BBC possibly to drop F1 coverage...

realscot · 14 Dec 2011 at 07:46

Some people are saying Brundle is out of touch with current F1 tech etc and he has to keep turning to DC for help. I think that's all about sharing the job commentating, i'm pretty sure 99% of the times he asks DC a question he already knows the answer, he simply asks what he assumes the public would be asking.
I actually feel that there is a little hate forming in here towards MB, probably just a few bitter people feeling cheated that he's leaving to go to sky (yep those that are crying at having to pay for sky to watch all races live)

Skeeter · 14 Dec 2011 at 08:36

Of course MBs questions to DC are planned for the benefit of the audience, the presenter asking the expert is a well used method for multi person commentary teams.

MB does have a habit of complaining that things were better 'back in my day' which is getting tedious though. But other than that, I think he's great.

GravyMonster · 14 Dec 2011 at 08:59

Kevin Clark said:
Ben Edwards confirmed now as the BBC's commentator in 2012

Good stuff.

The only downside is now who do ITV4 get to commentate on BTCC?

englishpremier · 14 Dec 2011 at 09:30

ps3ud0 said:
This is my viewpoint, MB just isnt the F1 expert he once was and without his involvement as a F1 manager, he has apparent limited visibility of F1 behind the scenes IMO compared to someone like DC and his continued role with Red Bull.

The amount of times DC has corrected MB isnt a lot (or when MB defers to DCs opinion), but they tend to be new developments, so it does make me think who would I want to hear as the F1 expert in commentary. It really doesnt sit well with me that the considered F1 expert is so relatively long in the tooth, for the record, Im not a fan of MW for the same reasoning. I have grown tired of picking things up far more quickly than the commentary team because of the F1 tracker and other aids the public now has to watch with the races...

Obviously there are other facets to MBs appeal, like his gridwalks or his awkward questioning technique, but again EJs more than got that covered - hell Ive wanted him to do the gridwalks for a while just to see the trouble he gets into! How often have we seen EJ on the F1 Forums just wonder off and literally drag people to have a chat, or go off on an innane tangent for JH to reel him in. We tend to forget who he is and treat him more like that awkward, embarrasing uncle; but those F1 connections he does have give some real gravitas in the kind of people he can get in front of the camera or the probing questions hes happy to ask, while most will just ponder and consider their livelihood...

Perhaps its because I have entrenched investment in the BBC F1 team (we all watched them grow into the presenting team they now are and personally Im anti-Sky so have that bias anyway) but it really does make me think that the supposed talent MB will bring to Sky F1 channel isnt the coup de grace most think it would be...

Simply put Id rather watch JH, DC and EJ than anything the Sky have put together. It was Sky potentially breaking that front-of-house relationship that I was most worried about, not watching full live races, for me, isnt the biggest loss as I tend to tape them and watch at my leisure and who here has never said 'Well that turned out to be a boring race', but enjoyed the pre/post show and the F1 Forum...

I wont comment on the remainder of the Sky F1 team other than Steve Ryder really should be in a Remington hair commercial...

ps3ud0

If the commentators didn't say anything that us seasoned fans didn't already know, say or shout out at the TV, then they would never speak at all.

With the live timing running, the commentators have never provided any insight that I wasn't already aware of or had just told the GF.

Mr Men · 14 Dec 2011 at 10:37

realscot said:
Some people are saying Brundle is out of touch with current F1 tech etc and he has to keep turning to DC for help. I think that's all about sharing the job commentating, i'm pretty sure 99% of the times he asks DC a question he already knows the answer, he simply asks what he assumes the public would be asking.
I actually feel that there is a little hate forming in here towards MB, probably just a few bitter people feeling cheated that he's leaving to go to sky (yep those that are crying at having to pay for sky to watch all races live)

+1

arknor · 14 Dec 2011 at 10:52

dc is pretty useless when it comes to f1 tech tbh

Zuban · 14 Dec 2011 at 11:06

http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/house_of_commons/newsid_9658000/9658723.stm

2hours 7 minutes in they question the director general on the sky f1 deal, lots of um, um, um lol.

