Brexit thread - what happens next

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do_ron_ron said:
We have an opt out of 'increasingly federated EU' already. All decisions in the EU are taken by directly elected members or people appointed by the governments of the countries. If you want to look at undemocratic elected look at OUR House of Lords.



That few years is going to be at least 10 years to get treaties in place before you can start and you will have had the costs of those ten years and it's effects on people's lives.



It is a huge leap in the dark and as is now becoming clear NOBODY actually thought it would happen so no plans were put in place in the event of a leave.
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Just because you sign trade treaties doesn't mean they go live immediately and reach full steam quickly. Look at Canadian and US international trade for example, or what the Swiss did with China, what's happening with SK and the EU now. It'll take years to recover and see any return if any, plus to ensure said return a separate raft of things has to come in too, and for workers that means attacks on them. As I said many times re Norway option -- we are not a social democracy backed by a sovereign wealth fund from a valuable natural resource.
 
Radox-0 said:
Personally I am just struggling to see what true democracy actually means, and what we actually get from it. See that word thrown around but what exactly can we do now that we did not before? We have a monarch which no one elected, House of Lords no one elected lots of other various roles no one elected.

Maybe I am just walking around with blinders and missing something obvious.
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Yes those House of Lords with its seats reserved for clergy and the descendants of previous monarch's gets. We still give power to these people, no other country does. Democracy, UK style.
 
The interesting thing about the Sunderland plant is that 80% of its production is allegedly exported overseas to some 130 markets. I'm sure they'll weather this monumental shift in British politics and reap the rewards of a falling currency, boosting their bottom line.
 
datalol-jack said:
Just because you sign trade treaties doesn't mean they go live immediately and reach full steam quickly. Look at Canadian and US international trade for example, or what the Swiss did with China, what's happening with SK and the EU now. It'll take years to recover and see any return if any, plus to ensure said return a separate raft of things has to come in too, and for workers that means attacks on them. As I said many times re Norway option -- we are not a social democracy backed by a sovereign wealth fund from a valuable natural resource.
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Which is what I said in the middle part of my post. Not sure if you are agreeing and expanding or did not see my point.
 
do_ron_ron said:
We have an opt out of 'increasingly federated EU' already. All decisions in the EU are taken by directly elected members or people appointed by the governments of the countries. If you want to look at undemocratic elected look at OUR House of Lords.
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Except it's not great when you hear things like this coming from one of its top tier members;

When put to her, Malmström acknowledged that a trade deal has never inspired such passionate and widespread opposition. Yet when I asked the trade commissioner how she could continue her persistent promotion of the deal in the face of such massive public opposition, her response came back icy cold: “I do not take my mandate from the European people.”
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http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...the-eu-official-in-charge-of-it-a6690591.html

Mind you, the whole TTIP thing stinks.
 
do_ron_ron said:
It is a huge leap in the dark and as is now becoming clear NOBODY actually thought it would happen so no plans were put in place in the event of a leave.
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I voted leave and I have to agree with you. There have been no celebrations since winning the referendum, in actual fact eveybody seems quite sombre and there appears to be a feeling of impending doom. I just wish the government had stayed neutral and presented the true facts of being in the EU and leaving the EU including how trade agreements worked and the difficulties in agreeing new trade deals.

I think that Juncker and his hatred of Britain and Cameron helped the leave campaign. How does a man who used to be the PM over just 500,000 people who's country has a minus net contribution have so much power?

I also think boris and gove are being very quiet, it's as though they don't know what to do now.
 
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Closing said:
Sagalout like most of the remain lot you think this is all about immigration and paying the EU a fee, this is about democracy.

Free from the EU we can start to be a true democracy again rather than a puppet state of the increasingly federated EU and it's few appointed (not democratically elected) leaders.

And we all knew there would be a few years of turmoil upon leaving, I don't understand why everybody is up in arms about it, it doesn't take a masters to work out this was going to happen.

The gamble is that after the dust has settled we are better off, I voted leave and so obviously I would bet that in due course we will be.
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We'll still have a load of old unelected fossils in the house of lords & the Queen will still have her regular weekly chats with the PM, so I hope you carry on complaining about being represented by the unelected? :D
 
After having a good drink I have come to the conclusion that the UK is ****ed, we all in for very bad times. but at least we will be free to reflect on how the **** we got there, well done UKIP, Gove and Boris....
 
Deleted member 2277 said:
I also think boris and gove are being very quiet, it's as though they don't know what to to now.
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Well that comment someone pulled from the guardian earlier in the thread could easily explain why it seems that way. Cameron probably sat down in his chair after his speech and just said "checkmate".

Disturbing really.
 
Deleted member 2277 said:
I voted leave and I have to agree with you. There have been no celebrations since winning the referendum, in actual fact eveybody seems quite sombre and there appears to be a feeling of impending doom. I just wish the government had stayed neutral and presented the true facts of being in the EU and leaving the EU including how trade agreements worked and the difficulties in agreeing new trade deals.

I think that Juncker and his hatred of Britain and Cameron helped the leave campaign. How does a man who used to be the PM over just 500,000 people who's country has a minus net contribution have so much power?

I also think boris and gove are being very quiet, it's as though they don't know what to to now.
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They don't know what to do now. And therein lies the real danger. There is no plan. There never was. They whipped up all this resentment against Brussels with no real thought about what to do because they didn't really expect to win. It was essentially a horrible bit of internal Tory party brinksmanship gone horribly horribly wrong. The political elite playing with peoples lives and wellbeing as usual.

So here we are with a referendum result that everyone expects to be put into action. But by who? When? How? In the meantime the markets are crashing, the international vultures circling and the rest of the EU is holding the door wide open for us and trying to usher us through it.

It's an unmitigated disaster, a truly British shambles. Which is why I'm deeply tired of reading "deal with it, we won". No-one won, and therein lies the problem.
 
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