Cyberpunk 2077 Ultra performance

Rroff · 2 Jan 2021 at 05:58

nvidiamd said:
It looks cool and if you don't see weird things as you more/turn around, i don't see why i should be impressed when i see textures reflected in puddles even if they call them RT these days.
Can you build on it, like adding real time animations without seeing wierd things? Bioshock have 3 people in that pool and at least a bird animated/reflected.
Really you should try this game was so ahead of its time. The rain looks also spectacular and has nice light effects too. And it costs like 5 bucks on steam, 12 for the whole collection.

That screenshot is from someone non-ray traced DX7 based implementation of using environment maps like 20 odd years ago just demonstrating that the implementation in Bioshock Infinite isn't anything special. In wider use those techniques have significant limitations that can't be solved without ray tracing simple as.

I own Bioshock Infinite and played it through years ago.

nvidiamd · 2 Jan 2021 at 06:08

I just reloaded the game and a hummingbird was moving above the water just to prove me you can do real time reflections.

It looked ok from multiple angles, nothing weird with it.

Rroff · 2 Jan 2021 at 06:37

nvidiamd said:
I just reloaded the game and a hummingbird was moving above the water just to prove me you can do real time reflections.
It looked ok from multiple angles, nothing weird with it.

It is OK when you have a single flat plane - but those techniques are limited to rendering the scene from 1 point of view - the further along the surface you are from the origin used to render the reflection from the less correct it becomes and/or multiple objects intersecting the water surface can become increasingly inaccurate.

With ray tracing you can have complex surfaces with accurate reflections with each texel/pixel accurately reflecting from its perspective and not limited to reflecting what can be seen from the point of origin for a reflection probe.

nvidiamd · 2 Jan 2021 at 06:49

Here is a footage from Cyberpunk. It shows water ray traced.Can you highlight a feature that you won't get using Bioshock's method?

Rroff · 2 Jan 2021 at 07:04

nvidiamd said:
Here is a footage from Cyberpunk. It shows water ray traced.Can you highlight a feature that you won't get using Bioshock's method?

Bioshock's method can only be rendered accurately onto a plane - you can't use it for arbitrary geometry, it is extremely difficult to render reflections in reflections of objects in the reflection which themselves have reflections and you need to correctly handle objects which intersect and/or are behind the object you are rendering the reflection on which will break often.

You'll notice it isn't used on larger water bodies in Bioshock which are part of large complex scenes and/or is blurred so you can't see the issues where it is like you see in CP2077.

nvidiamd · 2 Jan 2021 at 07:24

Rroff said:
it is extremely difficult to render reflections in reflections of objects in the reflection which themselves have reflections

I understand that but have you noticed such things in Cyberpunk? I am not talking about what can be done with RT, i am talking about what has been done in games like Cyberpunk or Control.

keyser · 2 Jan 2021 at 09:43

nvidiamd said:
Ray tracing done right in 2013

Well you don't see yourself in the reflection and the NPC's are dumb but i bet there is another game that does this.

I remember that coz that was the scene where the framerate halved and my PC said 'if only there was a way to do this in hardware'

ICDP · 2 Jan 2021 at 09:48

keyser said:
I remember that coz that was the scene where the framerate halved and my PC said 'if only there was a way to do this in hardware'

So it's now done in hardware and the FPS still drops by 50%... isn't progress amazing?

Wrinkly · 2 Jan 2021 at 12:08

ICDP said:
So it's now done in hardware and the FPS still drops by 50%... isn't progress amazing?

Well I can't remember my frame rate from 2013, but I doubt I was hitting a capped 60 @ 1440p.

Today in Quake 2 RTX I am hitting that capped 60 @ 1440p even though I'm still using a 3770k from 2012.

CP2077 runs between 45 - 60 with RT Psycho and DLSS Quality. Not bad for a ~9yo system.