Skeeter · 14 Dec 2011 at 11:10

Thinking about this on the train this morning (god I have an exciting life), I think one key thing about MB is his neutrality, and what that brings (or doesn't bring) to his commentary and other features.

He is not affiliated with any team, so there is no bias in what he says, and also there is no reluctance from certain teams to talk to him.

And then on the flip side, he is an ex F1 driver. Just look at the wide range of cars he has driven over the years as features for the F1 show, including driving the Pirelli test car to give a real insight into how the new tyres behave. I doubt very much that this would have happened with other members of the comentary lineup who are very much associated with specific F1 teams (DC, Davidson, Chandhok, etc), and its not like you could stick Leggard or Crofty into an F1 car and ask them to do a days running to provide insite into tyre behaviour.

I think MB is a valuable asset for F1 coverage, and I agree that some of those complaining he's rubbish are fueled by feeling bitter or cheated now that he's gone to Sky.

Martin Brundle and Ted Kravitz are the 2 key players in the lineup, and I imagine they were right at the top of Sky's list.

Lopéz · 14 Dec 2011 at 12:58

Skeeter said:
Thinking about this on the train this morning (god I have an exciting life), I think one key thing about MB is his neutrality, and what that brings (or doesn't bring) to his commentary and other features.

He is not affiliated with any team, so there is no bias in what he says, and also there is no reluctance from certain teams to talk to him.

And then on the flip side, he is an ex F1 driver. Just look at the wide range of cars he has driven over the years as features for the F1 show, including driving the Pirelli test car to give a real insight into how the new tyres behave. I doubt very much that this would have happened with other members of the comentary lineup who are very much associated with specific F1 teams (DC, Davidson, Chandhok, etc), and its not like you could stick Leggard or Crofty into an F1 car and ask them to do a days running to provide insite into tyre behaviour.

I think MB is a valuable asset for F1 coverage, and I agree that some of those complaining he's rubbish are fueled by feeling bitter or cheated now that he's gone to Sky.

Martin Brundle and Ted Kravitz are the 2 key players in the lineup, and I imagine they were right at the top of Sky's list.

I don't often agree with your F1 posts in their entirety, but in this case I do.

Kravitz and Brundle would undoubtedly have topped the SKY shopping list and I will miss them tremendously from the BBC coverage next year.

We have to remember that the majority of the commentary isn't *really* for hardcore enthusiasts. Obviously in some sports this is not the case, and the commentary can get very technical and this alienates casual viewers.
If you turned on the Wimbledon final (for example) having no clue of what a tennis match involved you would be utterly bewildered.

I think Brundle strikes a decent balance. Of course we know his questions to DC are "staged" for want of a better word, but for the benefit of the more casual viewer, it's a great way of bringing in the second voice and stimulating the audio debate.

gsf600y · 14 Dec 2011 at 13:20

Lopéz said:
If you turned on the Wimbledon final (for example) having no clue of what a tennis match involved you would be utterly bewildered.

Tennis is just sticks and balls

Regarding comments about Brundle being out of touch, yes, maybe that's true with the latest technologies in the cars, but the guy still understands what the cars are doing and can spot things that commentators like Legard and even Murray couldn't.
I think the sport is crying out for some energy and excitement in the commentary, whilst still maintaining decent technical level. This sort of commentator keeps everyone happy.

Example, I know **** all about the rules of Rugby, but Bill McLaren made the sport amazing to watch.

Edit: Lopez, we reforming the OcUK GPL League when iRacing releases the Lotus 67?

ps3ud0 · 14 Dec 2011 at 14:10

To defend my point, its my opinion its fine to have MB as the lead commentator, but I just couldnt take him seriously as the F1 expert anymore - perhaps Im just too used to his juxtaposition at the BBC and his efforts involved in getting comfortable with that. To me the Sky F1 commentary team just seems to have 2 very good commentators.

My own impression is that DC probably far more informative than MB has been for many years (I havent failed to see his coloured bias though) and unlike some I quickly tire of standard bearers, especially when they become incompetent; I for one dont put people like MW on a pedestal!

