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China and war

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Mrwong, Jun 20, 2020.

  1. jamoor

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jun 22, 2005

    Posts: 8,635

    Location: Nottinghamshire

    My point is exactly that you don’t enter a war to lose. If you enter a war and your problems cause you to not win then you have lost. This could be due to lack of military power, lack of stamina, political support, financial or whatever.
    What we do know is that they went to defeat communism and they didn’t succeed in doing so and that to me constitutes a loss even though they were obviously superior militarily.
     
  2. viathinair

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 28, 2009

    Posts: 2,405

    Location: Ex-Londoner in Dallas or Tulsa(lol)

    So...excuses, excuses....
     
  3. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 13, 2006

    Posts: 68,943

    Not sure what your point is - I think you are misinterpreting my position.
     
  4. alchal

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 27, 2019

    Posts: 332

    Definitely doesn't seem to get it...

    We are not talking about 'wining' a war we are talking about one on one the US machine will crush the commies,it's hypothetical ,as we can't put whatever politics etc into the equation we look at the power etc of the military...from that we can see the US military (minus the political crap) did,has and would have won the conflicts if not for problems back home...

    Understand?
     
  5. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 32,508

    Location: Ireland

    Seen that Movie.

    [​IMG]

    :p
     
  6. StriderX

    Caporegime

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 25,538

    The political 'crap' can't just be ignored, otherwise there's nothing to defend. There has to be some sort of moral conviction and credibility to the conflict or the whole endeavour falls apart and you can't just ignore a loss in public support as an inconvenient burden, as that is more important than any victory in a democracy. Once you lose it, it's over.

    I doubt anyone is really suggesting that the US wouldn't have won in Vietnam, however it's impossible to remove the public from the equation, even dictatorships can't survive without the consent of their's.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  7. alchal

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 27, 2019

    Posts: 332

    I agree that the public etc has to be taken into account on past conflicts but some are saying the military itself has and would struggle to win a conflict.
    They defeated Saddam's army.
    They almost won Vietnam if not for public support.
    The Chinese would have been pushed back if not for ww2 fatigue back home.

    So military wise they would win, hypothetically and without putting politics into it .
    With politics ...I think it would be difficult,the Chinacom gov will happily lose millions, American support would go after a few large losses in my opinion and want to recall.
     
  8. Mrwong

    Gangster

    Joined: Mar 22, 2020

    Posts: 297

    American support would be dependent if it was a threat to the US or another country.
    If there was a direct threat to the US then the other country would have serious problem. I personally think the US would play by a different rules but only if there was a direct threat.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2020
  9. Smokey Deza

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 11, 2011

    Posts: 1,614

    Who got the railguns though?
     
  10. alchal

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 27, 2019

    Posts: 332

    Probably China as well with all their espionage lol
     
  11. Mrwong

    Gangster

    Joined: Mar 22, 2020

    Posts: 297

    China and India war before October 2020. I am 95% confidant this will happen with the additional pressure of Pakistan.

    When this happens you'll see the US back India when war kicks off.
     
  12. FoxEye

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 17, 2006

    Posts: 23,616

    Location: Cornwall

    If it doesn't happen you get a free name change to "Mr Wrong" :p
     
  13. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 13, 2006

    Posts: 68,943

    Dunno - India's government are a bit like the UK one - a lot of PR and popularity contest like politics, etc. and will likely run away from a fight - more like China will do a bit of like happened in Ukraine. There is a lot of potential for miscalculation however. I think in the longer run that region is going to edge closer and closer to a war no side can back away from and the backers of the different sides might be a bit surprising.
     
  14. Mrwong

    Gangster

    Joined: Mar 22, 2020

    Posts: 297

    Russia will be stuck in the middle with those two. China's land grabbing and actions will land it in a war
     
  15. Roar87

    Soldato

    Joined: May 10, 2012

    Posts: 6,584

    Location: Leeds

    If there's one thing the UK doesn't do, it's run from a fight. Every Democracy has to fight a constant popularity contest, that's not unique to India or the UK. Neither India or China want a war, so there will not be a war.
     
  16. Mrwong

    Gangster

    Joined: Mar 22, 2020

    Posts: 297

    I think China wants a war to prove they are also a military global power.
     
  17. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 13, 2006

    Posts: 68,943

    The UK maybe but this government isn't one that likes difficult action... when things get tough they tend to dissappear.

    Sure democracies are somewhat a popularity contest but in some cases it has been taken to an extreme.

    I'm not really sure as to China's position on war but sometimes due to miscalculation or a situation becoming impossible to reconcile things come to war even when no party desires it.
     
  18. Roar87

    Soldato

    Joined: May 10, 2012

    Posts: 6,584

    Location: Leeds

    Maybe, but it wouldn't be with a nuclear armed, US backed India.

    I assume you're talking about Boris going missing during Covid, I feel like there were extraneous circumstances involved there in that he was recovering from a very serious illness as well as coping with the birth of a child. Unless you've got any more examples? They actually went through with Brexit which is a step up from the previous administration.
     
  19. alchal

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 27, 2019

    Posts: 332

    Only thing China wants is Taiwan,hence the build up of its navy and especially it's amphibious capability.
    Of it builds up enough of a force multiplier then it could take it before the US can respond to help.

    The party can never sleep when there is a small piece of China that it doesn't control.
     
  20. alchal

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 27, 2019

    Posts: 332

    Only thing China wants is Taiwan,hence the build up of its navy and especially it's amphibious capability.

    The party can never sleep when there is a small piece of China that it doesn't control.