Surely the outcome of the case will rely on the legal status of the child's gender. If their birth certificate says they are a girl and there is no legal document to counter that, how can he possibly be in the wrong?
Boy removed from school in transgender rights row
- Thread starter antijoke
- Start date
Surely the outcome of the case will rely on the legal status of the child's gender. If their birth certificate says they are a girl and there is no legal document to counter that, how can he possibly be in the wrong?
Caporegime
There’s no such thing as a gender certificate, it’s just a social issue, and really doesn’t go beyond the social contract of what is essentially just politeness and courtesy. If she’s asked to be referred to as a boy, and presumably the school has said that’s ok, then it’s an issue of him failing to address her as such. This is the point at which it gets suspicious, because I find it hard to believe that all this could blow out of one instance of the teacher referring to her as a girl. The parents have complained and there’s been some sort of finding against him. Now maybe you can believe that a school would find against a teacher based on one mistaken remark, but I’m not buying that. Now he’s countersuing for whatever reason, but given that his statement is that as a Christian he doesn’t buy the notion of transgenderism, I’d say he’s on to a hiding to nothing.
As an aside, it’s curious that people will happily laud him for “standing up to” transgender issues given that the same mindset would probably mean he’s similarly vehemently homophobic. Do you think people should be standing up to homosexuality?
Man of Honour
Considering that you have just done worse than he did (you wrote "her", not "him", i.e. you referred to them as being gendered feminine), you should have more sympathy for him. You "misgendered" them far more clearly than he did, since you referred to them individually and specifically as being gendered feminine (and you did so repeatedly) and he said "well done girls" to a group of girls, one of whom wants to be gendered masculine.
I have no idea why you wouldn't buy it. The crux of the issue is power. They have far more power than him, so it's not even surprising that the school would find against him.
I'd praise him for standing up to bullying, which is what I see this as being based on the available evidence. I also see no indication that he has a pathological fear of homosexuality, which you claim he probably has. If his attitude towards an ideology of homosexualism is the same as his attitude towards an ideology of transgenderism and the accompanying nonsense about sex being gender and a whole slew of gender/sex stereotyping, I don't care. I would agree with him on that, but even if I didn't my answer would be the same because I don't require everyone to obey me in how they feel and think or even in what they say. If he thinks that homosexuality is a sin (and bear in mind that there's no evidence of that), I still wouldn't care. He can think I'm a sinner all he likes as long as he doesn't impose it on me. He can say so too, in some contexts, and I would speak in favour of him being able to do so. I support freedom of speech and the whole point of that is for me to support the expression of speech I don't agree with.
Soldato
The pupil that that got offended over this absolute nonsense needs to grow a pair of balls.
The difference is one requires others to change their behavior to suit the other, the other does not.
If you're gay, so what, it doesnt require me to change anything I do around you. This gender nonsense insists that others alter their behavior to accommodate the individual, which imho is unacceptable.
The line should be very clear that the person can state they have a preference to be refereed to as X Y or Z but if someone doesn't, then XYZ has no right to complain.
Caporegime
Ok, point scored, but only insofar as I’ve made an honest mistake in discussing their/his/whatever-makes-you-happy’s plight, the same as he claims he did. However, as said, I suspect his transgressions against him go rather further than that, given how far this has gone.
Angilion said:
But why should they? Why would the school find against him if they didn’t think he’d done something wrong? Why hang a perfectly good teacher out to dry? What do they gain from that?
Angilion said:
Bullying of whom? The teacher? Well, sure, then I’m sure the CLC will succeed in their suing... I doubt that will happen, though.
I’m not sure I follow some of the earlier parts of this paragraph, but anyway... Freedom of speech is somewhat curtailed in a school setting, yes? Teachers can’t say whatever they want in class without repercussions. He might have issues with the notion of transgender people, but he doesn’t get to bring those to work with him.Angilion said:
Last edited:
That depends if he's just a simple gay or a militant homosexualiser. Some homosexuals actually want people to change things they do. They want to exibit their homosexuality at every possible opportunity. Don't forget that gay wedding cake debacle where the militant homosexuals basically FORCED a poor baker into doing something he just didn't want to do.
Caporegime
Har har.
As said, I suspect there is substantially more to this than one remark, but we’ll probably never know.
