in society thinks the same about everything. The way you speak of society completely ignore this fact. You speak as if one day that was it, now everyone has to like bum sex because of equality? It is illogical.
 
anything I don't mind said:
So because a baker doesn't want to make a cake that endorse bum sex we are back in the dark ages? you don't think that is a taking it a bit extreme?

I think asking government to force your opinions about sexuality on to other people is exactly what the gays had a problem with in history. So they are hypocrites. They spent 100s of years trying to get their sexual activity seen as socially acceptable, now that they have that, that is not enough. Now they want gay cakes and anything else they can think of that reaffirms their identity.
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Seriously what is your fixation with 'bum sex', do you refer to heterosexual couples (vagina sex) in such a derogatory manner ?

Equality is not a big ask, if you offer a service to one section of society why can't that exact service be offered across the board ?
 
cheesyboy said:
Worse for a bigot to have to do something against his bigotry than for someone from a persecuted group to be denied service for their sexuality?

Why?

Why should we protect those who wish to treat some groups differently, and deny them rights, above protecting the groups they wish to discriminate against?
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It is the principle of it. From my experience principles is not something that gay people have. They tend to be the opposite to one that has principles and values. Of course that is a generalization and there are probably gay people with principles. But with the nature of homosexuality and the history of it, i have found through my experience that gays lack any principles. They have an "up for anything" attitude. Not everyone is like that and gays should respect people's prudishness as much as they want their debortuary to be respected and it is not a matter of moving with the times. Its like in the future their won't be people that are reserved.

A quote from Thomas Sowell explains what i mean by the principle of it.

"What is ominous is the ease with which some people go from saying that they don't like something to saying that the government should forbid it. When you go down that road, don't expect freedom to survive very long."

When you start asking/expecting government to force people to do things that they don't want to because of your personal preference, that is a slippery slope and don't expect freedom to last very long. Where do you draw the line? Will the government be able to force people to do business when they don't want to in future off the back of this incident?
 
Mod request to change anything I don't mind's name to anything except the gays? Saving me reading through pages and pages, did the bakery simply say 'sorry we can't do the cake' or did they reply that they going to hell for their sinful lifestyle?
 
The Geezer said:
Seriously what is your fixation with 'bum sex', do you refer to heterosexual couples (vagina sex) in such a derogatory manner ?

Equality is not a big ask, if you offer a service to one section of society why can't that exact service be offered across the board ?
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Homosexuality is fixated with bum sex not me, that is all that its about as far as i am aware. Its like homosexuals don't like talking about bum sex because they are in denial about what homosexuality is about. They like to pretend that its about an identity and all this other non sense, when its not, all its about is sex that has no biological purpose. Its pure debauchery by its standard definition, sex for sex sake. This is why i struggle to understand how bum sex can find its way to a legal case about a cake. Fine, i accept that making homosexual illegal is extreme and I accept that people should not be judged negatively for their sexual preference but what i don't accept is that its some kind of identity that needs to be represented in society and that people who are not in favour of it have to be forced in to supporting it.

You keep misrepresenting the scenario by saying it is a matter of equality. I am saying that it is a matter of the business owners right to do business with whoever they want. This should supersede any non sense about equality. The customer clearly could have gone some where else and got his gay cake or they could have accepted a cake without a message. Either way they could have purchased the cake and not made a big deal about it and they could have enjoyed equality. I am sure there are 1000s of people who requested cakes in the past that were refused their cakes for all types of reasons. Why is the issue of homosexuality so important that it needs the quality commission involved?
 
I'm straight if I had ordered the same cake at the same baker and they refused, I assume nothing would come of it?

I wouldn't be able to win in court as they haven't discriminated against me.

Is that equality?
 
anything I don't mind said:
It is the principle of it. From my experience principles is not something that gay people have. They tend to be the opposite to one that has principles and values. Of course that is a generalization and there are probably gay people with principles. But with the nature of homosexuality and the history of it, i have found through my experience that gays lack any principles. They have an "up for anything" attitude. Not everyone is like that and gays should respect people's prudishness as much as they want their debortuary to be respected and it is not a matter of moving with the times. Its like in the future their won't be people that are reserved.
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anything I don't mind said:
Homosexuality is fixated with bum sex not me, that is all that its about as far as i am aware. Its like homosexuals don't like talking about bum sex because they are in denial about what homosexuality is about. They like to pretend that its about an identity and all this other non sense, when its not, all its about is sex that has no biological purpose. Its pure debauchery by its standard definition, sex for sex sake. This is why i struggle to understand how bum sex can find its way to a legal case about a cake. Fine, i accept that making homosexual illegal is extreme and I accept that people should not be judged negatively for their sexual preference but what i don't accept is that its some kind of identity that needs to be represented in society and that people who are not in favour of it have to be forced in to supporting it.
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Quoting for posterity :D
 
anything I don't mind said:
Homosexuality is fixated with bum sex not me, that is all that its about as far as i am aware. Its like homosexuals don't like talking about bum sex because they are in denial about what homosexuality is about. They like to pretend that its about an identity and all this other non sense, when its not, all its about is sex that has no biological purpose.
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I have not once mentioned bum sex or said anything about being gay other than once in nearly 1500 posts. I am not defined by where I like to stick my winky.

You seem to have some weird issue/fixation with gay people and what they get up to.

I don't want "special" rights, I just want the same rights that you have when you marry the person you love.
 
My god, man. Being gay IS NOT about having sex! This is why you can't comprehend it. I'm glad I understand that now.

If you can't get past the understanding that homosexuality is about relationships, not sex, then you're blinding yourself intentionally.
 
Guys, calm it down or I'm just going to close this thread. It's descended in to childishness with the name calling and references to "bum sex". Just grow up.
 
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