Delvis: weight lifting log - time to conquer

[mrthingyx]

Cheers mate. Why would increasing blood flow be a bad idea though? It seems to do a bad thing to do a good thing?

Increasing blood flow essentally increases swelling where the tissue is damaged, hence the ideas behind elevating/icing the joint for RICE therapy.

However, there is no consensus behind the method (and therefore efficacy) of the 'ice' bit, so we can dispense with that and go in for ibuprofen, as compression and elevation of the shoulder an interesting in concept but not strictly easy to do.

Heat is generally a good idea to speed the healing process once the initial swelling has subsided as it concentrates blood (and everything blood carries) in the area. It also helps the muscles/ligaments/etcs relax, meaning its more flexible!

 

[Delvis]

Ahh okay, ibuprofen and a hot water bottle it is then

 

[MoNkeE]

Nick, do pain killers not thin your blood too, which has a negative effect on healing?

 

[Begbie]

BBB sucks balls, and this has been attested to by many here.

Trium variate is supposed to be 5/3/1 compound + 2-3 assistance.

edit: your last chest routine had 154 reps of assistance work not including your machine thingy at the end as you didnt put in reps!!

that is crazy volume for a strength based program, have you ever considered that your not pushing yourself hard enough on the assistance work (thus they are not really helping you build strength), and instead your just doing a big variaty because you have the time. I know i am gassed after my 4 assistance exercises and struggle to do much else (except 1 or 2 sets of core stuff) but i am pushing my assistance higher every week along with my big lifts.

I agree with Syla here, cable flys, machine rows and then tricep machine.

I'd take them all out and put more effort into dips/DB work/CGBP

 

[Delvis]

The machine rows are staying at the moment, as they're extra work prescribed for my back.

I can agree about the flyes though, the tricep machine was purely down to having extra time available so it's not a weekly thing.

 

[Chris1712]

Incline is less bad times for shoulders

How? The closer you get to vertical the more delt is gonna pick up slack from your chest. Opposite is true for decline. Other than ROM reduction this is part of the reason for dat arch on flat bench, to get your shoulder joint in a strong pressing position (humerus angle compared to torso)?

 

[Delvis]

No idea, I just know that I could do incline BB work and not flat BB work at the start of last year, it's only in the last few months I've managed to re-introduce flat BB work.

 

[MoNkeE]

Chris, it's not about loading the shoulder, it's having it at an angle that compromises its stability. Some people with internal rotation issues will get shoulder issues with flat bench, but they're not as rotated on incline.

 

[mrthingyx]

Nick, do pain killers not thin your blood too, which has a negative effect on healing?

Oooooh... can of worms...

Spoiler

Aspirin thins the blood, but NSAIDs in general does something slightly more complex. Its pain reduction mechanism revolves around a reduction/antagonism/whatever of prostaglandins that are released when cells are damaged. IIRC, these prostaglandins stimulate slow pain receptors (hence some of the ache associated with DOMS, sprains, breaks, etc.) but they also stimulate the extra blood flow to the injury, leading to swelling.

So when these are reduced by the actions of ibuprofen, yes, the healing process is slowed. The flipside is reduced pain, and reduced pressure from the swelling.

When I broke my arm, I did a fair amount of research on what would work best to heal quickest and hardest, and noted that ibuprofen DOES impede the healing process by a reasonable extent (figures of between 10-25% are noted given different critera/scenarios), which is why doctors normally prescribe paracetamol or codeine/morphine for breaks.

However, this is for the perfectly bad scenario. In the real world, quality of diet, fixation, age, health and loading are much greater determinants of healing rate.

Ibuprofen will not stop an injury from healing. Yes, it might heal more slowly than without, but for most of the people on here (well-fed, healthy and trained individuals) I would be surprised if the difference were significant.

Yes, NSAIDs do slow the healing process, but it is a question of taking a relatively small potential hit in rate of recovery, or suffering with discomfort for only a slighly shorter - and even potentially longer - period of time.

I know what I choose, but then that might explain why I don't lift very much.

 

[icecold]

Icing is counter productive (unless using hot/cold protocols).

NSAIDs, for the purpose of swelling reduction, are similarly problematic.

Increasing blood flow AND increasing tissue drainage via elevation and compression (including massage) are your best bet.

There is a good mwod video on this, and also many many opinions...

 

[mrthingyx]

Icing is counter productive (unless using hot/cold protocols).

NSAIDs, for the purpose of swelling reduction, are similarly problematic.

Increasing blood flow AND increasing tissue drainage via elevation and compression (including massage) are your best bet.

There is a good mwod video on this, and also many many opinions...

Apparently, the release of endorphins during happy endings yields roughly the same reduction in pain sensation as taking two ibuprofens...

