Dark Soul's: Prepare to Die Edition (PC)

Hehe I invaded someone in Anor Londo yesterday, they were so chicken they ran out the front door (towards the wide staircase, leading to the elevator) Little did they know that the only way to challenge the boss was to either get past me (doing 1000+ damage with backstabs :p) with the giants guarding the door, on to go the long way round and face the archers :D

I stood there alt-tabed for 15 mins and he didn't know what to do, he tried sniping me with bow but he kept missing, he started spamming me hate messages, good times :D
 
Super Smough can such a troll sometimes. I'm about a foot away from him and decides to use his hammer push attack which I guess is fair enough, it didn't OHKO me and I should be able to get away afterwards but no, as soon as I get up, which just so happened to be between him and his hammer, he does it again!
 
Strength and Dexterity characters are completely pointless in my opinion. Why spend 50 levels getting them to a point where the weapon you use starts to do more damage than a Lightning or Fire variant which requires the minimum stats to equip the weapons and do huge damage. That's 50 points of health/stamina/attunement slots, for barely any extra damage. I've ran them all, str/dex etc and the damage outputs are all within the same brackets.

Choose a weapon for it's moveset and nothing else, turn it elemental and put the saved points to better use elsewhere. That's my opinion anyway, you can argue that elemental weapons are weak vs elemental creatures, but they are also strong against defensive creatures whereas pure physical, scaled dex/str weapons are weak against defensive creatures, so it all evens out.

Str/dex chars are just massively gimped compared to everyone else, which tbh is something they desperately need to fix in Dark Souls 2. A character with 50 strength should do 2-3x the damage that a character with an elemental weapon does. They give up the HP/stamina/attunement for it afterall.
 
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I can see where you're coming from, and I would perhaps agree if you were just planning on doing NG and maybe NG+. My problem with elemental weapons is that their damage is capped, no matter what you do stat wise, plus they can't be buffed. That is a huge point for me, considering how most bosses are weak to the various weapon buffs you can use, and if you're going through multiple playthroughs and continue to improve your Int/Faith and increasing the damage output of the weapon buff you use, it will very quickly start to overpower the elemental weapons, by quite some distance in the end.

Of course, if you just stuck with the base Str/Dex you need for your favourite weapon and then turned it elemental, you could put those points into Int AND Faith and turn yourself into a walking magical weapon. That's also fun! :D

Edit: Just ran some basic numbers quickly....

My current favourite weapon is the Great Scythe, and with full stamina (192 Stamina), I can get 7 swings out of it before I run out of stamina. At +15 and 40 Dex, it hits for 476 damage. A +5 Lightning Great Scythe will hit for 500 damage. With 7 swings each, a +15 Great Scythe can theoretically output 3332 damage (476*7), while a +5 Lightning can output 3500 damage. So even with 40 Dex, it still doesn't hit harder than the elemental version.

Here's where it gets interesting though. As I'm a Dex/Faith build, I have 40 Dex and the Sunlight Blade miracle. With 40 Dex and the Canvas Talisman, I have a magic adjustment of 190. Using the Sunlight Blade miracle, which is Lightning damage, I can add an extra 342 damage per swing to my weapon (Magic adjustment of 190 * Miracle Adjustment of 1.8). With a +15 Great Scythe and the Sunlight Blade miracle, I can output a total of 5762 damage with a full stamina combo (818*7). That's over 2000 extra damage in a full combo.

Of course, those numbers don't take any damage resistances into effect, but it does illustrate the limitations of elemental weapons when compared to high level buffed variants.
 
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Davey_Pitch said:
I can see where you're coming from, and I would perhaps agree if you were just planning on doing NG and maybe NG+. My problem with elemental weapons is that their damage is capped, no matter what you do stat wise, plus they can't be buffed. That is a huge point for me, considering how most bosses are weak to the various weapon buffs you can use, and if you're going through multiple playthroughs and continue to improve your Int/Faith and increasing the damage output of the weapon buff you use, it will very quickly start to overpower the elemental weapons, by quite some distance in the end.

Of course, if you just stuck with the base Str/Dex you need for your favourite weapon and then turned it elemental, you could put those points into Int AND Faith and turn yourself into a walking magical weapon. That's also fun! :D

Edit: Just ran some basic numbers quickly....

My current favourite weapon is the Great Scythe, and with full stamina (192 Stamina), I can get 7 swings out of it before I run out of stamina. At +15 and 40 Dex, it hits for 476 damage. A +5 Lightning Great Scythe will hit for 500 damage. With 7 swings each, a +15 Great Scythe can theoretically output 3332 damage (476*7), while a +5 Lightning can output 3500 damage. So even with 40 Dex, it still doesn't hit harder than the elemental version.