ICDP · 2 Jan 2021 at 12:21

You are not running a 9 year old system, because system implies the entire build including the GPU. You are running a modern RTX 3080 Overclocked GPU on a very old CPU. There is a difference from saying I play modern RT games perfectly fine on a 9 year old system and saying I game on a 9 year old CPU/MB/RAM combo with an RTX 3080. Ironically you are getting barely over 2080Ti speeds there because your CPU is a major bottleneck. Your system is highly unbalanced and you are leaving ~20%+ performance untapped there, even if you overclock.

Just for reference, I ran my 5900X, 3600 CL16 DDR4, RTX 3080 FE at these settings and my FPS was giving 55 miniumum. Right in line with the results here (though these are ultra rather than psycho RT).

https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/2165/bench/7.png

keyser · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:03

Cyberpunk RT performance is the usual 'make it look pretty first for the screenshots' then later comes the higher framerates. I waited to play Control RTX on newer hardware for the higher framerate and I'll probably have to do the same thing for Cyberpunk RTX. Some people don't mind playing at lower fps, (unfortunately) I need around 90 or it just annoys me. I'm just not interested in playing without RT, if its an option, I want it maxed out. And also time to fix bugs yada yada.

keyser · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:05

Technically Quake 2 RTX cripples current hardware relative to running normal Quake II you get 1000fps at 0.5% CPU and 0.5% GPU usage

Wrinkly · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:18

ICDP said:
You are not running a 9 year old system, because system implies the entire build including the GPU. You are running a modern RTX 3080 Overclocked GPU on a very old CPU. There is a difference from saying I play modern RT games perfectly fine on a 9 year old system and saying I game on a 9 year old CPU/MB/RAM combo with an RTX 3080. Ironically you are getting barely over 2080Ti speeds there because your CPU is a major bottleneck. Your system is highly unbalanced and you are leaving ~20%+ performance untapped there, even if you overclock.

Just for reference, I ran my 5900X, 3600 CL16 DDR4, RTX 3080 FE at these settings and my FPS was giving 55 miniumum. Right in line with the results here (though these are ultra rather than psycho RT).

https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/2165/bench/7.png

I know it's a bottleneck. Just haven't had the need to upgrade until now. Waiting for the 5900x/5950x to be more available, although I may wait it out for DDR 5/PCIe 5. I don't think I'm going to notice a difference in CP2077 between 45 - capped 60 and 55 - capped 60.

But it's fun to know when comparing graphics from 2013 and today that a system from 2012, remember the 3770k has it's own GPU, is still doing a good job when paired with a modern GPU in the most graphically demanding title to date.

ICDP · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:23

Then you could have saved money and got a 2080Ti cheap and your FPS would only be marginally lower.

Wrinkly · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:29

ICDP said:
Then you could have saved money and got a 2080Ti cheap and your FPS would only be marginally lower.

Oh the 2080Ti would also be held back by my old Ivy Bridge system. I almost went for a 3090 for the extra RT cores, but decided against as I don't plan on keeping it past next gen.

ICDP · 2 Jan 2021 at 13:44

Wrinkly said:
Oh the 2080Ti would also be held back by my old Ivy Bridge system. I almost went for a 3090 for the extra RT cores, but decided against as I don't plan on keeping it past next gen.

The fact a 2080Ti would also be held back at 1440p is kinda my point and would be not that much slower than your 3080 with that archaic CPU. In fact you would then be getting only slightly better performance of a 2080 with a half decent CPU because... yep the 3770K is still a GPU bottleneck.

philo-sofa · 2 Jan 2021 at 15:11

nvidiamd said:
It looks cool and if you don't see weird things as you more/turn around, i don't see why i should be impressed when i see textures reflected in puddles even if they call them RT these days.
Can you build on it, like adding real time animations without seeing wierd things? Bioshock have 3 people in that pool and at least a bird animated/reflected.
Really you should try this game was so ahead of its time. The rain looks also spectacular and has nice light effects too. And it costs like 5 bucks on steam, 12 for the whole collection.

A way you can tell is to look at a reflection within a reflection, which will almost always be blank without RT.

