Declining attitude to law and order

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What annoys me most of all is the brain dead idiots not giving the police room to work - any one of which could have turned out to be an ancillary threat.
 
Deluxe1 said:
Most of the time is spent on diversity training and crimes that don't involve getting rough and ready with the crims.

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Ow god, I had a mouthful of tea when she said "the way someone looks at you", 2 hands over mouth kept it in there, this isn't real tea is it?
 
It reminds me of the film Falling Down with Michael Douglas. Some days it’s so tempting to want to make a stand and go maverick, delivering justice with ur own bare hands.

I know the matters in question are YouTube excerpts but don’t forget the media have a large part to play in shaping our views. The media are responsible for a lot more than people will ever realise.
 
Orionaut said:
In all seriousness, I have always felt that those who are in the business of dishing out sentences should actually do a bit of time "Brubaker" style.

As for having reformed criminals serving as Magistrates or Judges.

Be aware that this might not end the way one might think.

Reformed criminals might actually end up rather less sympathetic.

Like the BLM/Police shooting Black suspects thing in the USA. I am sure I read somewhere that actually Black suspects are MORE likley to be shot by Black Police officers than by White ones..
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I'm not sure how relevant your example is in this, although it doesn't necessarily mean you are wrong. It may just be that white officers are less likely to want to shoot a black criminal due to how the events get twisted by the media so that this black victim narrative can be pushed. I would imagine a black officer is less likely to be thrown under the bus by this and thus their threshold for drawing and firing their weapon will be lower and more inline with how they would deal with a white criminal in the same situation.

I certainly wouldn't want to be a police officer in the states, it seems to be a thankless job with a fair bit of risk involved although I guess that would depend on the area and its gun laws.
 
1. If you're not a big guy you can't be a cop because you won't be able to make arrests. The police are putting these women at risk by letting them work a job they aren't physically capable of.

2. All those people watching and laughing are foreigners and should be deported.
 
I thought the majority of police were now carrying tasers. It's quite evident that a big bloke drugged up on god knows what and having a bit of pepper sprayed into his eyes makes diddly squat difference. I'm sure having 50k volts shot at him would have stopped him pretty quickly.
 
Reeve said:
I'm not sure how relevant your example is in this, although it doesn't necessarily mean you are wrong. It may just be that white officers are less likely to want to shoot a black criminal due to how the events get twisted by the media so that this black victim narrative can be pushed. I would imagine a black officer is less likely to be thrown under the bus by this and thus their threshold for drawing and firing their weapon will be lower and more inline with how they would deal with a white criminal in the same situation.

I certainly wouldn't want to be a police officer in the states, it seems to be a thankless job with a fair bit of risk involved although I guess that would depend on the area and its gun laws.
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The point I am making with that example is that, In the case of the US Police. The Argument is that

"The Police are a white dominated, institutionally racist (I hate that expression) organization that has little sympathy with the BME population resulting in unnecessary deaths of suspects, and that we need to have more "Diversity" (Another expression that I hate) in order to create a more balanced Policing environment, particularly in BME neighborhoods"

And yet, the likelihood is that increasing "Diversity" might actually increase the number of suspect deaths. (For various reasons)

Back to Judges. It is not inconceivable that truly reformed Criminals that have seen the light (As it were) might actually be more like "Reformed" Smokers and "Reformed" Alcoholics (Or even worse, "Reformed" Carnivores. Lord help you if you get a full on "Vegan" Judge! :p)

They might actually be very unsympathetic indeed towards people who have not reformed.

(EG Full on advocates for a strictly enforced "Three Strikes" Rule, or the re-introduction of the "Felony Murder" concept in UK Law, and so on)

Which is not at all what the people making these proposals might have in mind!
 
Semple said:
I thought the majority of police were now carrying tasers. It's quite evident that a big bloke drugged up on god knows what and having a bit of pepper sprayed into his eyes makes diddly squat difference. I'm sure having 50k volts shot at him would have stopped him pretty quickly.
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It's absolutely insane what people can endure when on cocktails of certain drugs;

 
Orionaut said:
Back to Judges. It is not inconceivable that truly reformed Criminals that have seen the light (As it were) might actually be more like "Reformed" Smokers and "Reformed" Alcoholics (Or even worse, "Reformed" Carnivores. Lord help you if you get a full on "Vegan" Judge! :p)
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"...and I have no choice but to dismiss the charge of murder. However, tell me, have you ever eaten steak? Oh you have?! Bailiff, bring in the ravenous man eating cow. Now death by bovine is a slow process, but worry not, I am not entirely inhumane so I will distract you from the excruciating pain with a righteous lecture on the evils of the Meat-Industrial Complex"
 
You see it out and about. Parents want to be best friends with their kids and never ever tell them no or to not do something. Teachers then face a losing battle. Then you get the result of that and many other videos. The sense of entitlement is higher than ever.
 
phil-k said:
Disipline has declined in the past years, teachers, parents & police can't correct bad behaviour, so the youngers are not scared of anybody now as they know they can't touch them
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Couldn't agree more.