Here's where it gets interesting though. As I'm a Dex/Faith build, I have 40 Dex and the Sunlight Blade miracle. With 40 Dex and the Canvas Talisman, I have a magic adjustment of 190. Using the Sunlight Blade miracle, which is Lightning damage, I can add an extra 342 damage per swing to my weapon (Magic adjustment of 190 * Miracle Adjustment of 1.8). With a +15 Great Scythe and the Sunlight Blade miracle, I can output a total of 5762 damage with a full stamina combo (818*7). That's over 2000 extra damage in a full combo.

Of course, those numbers don't take any damage resistances into effect, but it does illustrate the limitations of elemental weapons when compared to high level buffed variants.
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I did forget about buffs for a moment there, they can obviously make a scaled build outdamage an elemental but there is still the case of you losing out on stamina and health, although that only applies if you play PvP, if you are going PvE then of course the scaled weapons will win every time. I do remember running a longsword build with 40 strength and dex, tons of buffing spells and resins and no HP with a ton of endurance, it was a lot of fun in PvP because the moveset is so damn good that you can stun lock anyone for 9+ hits which is guaranteed death for all but a few. The only downside though was that there were many cases where the lag would lie about where the opponent was and they'd hit me after I missed and do damage to me, and at 15 health or something around that level you'd never survive at SL125 pvp, it was a case of you win very well or die horribly and I hate leaving my fate in the hands of lag or a single mistake, it's nice to be able to come back and still win after taking a ton of damage.

Of course when it comes to PvE it's fine, as when you start to get to SL150+ invasions are rare and you can run whatever build you like. I don't think anything beats a +15 longsword or claymore on a very high SL char. I still stick with the theory that moveset means more than anything else.
 
Omaeka said:
I did forget about buffs for a moment there, they can obviously make a scaled build outdamage an elemental but there is still the case of you losing out on stamina and health, although that only applies if you play PvP, if you are going PvE then of course the scaled weapons will win every time. I do remember running a longsword build with 40 strength and dex, tons of buffing spells and resins and no HP with a ton of endurance, it was a lot of fun in PvP because the moveset is so damn good that you can stun lock anyone for 9+ hits which is guaranteed death for all but a few. The only downside though was that there were many cases where the lag would lie about where the opponent was and they'd hit me after I missed and do damage to me, and at 15 health or something around that level you'd never survive at SL125 pvp, it was a case of you win very well or die horribly and I hate leaving my fate in the hands of lag or a single mistake, it's nice to be able to come back and still win after taking a ton of damage.

Of course when it comes to PvE it's fine, as when you start to get to SL150+ invasions are rare and you can run whatever build you like. I don't think anything beats a +15 longsword or claymore on a very high SL char. I still stick with the theory that moveset means more than anything else.
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Yeah, most of my experience is from PvE as I find the lag destroys a lot of the fun in PvP (except when I had a SL120 build with Dark Bead, that was fun :D). Never been a big fan of the Claymore as I'm generally not a fan of slower weapons, but I do like the Longsword, it has a nice range of attacks. I like the Great Scythe for the same reason, as it has some nice long overhead attacks that have great range, and a lovely wide swinging attack that can hit enemies even if they move to the side of you. Very handy in a crowd, or if someone is trying to circle behind you in PvP for a backstab. I like the Gargoyle's Halberd for the same reasons :)
 
Davey_Pitch said:
Yeah, most of my experience is from PvE as I find the lag destroys a lot of the fun in PvP (except when I had a SL120 build with Dark Bead, that was fun :D). Never been a big fan of the Claymore as I'm generally not a fan of slower weapons, but I do like the Longsword, it has a nice range of attacks. I like the Great Scythe for the same reason, as it has some nice long overhead attacks that have great range, and a lovely wide swinging attack that can hit enemies even if they move to the side of you. Very handy in a crowd, or if someone is trying to circle behind you in PvP for a backstab. I like the Gargoyle's Halberd for the same reasons :)
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It definitely does, the game would be damn near tournament quality if it wasn't for the lag and the fact it's impossible to pair up with specific people. Thank god that Dark Souls 2 is going dedicated again like Demon's. I tip my hat off to you for being able to use lots of weapons, I'm pretty much useless unless I have a Claymore/Zweihander/Longsword. Have you ever used the Balder 'Swag' Sword as people call it :p? That's another amazing weapon, it's moveset is similar to a Longsword and it's scaling ranks are through the roof! Looks kinda fragile though.
 
Oh yeah, I love the Baller Swag Sword, it's a great Dex weapon but its damage kinda tails off against other Dex weapons like the Uchi/Scythe/Halberd. It's another great weapon for buff builds like mine as it's so quick, you can get in loads of hits to make the most of the buff.