Not to ruin bioshock, which is epic.

K1LaW8tt5 · 2 Jan 2021 at 15:54

ICDP said:
You are not running a 9 year old system, because system implies the entire build including the GPU. You are running a modern RTX 3080 Overclocked GPU on a very old CPU. There is a difference from saying I play modern RT games perfectly fine on a 9 year old system and saying I game on a 9 year old CPU/MB/RAM combo with an RTX 3080. Ironically you are getting barely over 2080Ti speeds there because your CPU is a major bottleneck. Your system is highly unbalanced and you are leaving ~20%+ performance untapped there, even if you overclock.

Just for reference, I ran my 5900X, 3600 CL16 DDR4, RTX 3080 FE at these settings and my FPS was giving 55 miniumum. Right in line with the results here (though these are ultra rather than psycho RT).

https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/2165/bench/7.png

no way that 3770 and DDR3 is getting close to driving a 3080 a max. My 7700k (@4.8)is on its knees trying to drive a 3070 at 1440p.
In Call of Duty BOCW with ray tracing maxed I get only a ~ 5fps boost using the lowest quality DLSS Vs Off and GPU usage fluctuates between 70-90%.
CPU usage in Cyberpunk fluctuates 70-90% and the same in BOCW.

Unless its when RT+Tensor are doing their thing the GPU usage drops off?

its actually in the video posted above , with RT on GPU usage drops into the 80s in cyberpunk.

ICDP · 2 Jan 2021 at 16:28

weldon855 said:
no way that 3770 and DDR3 is getting close to driving a 3080 a max. My 7700k (@4.8)is on its knees trying to drive a 3070 at 1440p.
In Call of Duty BOCW with ray tracing maxed I get only a ~ 5fps boost using the lowest quality DLSS Vs Off and GPU usage fluctuates between 70-90%.
CPU usage in Cyberpunk fluctuates 70-90% and the same in BOCW.

Unless its when RT+Tensor are doing their thing the GPU usage drops off?

its actually in the video posted above , with RT on GPU usage drops into the 80s in cyberpunk.

Exactly this. When GPU usage drops off it is a sign there is a potental CPU bottleneck. I'm just pointing out that using an RTX 3080 with such an old CPU is like running a 2080Ti on a modern CPU. Now these settings are at Ultra RT rather than Psycho but the fact is the 2080Ti is sitting at 43 FPS min with 51 average shows his 3080 is giving only marginally better than 2080Ti performance. Ironically a cheap modern CPU and motherboard with some cheap DDR4 3200 CL14 RAM would give him/her ~25% - 30% extra performance.

To claim that the difference between 45 and 55 FPS minimums with a 60FPS cap "is not noticeable" kinda defeats the purpose of getting a 3080 in the first place.

Rroff · 2 Jan 2021 at 16:39

ICDP said:
You are not running a 9 year old system, because system implies the entire build including the GPU. You are running a modern RTX 3080 Overclocked GPU on a very old CPU. There is a difference from saying I play modern RT games perfectly fine on a 9 year old system and saying I game on a 9 year old CPU/MB/RAM combo with an RTX 3080. Ironically you are getting barely over 2080Ti speeds there because your CPU is a major bottleneck. Your system is highly unbalanced and you are leaving ~20%+ performance untapped there, even if you overclock.

Just for reference, I ran my 5900X, 3600 CL16 DDR4, RTX 3080 FE at these settings and my FPS was giving 55 miniumum. Right in line with the results here (though these are ultra rather than psycho RT).

https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/2165/bench/7.png

Dunno circumstances of that benchmark but I get better results than that anywhere I've played with a 1650 V2 @ 4.4GHz and a 3070, 1440p all settings ultra, RT ultra and DLSS quality averages 57 FPS give or take in any situation I've tested. Wonder if they are running into the situation I posted about where sometimes the game will drop to 45 FPS average for me and feel very laggy until I restart the game.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/forums/posts/34382802

EDIT: Though might be related to the SMT issues if that was run on certain AMD CPUs.