Baroness Thatcher has died.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:00

Castiel said:
There was no overtime, there are bonus payments and I mentioned them, there are also several payments relating to wet weather working, this is all mentioned in the byline of the article ..however how his pay is structured doesn't alter the point raised about his overall weekly average for the partial year however.

I would also point out that there is no indication which job this chap did...it was pointed out earlier that Face workers earned substantially more than underground or surface workers for example....as Buffetslayer points out, this is not definitive, it is however the best we have.

LOL, oops Castiel did it again, here's what it ACTUALLY says.

One of our web site viewers has kindly sent in a Pay Slip from the first week of Jan 1984. I have removed his name and check number due to his personal details. If you take all payments and deductions into account it's a poor wage for working a full week on the coal face [night shift] in wet conditions and this includes his incentive pay.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:02

Castiel said:
rhetoric....pointless rhetoric. The point was conceded because it was anecdotal, it was conceded long before you got all belligerent. Quit acting like a child and take you victory with good grace, I conceded the figure, is it really that important to you that you feel the need to throw a street-party over it...perhaps a full page advert in the Times would be appropriate...

Why thank you, it is sweeter when your adversaries attempt every trick in the book to get off their self made hook. Take MY advice don't embark on a very dodgy argument, if it seems implausible usually it is.

Castiel · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:18

newbiejim said:
Why thank you, it is sweeter when your adversaries attempt every trick in the book to get off their self made hook. Take MY advice don't embark on a very dodgy argument, if it seems implausible usually it is.

what are you babbling on about now...since when are we adversaries, since when has my argument been dodgy, the £800 figure was conceded right at the beginning of the discussion...if you actually read what I have said you will see that the payslip actually supports the premise that miners were better paid than the average person...take nkatas wage as a civil engineer for example..if this payslip is an example of a poorly paid miner, then he is still significantly better paid than a civil engineer...which is indicative of the point raised that you refuted...it also matches almost exactly with buffetslayers figures which you also vehemently refuted.....if anything this payslip doesn't do your argument much good either....if we take this as some sort of competition, as you clearly do, then the actual winner is buffetslayer, as he called it correctly.

As for taking your advice, I don't think that you are in a position to give any, given the way you conduct yourself.

Castiel · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:19

newbiejim said:
LOL, oops Castiel did it again, here's what it ACTUALLY says.

erm...you have just basically repeated what I said, by quoting the very byline that I referred to. :confused:

semi-pro waster · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:23

Enough of this. The argument is going round in circles - at this point I don't care who thinks they are right, to keep going on about the same points and bringing them back up over and over again is tiresome. Either you can stop the petty bickering and debate something substantive or posts will be getting deleted at the minimum.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:32

semi-pro waster said:
Enough of this. The argument is going round in circles - at this point I don't care who thinks they are right, to keep going on about the same points and bringing them back up over and over again is tiresome. Either you can stop the petty bickering and debate something substantive or posts will be getting deleted at the minimum.

Can I respond in one post to Castiel's last posts?

Robbo · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:37

No. That'll do.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:38

Robbo said:
No. That'll do.

No one asked you. I am merely requesting in good faith if I can respond.

Faustus · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:38

Let's move it on to the now infamous chart record! For me it shows once and for all that the beeb is an organ of the state. Their sycophancy over the last week has been truly sickening. Even Thatcher die hards are now questioning the BBC's stance. It's as though they consider they got it so wrong with Saville that this is almost penance.

semi-pro waster · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:38

newbiejim said:
Can I respond in one post to Castiel's last posts?

If it's going to be something pedantic or is about point scoring then no. There has been too much of that in this thread already.

If you've got something that moves the debate forwards then by all means post that but rehashing old points doesn't cut it for that purpose.

Robosapien · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:40

Castiel said:
As for taking your advice, I don't think that you are in a positron to give any, given the way you conduct yourself.

I don't know, I think he is in a bit of a hole (that he has dug for himself). Some might even say pit.
Thought it was the negative charges that conducted themselves in any case.