I kinda got used to using lots of weapons on my challenge run, I'd stuck to certain weapons previously but doing different challenges kinda forces you to use different weapons. I know that if you want to output the absolute most damage in a single hit, while being in the mid 30's for Strength, you want to use the Demon's Great Axe. With a +14 upgrade and Gold Pine Resin, I was able to hit Queelag for over 3500 damage in a single hit :D
 
Different weapons for different situations, definitely viable, makes you very versatile. Powerful 2 hander for the bosses and open areas, tidy 1 hander for tight interiors, makes the game a breeze :p. Plus there is just something really appealing about carring a sword + shield paired with a two hander, been doing it in every RPG since I played Dungeon Siege 3 :D.

The Demon's Great Axe is a complete monster, best strength scaling in the game isn't it? It's awesome in PvP too because you can face away from them and use the heavy two handed attack which is some overhead slam, they go in for a backstab and if you hold your movement stick towards them you spin around after the charge up and slam them, it's absolutely horrid! :p
 
Yep, S scaling when over +10 I believe. I use it quite a lot now along with a Gargoyle Halberd +5 lightning when I'm fighting in corridors. I'm having a lot of fun with the Abyss Greatsword as well with 10 humanity.
 
Tried the Moonlight Butterfly again... And lasted maybe a second longer this time! By far the most trouble I have had so far. I did find the summon sign for th witch(hidden away or what!), but need to work out a proper strategy fro the fight. I carried on through Darkroot Gardens and found myself in Darkroot Basin again, but once again didn't think I could take on that things that shoots the water bursts. I wandered around in the dark fro a bit, then I followed a path down and found a bonfire after barely fighting off some kind of black knight(?) and found myself in the Valley of Drakes, where I killed a few, but got swamped soon after, so atm I am regrouping at the bonfire, where I will decide where to go next.

Desperately need humanity as well!
 
[ui]ICEMAN;24134544 said:
Yep, S scaling when over +10 I believe. I use it quite a lot now along with a Gargoyle Halberd +5 lightning when I'm fighting in corridors. I'm having a lot of fun with the Abyss Greatsword as well with 10 humanity.
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Have never tried to Abyss Greatsword, the stat requirements are nuts!

Pighardia said:
Tried the Moonlight Butterfly again... And lasted maybe a second longer this time! By far the most trouble I have had so far. I did find the summon sign for th witch(hidden away or what!), but need to work out a proper strategy fro the fight. I carried on through Darkroot Gardens and found myself in Darkroot Basin again, but once again didn't think I could take on that things that shoots the water bursts. I wandered around in the dark fro a bit, then I followed a path down and found a bonfire after barely fighting off some kind of black knight(?) and found myself in the Valley of Drakes, where I killed a few, but got swamped soon after, so atm I am regrouping at the bonfire, where I will decide where to go next.

Desperately need humanity as well!
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A Drake is much, much harder to beat than a Moonlight Butterfly mate, the Butterfly is easy as hell, just roll under it's beam and homing soulmass attacks, and if your reflexes aren't quite good enough to avoid the pin missile attacks, just equip the 'Cracked Round Shield' (yep, that crude little wooden round shield that's almost broken in half) and block, it has massive Magic resistance somehow.

EDIT: scratch that, it only has 55% resistance but it's better against magic than anything else early on bar the Crest Shield from revisiting the Asylum.
 
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Pighardia said:
Tried the Moonlight Butterfly again... And lasted maybe a second longer this time! By far the most trouble I have had so far. I did find the summon sign for th witch(hidden away or what!), but need to work out a proper strategy fro the fight. I carried on through Darkroot Gardens and found myself in Darkroot Basin again, but once again didn't think I could take on that things that shoots the water bursts. I wandered around in the dark fro a bit, then I followed a path down and found a bonfire after barely fighting off some kind of black knight(?) and found myself in the Valley of Drakes, where I killed a few, but got swamped soon after, so atm I am regrouping at the bonfire, where I will decide where to go next.

Desperately need humanity as well!
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If you can't beat the Butterfly tonight and want some help let me know what Soul level you are. I'm happy to make a new character and come and help you out :)
 
The Cadeius (sp?) Round shield available from a corpse in the graveyard next to fire link shrine has 65% magic resistance, it may prove useful against the moonlit butterfly if you are finding the roll timing a bit tricky!
With the witch summoned it is just a case of staying alive long enough for her spells to do the business!
 
Just bought it, dunno why tho :D.

Do you need mods to make it work ok? Downloading from steam ATM. I also dont have the xbox controller which is recommended for this..
 
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