China and war

[alchal]

Puppet government that is cosy to Iran...how is that ? I mean if we are in charge why let Iran in and influence them.

Pretty sure they all had the USSR flag and rules and everything else that goes with annexing a country.
All governments were commie ones that the Kremlin desired.

Trying to compare having some bases in Iraq to what China has in mind for Taiwan...lol

Make your mind up , you just told us China was more capitalist than the west,now it's crap?
Also capitalist crap = camps, killings,no freedom of thought etc?

Chairman Mao smiles down upon you .

 

[FoxEye]

Well in Beijing's mind, it has always been their land and is currently occupied territory. Might is right is what international law depends on and that's just how it is, everything else was always pretentiousness.

If they can successfully take it, it's theirs, just like Crimea.

The following article of is dubious source, and may only represent the opinion of its author.

But if there is any truth to it, then China views quite lot of the surrounding islands and other lands to be it's "historical territory". Including parts of Japan, Russia, India, Vietnam, etc..

http://www.indiandefencereview.com/news/six-wars-china-is-sure-to-fight-in-the-next-50-years/

If any of that is true it's somewhat terrifying!

e: the source is allegedly Wenweipo or ChinaNews.

 

[Malevolence]

China may have bigger things to worry about.

 

[Hagar]

China may have bigger things to worry about.

Playing Pooh sticks?

Once Taiwan and mainland China were one country under the nationalist leader Chiang Kai-shek. After the second world war there was civil war in China and Taiwan became the Republic of China and Mao Zedong ruled over mainland China expelling Chiang. In the process killing millions and impoverishing the country through re-education. Putting the intelligentsia to manual labour in the fields and forests.

So Taiwan is the original soul of China ignoring all the commie claptrap of the last seventy years and the maoist followers of the sixties like our friend McDonnell waving their little red books in the air.

My 2p worth of history.

 

[BowdonUK]

Interesting executive order on a law already passed in Congress to do with China.

The President’s Executive Order on Hong Kong Normalization
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/presidents-executive-order-hong-kong-normalization/

Trump ends preferential economic treatment for Hong Kong
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53412598

China promised retaliatory action.

Some are saying the Twitter attack was down to China.

Twitter blames 'coordinated' attack on its systems for hack of Joe Biden, Barack Obama, Bill Gates and others
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/07/15/tech/twitter-hack-elon-musk-bill-gates/index.html

It's not out of the realms of possibility considering what they did with Australia;

Chinese hackers suspected behind massive cyber attack in Australia
https://www.livemint.com/technology...cyber-attack-in-australia-11592545383344.html

Why China is being blamed for cyber attacks on Australia, and what its hackers might be looking for
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06...aunch-cyber-attack-against-australia/12374990

 

[Pudney]

So Taiwan is the original soul of China ignoring all the commie claptrap of the last seventy years and the maoist followers of the sixties like our friend McDonnell waving their little red books in the air.

My 2p worth of history.

"Original soul" is stretching things a bit... The Imperial Qing dynasty was in power until 1912 after all.

 

[Hagar]

"Original soul" is stretching things a bit... The Imperial Qing dynasty was in power until 1912 after all.

I will admit that I did ignore all prior to the early 20th century when China became a republic. The rest is a bit potted but places Taiwan and China in perspective.

 

[mmj_uk]

But they haven't. China is also not communist in the traditional sense. More capitalist than the UK

According to the US DoD lots of Chinese companies such as Huawei are run by their military, if true they are lot like Nazi Germany in that respect, companies are privately owned but the owners are merely custodians, all of the big decisions as to how the business operates are made by the all encompassing one party dictatorship.

 

[Hagar]

According to the US DoD lots of Chinese companies such as Huawei are run by their military, if true they are lot like Nazi Germany in that respect, companies are privately owned but the owners are merely custodians, all of the big decisions as to how the business operates are made by the all encompassing one party dictatorship.

China has a command economy like all totalitarian states before and since. Why Russian farmers could not buy tractors but the world was flooded with AK47 carbines. Why North Korea regularly starves but is a nuclear state. Businesses do what the state demands. Full stop.

 

[Jokester]

And if any company goes against the grain - oh look their CEO is up on corruption charges, who would have thought it

 

[DarrenM343]

And if any company goes against the grain - oh look their CEO is up on corruption charges, who would have thought it

However, they're opening up more and more to foreign companies.
China is still a developing nation & economy, something easily to forget. Some of the negatives as the West see are turning into huge positives these days while some Western nations falling over themselves. They won't tolerate any interference in their internal affairs and they state they never have any interest in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries either. Fair play to that IMO. They won't export their ideals onto others and don't expect Western ideals to be forced on them. Different cultures can still work together in harmony .