Science, right?

That way, you can get every useful bit of the advice above for the same cost as an actual massage. Win hyphen win.

 

[Delvis]

So put tiger balm on AND take ibuprofen?

 

[mrthingyx]

As long as its not in the context of my suggestion on happy endings eek, go nuts.

I have a stash of Deep Heat in my gym bag, anyway.

 

[Delvis]

Thursday 28th March: Shoulders - C2 W2

• Mobility, shoulders, some OHP with bar,
• OHP: 3 x 3+

1. 27.5kg x 3
2. 30kg x 3
3. 35kg x 8 - Failed 9 half way up

• Push press: 7 x 35kg - Just managed the 7th
• Seated DB press: 16's = 10, 8, 8.
• Cable face pull: 3 x 12 x 50kg
• Corner cable rear delt flyes: 22.8kg x 12, 13.6kg x 16, 16 (weight is per hand)
• Pallof press: 3 x 10 x 23kg

Pleased with OHP press, I seem to always fail at the half way point. Seated DB press I'm okay with, only managed to get 8 just about on the last two.

The face pulls are done in the upright stacks people use for flyes, weirdly these are SO much lighter than trying them in the Tricep pull down stack...Odd, continuity would be nice!

Stopped the delt flyes @ 22.8kg, felt my collar bone area playing up so dropped it to the next weight down.

Time to drug up and recover for tomorrow.

 

[Deception]

Nice lifting. Looks like the shoulder held up fine

 

[Begbie]

Thursday 28th March: Shoulders - C2 W2

• Mobility, shoulders, some OHP with bar,
• OHP: 3 x 3+

1. 27.5kg x 3
2. 30kg x 3
3. 35kg x 8 - Failed 9 half way up

• Push press: 7 x 35kg - Just managed the 7th
• Seated DB press: 16's = 10, 8, 8.
• Cable face pull: 3 x 12 x 50kg
• Corner cable rear delt flyes: 22.8kg x 12, 13.6kg x 16, 16 (weight is per hand)
• Pallof press: 3 x 10 x 23kg

Pleased with OHP press, I seem to always fail at the half way point. Seated DB press I'm okay with, only managed to get 8 just about on the last two.

The face pulls are done in the upright stacks people use for flyes, weirdly these are SO much lighter than trying them in the Tricep pull down stack...Odd, continuity would be nice!

Stopped the delt flyes @ 22.8kg, felt my collar bone area playing up so dropped it to the next weight down.

Time to drug up and recover for tomorrow.

You'll never get continuity with different cable machines due to the pulley systems used. Sucks, but thats life. Rear cable raises are what kill me with this, look like a right chump pulling 2.5kg (or whatever it is)

 

[Delvis]

Nice lifting. Looks like the shoulder held up fine

Just about, I left out single arm presses and front+side raises, wasn't 100% but nevermind.

I'm going to look at my assistance work at the end of this cycle and see what can be dropped/changed.

You'll never get continuity with different cable machines due to the pulley systems used. Sucks, but thats life. Rear cable raises are what kill me with this, look like a right chump pulling 2.5kg (or whatever it is)

Indeed, it's a complete butt ache. You have the corner unit which is light as anything (30kg is like 16kg) then the two cable stacks which seem about right...Then the tricep pull down thing which seems to weigh double

 

[Syla5]

Indeed, it's a complete butt ache. You have the corner unit which is light as anything (30kg is like 16kg) then the two cable stacks which seem about right...Then the tricep pull down thing which seems to weigh double

And this is why i use the same cable stack for all my work on cables!

 

[Delvis]

And this is why i use the same cable stack for all my work on cables!

I do normally, but people get in the way.

And the last time I used that crappy corner thing it broke my shoulder. I generally stick to the central one with a stack either side, just the corner one seems better for things like rear delt flyes

 

[Delvis]

Friday 29th March: Back - C2 W2

• Mobility: some shoulder stuff, leg stuff, RDL's with bar, deads @ 70kg
• Deads: 3 x 3+

1. 95kg x 3
2. 107.5kg x 3
3. 122.5kg x 12

• Deads dropset: 70kg x 10
• Pull-ups: 5, 5, 4/5 - still lolworthy
• Seated cable row: 52kg x 8, 45kg x 10, 10.
• SAR: 3 x 10 x 22kg - getting a nice pause and pump at the top
• BIZEPS x 1000

Pretty good, felt weak this morning, guess its the different training time. Pull ups did feel good, just need to keep working on them. Cable rows felt damn heavy and there was no point carrying on at 52kg as I wasn't getting a decent pinch from them. SAR's felt lovely, everything clicked for these.

Bizeps, pump galore, forearms exploded everywhere. Preachers curls working up then down, then a set of 21's.