In the words of Mike Skinner, let's push things forward:-

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=24109226&postcount=1775

asim18 · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:42

Well we can all agree that her death has caused OCUK World War #817.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:42

semi-pro waster said:
If it's going to be something pedantic or is about point scoring then no. There has been too much of that in this thread already.

If you've got something that moves the debate forwards then by all means post that but rehashing old points doesn't cut it for that purpose.

No problem, I understand. I will refrain then as I was going to score some massive points.

Robosapien · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:45

asim18 said:
Well we can all agree that her death has caused OCUK World War #817.

“I don't know what weapons will be used in world war three, but in world war four people will use sticks and stones.”

― Albert Einstein, Autobiographical Notes

Robosapien · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:48

I think science should basically govern everything. If it's not science it's basically pseudo-intellectualism - invented nonsense. I also think I should be in charge of everything.

e:- Funny post wasn't funny.

newbiejim · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:48

Faustus said:
Let's move it on to the now infamous chart record! For me is shows once and for all that the beeb is an organ of the state. Their sycophancy over the last week has been truly sickening. Even Thatcher die hards are now questioning the BBC's stance. It's as though they consider they got it so wrong with Saville that this is almost penance.

I find it difficult to dislike the BBC, I LOVE Radio 4, I LOVE quality BBC documentaries. I think it is difficult for them as a state organisation. I can see that this track may cause distress to the family and from that perspective I cant say that the BBC is doing a bad thing here, BUT it's only a stupid thing that is now getting much more publicity due to this. I dunno.

Hagar · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:50

asim18 said:
Well we can all agree that her death has caused OCUK World War #817.

Agreed,

We will not see a similar conviction politician for a generation. Concensus sems to be the watchword. Even with the current crop of austerity measures there is no huge rebellion and maces flying in the commons. Very gentlemanly.

Probably each half century someone comes along to stir things up. This is no bad thing in a democracy where politics can be stagnant.

Biohazard · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:53

BuffetSlayer said:
Yes in as much as he said miners earned a lot more than anyone else. I think the amount he alluded to is questionable - and I have already stated that in a previous post. I said the £300 per week figure would maybe be possible given bonuses and OT - but the higher figures do not seem reasonable.

Well, from the various sources I have seen (most of which I have posted, but some I can't) the concensus so far seems to be that in the mid 80's miners wages were around £190 per week, which according to the post I made earlier is approx 25% higher than the manufacturing industry.

Also, looking at the data, historically miners were paid more than the 'manufacturing' industry throughout the 70's as well. So as an indicator of if they were high paid, I have to conclude that in relation to other industry the answer must be yes. As high has been claimed? I doubt it, but then I have already made my position about that clear a few pages back.

With regard to them being 'greedy' I think asking for over a 25% pay increase when you alread earn 25% more than the manufacturing industry ( I should note that the scope of 'manufacturing' is not defined) then it could be viewed as a 'greedy' approach. It does certainly appear that they were asking for special treatment. That said, I have said all along, due to the nature of their work, and the hitorical dangers that it is fair to say they should earn more. But that much more? it does seem a fairly unreasonable demand.

I have no argument there. But do you really think it is definitive?

What's your opinion on the special treatment and pleading now?

Macro · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:54

newbiejim said:
No problem, I understand. I will refrain then as I was going to score some massive points.

Wow, you just don't seem to be able to stop yourself from trying to get one over someone and making things personal. You win the internetz, can we get away from the ego massaging tedious pedantic showboating now please... Sheesh...

Biohazard · 12 Apr 2013 at 22:55

Faustus said:
Let's move it on to the now infamous chart record! For me it shows once and for all that the beeb is an organ of the state. Their sycophancy over the last week has been truly sickening. Even Thatcher die hards are now questioning the BBC's stance. It's as though they consider they got it so wrong with Saville that this is almost penance.

The BBC is going to have some questions to answer after the indyref irrespective of the outcome to be honest. The complaints from foreign ministers and Holyrood committees and their own complaints process can't be ignored - "not news"- for ever.