I've found the Huawei issue in the UK rather stupid too, personally, mainly as we've appeared to the outside world to change our mind due to pressure from the USA. China happy to do business with the UK but UK needs to decide what it will be. A kingdom, or USA Junior (ie, a sock puppet). They were prepared to set up a testing centre I believe which could be entirely staffed by UK nationals, to minimise security risks, hence why we were probably okay with it earlier in the year.

 

[Hagar]

It is not just hardware though, how often does windows bork their users systems, OK not many, or firmware, how often does a bios update brick a machine, again not often but possible. Manufacturer software updates are a severe risk to infrastructure especially if installed remotely. You have to have a huge trust in your supplier to allow this to occur.

 

[Jokester]

However, they're opening up more and more to foreign companies.
China is still a developing nation & economy, something easily to forget. Some of the negatives as the West see are turning into huge positives these days while some Western nations falling over themselves. They won't tolerate any interference in their internal affairs and they state they never have any interest in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries either. Fair play to that IMO. They won't export their ideals onto others and don't expect Western ideals to be forced on them. Different cultures can still work together in harmony .

I dunno, they engage in a lot of online shilling to talk up the CCP.

 

[ianh]

I dunno, they engage in a lot of online shilling to talk up the CCP.

我不明白你的意思

 

[Jokester]

我不明白你的意思

Hehehe.

 

[413x]

I don't see why China would go to war with the USA or Europe or Russia in any way other than economically. Even that would be difficult and can only be done if they have control of a scarce natural resource.

Exactly. Rich countries need a thriving world.
Trade wars yes. Actual war? No

 

[alchal]

However, they're opening up more and more to foreign companies.
China is still a developing nation & economy, something easily to forget. Some of the negatives as the West see are turning into huge positives these days while some Western nations falling over themselves. They won't tolerate any interference in their internal affairs and they state they never have any interest in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries either. Fair play to that IMO. They won't export their ideals onto others and don't expect Western ideals to be forced on them. Different cultures can still work together in harmony .

I've found the Huawei issue in the UK rather stupid too, personally, mainly as we've appeared to the outside world to change our mind due to pressure from the USA. China happy to do business with the UK but UK needs to decide what it will be. A kingdom, or USA Junior (ie, a sock puppet). They were prepared to set up a testing centre I believe which could be entirely staffed by UK nationals, to minimise security risks, hence why we were probably okay with it earlier in the year.

So no cyber attacks on other countries?
If different cultures can co exist ie western democracy types and Chinese Communist then why the hard on for conquering Taiwan and imposing all the ideology on honk Kong and taking away their freedom?
Threats and expansionist ideas in the local area?
How about the ' consequences' if we don't play ball with them?
should we stop being the US's lap dog and become China's?

 

[DarrenM343]

So no cyber attacks on other countries?
If different cultures can co exist ie western democracy types and Chinese Communist then why the hard on for conquering Taiwan and imposing all the ideology on honk Kong and taking away their freedom?
Threats and expansionist ideas in the local area?
How about the ' consequences' if we don't play ball with them?
should we stop being the US's lap dog and become China's?

Hacking is an interesting topic and being discussed apparently, especially the recent escalation (since COV19)
It's good to learn more about China's viewpoint, it does change your view somewhat, rather than just absorbing what the Western leaders and press will feed us. Our feelings will always be naturally biased. HK is China btw as it has been for the last 23 years. Our preference is that it remains as it has been/still is.
China's reaction to what they meant by 'consequences' I've found quite fair to be honest.As it's China people read too much into it. While, they do try to avoid discussing other issues so of course have to question that. We rarely get to hear the other side of the story.
Why China's lapdog? Do we really have to be one or the other? . In the Huawei example, why did we not keep to our original decision? That's not being anyones lapdog, it was a weighed up decision initially.

 

[FoxEye]

However, they're opening up more and more to foreign companies.
China is still a developing nation & economy, something easily to forget. Some of the negatives as the West see are turning into huge positives these days while some Western nations falling over themselves. They won't tolerate any interference in their internal affairs and they state they never have any interest in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries either.

Really? Really? China doesn't interfere in the affairs of others? OK, then...

Also given that China believes most of its neighbours borders need to be redrawn to cede "historical Chinese territories" back to China... yeah, they aren't exactly planning to keep themselves to themselves

 

[DarrenM343]

Really? Really? China doesn't interfere in the affairs of others? OK, then...
Also given that China believes most of its neighbours borders need to be redrawn to cede "historical Chinese territories" back to China... yeah, they aren't exactly planning to keep themselves to themselves

I know, some of it remains to be seen, don't get me wrong on that. Same goes for declaring they're a peaceful nation and not looking for any conflict, we'll find out. HK issues last year I believe they blamed on the USA for triggering that, if I remember correctly. Looking for peaceful integration (HK) and no conflict over taiwan. So, we'll see.