And to anyone who thinks Im bitter about Sky, I suggest they have alook at my many previous posts on the matter as youll find Im far more bitter about the BBCs involvement than anything else in this ordeal...

ps3ud0 :cool:

Tweaker · 14 Dec 2011 at 14:12

It is interesting for MB, the 2 reasons he is going to Sky are the money and the on air time. But on a BBC Vs Sky day, the viewing figures could be shocking in regards to sky, so will he actually be doing work that everyone is going to see.

Lopéz · 14 Dec 2011 at 14:48

gsf600y said:
Tennis is just sticks and balls

Edit: Lopez, we reforming the OcUK GPL League when iRacing releases the Lotus 67?

Haha!
Only if MasterSkooter signs up so I'm not consistently last. I found a couple of the old race reviews on an old HDD recently, great fun!

"Down goes the flag and all thoughts of "taking it easy" are immediately forgotton. SJ on pole in the Brabham cant match the speed of GSF600y's Ferrari starting in 3rd, and is soon overtaken. I dont like bragging, but quite frankly I kicked arse. Lizard King also gets a blinder of a start, but lets not take any glory away from GSF600y. "

Hahaha, we ALWAYS used to say we were going to take this one easy in WinVROC. It never happened!

gsf600y · 14 Dec 2011 at 15:51

Lopéz said:
Hahaha, we ALWAYS used to say we were going to take this one easy in WinVROC. It never happened!

"ok, yeah, lets take it easy, no one wants to crash on lap one, good luck all, take it easy now, steady through T1, nice and easy........"
[flag drops]
....WHAM! SHIFT+R! SHIFT+R! SHIFT+R!

(Sorry for the off topic reminiscing)

LizardKing · 14 Dec 2011 at 16:03

gsf600y said:
"ok, yeah, lets take it easy, no one wants to crash on lap one, good luck all, take it easy now, steady through T1, nice and easy........"
[flag drops]
....WHAM! SHIFT+R! SHIFT+R! SHIFT+R!

(Sorry for the off topic reminiscing)

Erm, yeh i'm sorry about all that

Weebull · 14 Dec 2011 at 18:39

Zuban said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/house_of_commons/newsid_9658000/9658723.stm

2hours 7 minutes in they question the director general on the sky f1 deal, lots of um, um, um lol.

Wow, that's pretty damning, considering his admission that they never considered asking Channel 4 (or at least, decided not to), and that he wouldn't rule out doing the same for other sports.

When he talked about viewing figures, it's made me think that maybe that was actually one of the major reasons behind the deal, not just how much cash Sky would cough up (I know they don't get advertising money, but the fact that BBC1 is the most popular channel is still a useful stat when it comes to renegotiating the license fee).

Whilst Sky Sports is undoubtedly a successful operation, it's a fact that the main channels still pull in more viewers. Cricket, for instance, might make more money from being on Sky, but it doesn't get as many viewers. If the Beeb had sold the rights to live games to C4, they'd have not only lost the hardcore F1 fans, but most likely the casual types that will, under the current scheme, probably watch the highlights on BBC1.

If you had to lose 100% of your viewers for a programme, or just (say) 50%, which would you choose? Obvious, really, isn't it.

arknor · 14 Dec 2011 at 19:02

whos looking forward to the 75minute highlights of teh first race ROFL........
they could have atleast done a full race rerun for the first race of the season

Duke · 14 Dec 2011 at 19:26

Zuban said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/house_of_commons/newsid_9658000/9658723.stm

2hours 7 minutes in they question the director general on the sky f1 deal, lots of um, um, um lol.

Not even a grilling really

ps3ud0 · 14 Dec 2011 at 20:48

arknor said:
whos looking forward to the 75minute highlights of teh first race ROFL........
they could have atleast done a full race rerun for the first race of the season

Why would Sky ever let them have the first race? Thats their lightbulb moment. Hell I would be ensuring they had more installers and job tasks available for the following fortnight...

ps3ud0 :cool:

Skeeter · 14 Dec 2011 at 20:50

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if the BBC live races have more to do with what Sky let them have than what the BBC want to show.