In what way is he wrong, tho?
Wrong to hold beliefs which prevent him validating a student's wish to select their own gender?
Wrong to say, "Well done, girls" to the group of (biological) females? Even if done with no intention to offend (ie, said without giving the particular student any consideration, because it's the obvious thing to say, that 99% of us would have said without thinking).
Wrong to believe he's been unfairly dismissed?
Wrong for failing self-flagellate after making the unforgivable mistake of triggering a pupil and posing a threat to the established liberal group-think?
Man of Honour
I see what you did there!
I am sexed male. I no longer care about gender, since it's 99% fake and 1% trends that are irrelevant to any individual, but when I was younger I gendered myself masculine. I was also often gendered feminine by other people, who mistook me for being female. I was never offended. Why should I be? Someone else made a mistake that had no effect on me and I never felt any urge to use that to inflict harm on them. It was an understandable mistake - I had an androgynous appearance overall but my voice and hair were such as would reasonably cause someone not paying attention to conclude that I was female. Of course, it was a much less understandable mistake than in this case, where the person is female.
Even now, I'd be better looking as a woman than I am as a man. Facially, anyway. Back then, as a young man, I had a feminine figure too. Now, I don't.
Man of Honour
So, as I said, you should have more sympathy for him.
Less trouble.
A more powerful person wants one thing, a less powerful person wants something else. The two are mutually exclusive. The school gains by siding with the more powerful person, or at least loses less by doing so. This is politics - it's entirely about power.
So do I, but success has nothing to do with right and wrong. It's about power.
1) He hasn't said he has issues with the notion of transgender people. He's said he has issues with an ideology, which isn't the same thing.
2) Whatever aspect of the issue he objects to, he's said he doesn't bring it to work with him. That's why he refers to people by name and uses ungendered pronouns.
But I wasn't talking about a school setting and neither were you when you switched from gender to a hypothetical scenario about homosexuality (which is what I was replying to).
Caporegime
Honestly, listen to yourself. You really think there is some established liberal group think at work? Of course there isn’t.
I'd like to know which bible passage this belief comes from.
Conservative Christians often mistake their conservative beliefs for their religious beliefs.
Caporegime
I would have, if I thought it was an isolated honest mistake as he claims, but I don’t believe that.
Caporegime
It’ll be genesis 1:27, male and female he created them. That’s about all they’ve got to work with.
Sure there is. It's all over Facebook. Filling pages the Guardian and echoed in the halls of the BBC.
Liberal group-think is here already. You daren't argue with it or you're a racist, xenophobe, right-wing... (etc)
It's why children as young as 3 are being taken to health workers with "gender identity" issues. By their parents!
e: And you know what's causing some of this? The modern liberal idea that you win an argument by preventing opposing viewpoints from being aired. "De-platforming" I believe it's called. Silence any dissenting opinions or people who challenge your world view. And so you end up with this circle-jerk that we have in universities now, where only the militant liberal voice can be heard.
Liberal group-think is defo alive and well in 2017.
Last edited:
Man of Honour
They're right. Of course there is an established group think at work and it is identified by its followers and others as being liberal despite the fact that it's exactly the opposite of what used to be called liberal. They have succeeded in usurping and corrupting the word "liberal" so completely that it's no longer usable with its previous meaning.
There isn't a single defined leader and organisation, but the ideology is established in the usual way - power. Since the ideology is utterly authoritarian, the acquisition of power and use of that power to suppress dissent is its core value. That's why followers do everything to suppress dissent - propaganda, false accusations of <insert bad thing here>, demands that all organisations they can control (most important of which are the universities they control) forbid dissent, screaming and shouting to prevent what they decide is wrongthink being spoken, social media campaigns of lies and false accusations in order to use financial pressure to force compliance to their demands from organisations they can't directly control, rioting and property damage to force organisations to comply with their demands and assault on anyone and everyone they decide is guilty of wrongthink.
Soldato
Don
Yeah, in my day this was just called people being themselves. Labelling anyone and everyone transgender just because they don’t follow gender stereotypes doesn’t seem particularly helpful or a particularly healthy idea when applied to children.
Permabanned
There's no law about gender. You can go up to a guy and say "you're a girl lololol" and it's not illegal.