Brazilian Grand Prix 2012, São Paulo - Race 20/20

Saw that video at work and didn't realise there was a commentary to it too. That guys gone to a lot of effort. Perhaps the FIA should take him on as a steward?

Edit: actually, give him McNish's job, he certainly knows more about whats going on. I agree with the point about why they felt the need to tell the drivers the track was slippery. I'm fairly sure they could notice that without the aid of a light :p
 
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MilanoChris said:

Long video, but goes into it in quite a bit of detail.
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according to what I've seen on other forums there is a marshalls station at the start of the straight where he overtook the toro rosso, and it doesn't have a light but the marshall was waving a green flag, which overrules the lights apparently. oh well fun while it lasted.
 
Zuban said:
according to what I've seen on other forums there is a marshalls station at the start of the straight where he overtook the toro rosso, and it doesn't have a light but the marshall was waving a green flag, which overrules the lights apparently. oh well fun while it lasted.
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Look at the lights on his wheel.
 
What's the point in going on about this. It looks dubious, but it makes naff all difference. Nothing is going to change. Can we all just move on with our lives. Vettel is still a **** and Alonso is still knob. End off.



Williams rock.
 
Zuban said:
according to what I've seen on other forums there is a marshalls station at the start of the straight where he overtook the toro rosso, and it doesn't have a light but the marshall was waving a green flag, which overrules the lights apparently. oh well fun while it lasted.
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MilanoChris said:
Look at the lights on his wheel.
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Its possible, but unlikely, that there was a significant delay in the lights going off on his wheel.

Either way the pass was facilitated by the TR slowing considerably, so I assume this is what the FIA used to decide to let it go.
 
MilanoChris said:
Look at the lights on his wheel.
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yeah but even though the lights were on on his wheel, they were passing a marshalls station with a waved green flag, which takes precedence over the lights.

this is the station apparently, and there is no fixed light there, just flags. this was lap 3, apparently they were waving a green flag on lap 4.

http://i46.tinypic.com/2n7o1hs.jpg
 
Hang on, whose Williams is that? In all this frantic racing and following chatting have I completely missed an incident that happened at turn 1? I thought Senna went out at turn 4 and stopped shortly after? Meaning that must have been Maldonado? How did I miss that? I did wonder why there were yellow flags there :rolleyes:. Fool.
 
leaskovski said:
Williams rock.
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They used to rock...some 15 years back.
But they failed to move with the times.
Other teams moved ahead, making lucrative commercial tie-ups, to fund their ever costly car development programmes.
They were unable to keep their star employees (eg Newey and all all their World Champion Drivers - every WDC they had, left the team, after winning the title).
They are now a team who rely on drivers bringing sponsorship money into the team.

Williams could probably become great again, but they will need to do serious work on their commercial arm. As an example, McLaren have arguably the best commercial department in F1. I routinely see adverts on the telly, showing the McLaren F1 team (their drivers and their cars). I've also seen RBR appear on adverts on the telly. I have never once...not once...seen an advert on telly, featuring a Williams car/employee. They missed a massive trick when they allowed 4 WDC to leave them, in 92, 93, 96 & 97.
 
Zuban said:
actually cant remember, but here is another picture, which is them having changed the flag to green, and its still lap 3, infact the cars in the first pic have just gone past the camera in this second pic. its really hard to see though.

http://i49.tinypic.com/212bl1c.jpg
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Nice find. Thats either Vettel or the Toro Rosso he's about to pass at the back of the shot coming out of turn 3.

His lights were definately still on until after the green light at the end of the straight. Maybe the points in the track that dictate the lights on the wheel are only at the points with lights? Meaning the green light was the first electronic point he passed after the yellow flag zone, hence why his wheel lights went out, but the zone actually ended back at that marshal post?

Genuinely don't know now. I wish the stewards investigation details were made public after the race :(

Hmm.. I wonder if they flash up that track graphic with the yellow flag zone shown on it at all... off to iPlayer.
 
Ah, no, I'm mistaken. He actually overtakes a Marussia that lap. the Toro Rosso overtake must have been lap 4, well after the point in time that that flag was changed to green, so all looks like it was a perfectly fine overtake, but a delay on his wheel lights changing.

I wonder if they are linked only to the 'electronic' marshal points, and not to the flag only ones?
 
i havent a clue, but going by what others are saying the wheel lights are in sync with the electronic marshal points, but there are more marshal points than the electronic ones, and flags overrule the lights.
 
They don't show the mini map graphic unfortunately, but watching the race back and those pics from Zuban make it clear that the green flag comes out at that marshal post on lap 3, just as Vettel is going past, and he then promptly pops out and round the Marussia in the exact same spot that he then passes the Toro Rosso a lap later.

It must be a delay in the lights on his dash changing that is possibly caused by them only being triggered by the electronic boards and not at every marshal post? There are a number of marshal posts around that track that do not have a corresponding electronic board, and as Zuban said, the flags take precedence.

http://www.fia.com/en-GB/sport/championships/f1/2012/brazil/Pages/circuit.aspx
 
Zuban said:
i havent a clue, but going by what others are saying the wheel lights are in sync with the electronic marshal points
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Sounds like thats the case:

http://www.emmotorsport.com/products/f1ms

Race control can then manage the trackside Marshalling Light Panels through a graphical user interface which will also automatically send flag signals to the in-car dash mounted Marshalling LEDs, providing an essential safety system in the event of an incident
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The technology of the whole F1 Marshalling and Race Control thing looks really clever actually. Some interesting stuff on that site.
 
well that's the season finally over for me, the jumbos came in to EMA airport yesterday and this morning with the uk based teams cars n kit and didn't realise sky took so much stuff to races, we have had almost 60 ton of there equipment took some off loading , they were still at it when my shift finished.
 
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MilanoChris said:
So do the lights in the car override the marshals flags or not?

Credible source please, rather than someone saying so on a forum.
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All the light systems are an aid to assist the flag marshals. Flags still take precedence. I'll see if I can find a source.
 
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would imagine its that way incase of issues with the light system, sticks on, doesnt go on etc, flags always overrule.
 
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