My Mum always used to say, in her day, kids were scared of the Police - I guess because the power they had; but they respected them because of this power/authority/fear. These days, where kids are growing up without discipline, they seem to have picked up a mentality, where they are untouchable - they act so, and even dare people to try touching them; as they know the rules are on their side.

Saw a video on reddit last night, though it was from a few years ago, where there were around 10 teenagers in a park - girls and boys, and although there was no context (other than the video titled 'trouble makers being moved on') - the way these kids disobeyed the Police was shocking! Most of the lads were squaring up to Officers, making verbal threats if they were to touch them again, and completely ignoring what they were being told. Eventually more Officers came in to move some of the more vocal ones on, and carnage ensued - lads to kicking and punching at the Police, and even a girl assaulted an Officer.

I used to joke years ago, when Eminem broke out on the music scene, that people changed almost over night - trying to ape him. I used to see kids and teenagers all adopt his 'attitude' and way of speaking, even my own brother went full on Eminem mode and grew a huge 'world owes me a favour' attitude, and this whole 'give me respect' mindset. It was crazy, but it seems (from my experience) that these two traits have just escalated over the years since, as more and more little ****s are behaving like the world does owe them something, and that everyone should respect them - not appreciating that you earn respect in life. And that only people such as the Emergency Services, should be given it.

I'm not a parent (yet!), and can only imagine how hard it must be to raise your children with all the values they need to be decent people - only to see them befriend people who haven't come from a home with those foundations, and see much of your hard work undone. It must be soul destroying.
 
Scort said:
Saw a video on reddit last night, though it was from a few years ago, where there were around 10 teenagers in a park - girls and boys, and although there was no context (other than the video titled 'trouble makers being moved on') - the way these kids disobeyed the Police was shocking! Most of the lads were squaring up to Officers, making verbal threats if they were to touch them again, and completely ignoring what they were being told. Eventually more Officers came in to move some of the more vocal ones on, and carnage ensued - lads to kicking and punching at the Police, and even a girl assaulted an Officer.
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It's as though we live in a world where "getting tough" is seen as a bad, or over the top thing to do, whether it's parents correctly disciplining children in the household, or the Police dealing with a nasty situation - there seems to be this reluctance to use force to deal with it. An aggravating factor is that people know this - and push the boundaries further and further, to the point where you have teenagers daring to square up to police officers and threaten them..

It would be interesting to see how society would react if we went back to older, harsher - perhaps more effective ways of dealing with unruly kids;


:D
 
Burnsy2023 said:
I understand that limitation. The likelihood of someone being an aggrieved in more than five crimes in 12 months is low and usually related to domestic related crimes. It's not ideal, but it's not likely to undermine much of the statistical value.

So in my mere 8 year's service, I can say that I have seen an anecdotal decline in more serious violent offences. Take pub brawls. I used to go to them all the time. That simply doesn't happen on anywhere near the same scale anymore. GBH offences were similarly more frequent when I started and they are rarer now.
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Thank you for your reply and also your service.

I would say there are probably pockets of crime hotspots that have a lot of low level crime.

I think there is a cultural change in how people socialise these days. I've noticed off my own experience that not as many people go out night clubbing or bar hopping than they used to do. We know alcohol consumption is also down. I would attribute this to how socialising as changed these days. I would also suggest that people are either drinking at home more, or taking drugs.

I think the crime survey is valuable information for what it covers. Though it does have this limit on crime reporting and also the bigger problem is it doesn't talk about many of the modern day crime problems like possession of drugs, knives and guns. If someone gets knived or shot to death then all those crimes wouldnt even be acknowledged on the survey. The report even says it shouldn't be used for crime trends because of its limited nature. In effect we have 2 halves of a puzzle, the police crime statistics and this victim-led crime survey that together probably make the whole picture. Imho, relying on only one of the reports will lead to a false view of crime levels.

It mentions in the report what the police statistics are. It says there is no overall change in violent crime, though knife crime went up 16% and crimes involving a firearm went up 2%. Homicides went up 12% (excluding terror attacks). Robbery went up 30%, theft went up 17% for vehicle related theft while there was a 6% rise in burglary offences. Computer misuse went down 31%. Sexual offences went up 0.7% and public order offences went up by 36%.
 
Rroff said:
What annoys me most of all is the brain dead idiots not giving the police room to work - any one of which could have turned out to be an ancillary threat.
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By brain dead idiots do you mean the other plain clothes police officers involved or the people standing on the other side of the street
 
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