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DLSS 5 preview

TNA said:
Only 6 months late posting that.

That was during the first outing of DLSS5 where some in here were trying to hate on it. Now those individuals have changed their tune :D
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I know it's six months late. I was being sarcastic and facetious.

Also reminding everyone of how this was seen when it first was revealed.

How times have changed....
 
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opethdisciple said:
This!
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Specifically talking about this DLSS5, it can't have a huge amount more to offer, beyond some refinements in performance impact.

Fundamentally, it requires better output from the game to add value. But the better the output from the game the less value it can add, as the quality gap shrinks.

So right now DLSS5 is in it's prime. Screen space AI filters will become increasingly obsolete with time.
 
eddyr said:
Specifically talking about this DLSS5, it can't have a huge amount more to offer, beyond some refinements in performance impact.

Fundamentally, it requires better output from the game to add value. But the better the output from the game the less value it can add, as the quality gap shrinks.

So right now DLSS5 is in it's prime. Screen space AI filters will become increasingly obsolete with time.
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I get what your saying, but why do we think that DLSS5 or more specifically Neural Rendering wont just improve too?

To the point where we have photo realistic graphics?

Everything improves over time.

I mean you speak as if DLSS5 is the end game.

Do you think we have reached the pinnacle of graphical advancements?

No DLSS6 or beyond will make any more advancements?

Might as well just stop here. Call it a day.
 
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opethdisciple said:
I get what your saying, but why do we think that DLSS5 or more specifically Neural Rendering wont just improve too?

To the point where we have photo realistic graphics?

Everything improves over time.

I mean you speak as if DLSS5 is the end game.

Do you think we have reached the pinnacle of graphical advancements?

No DLSS6 or beyond will make any more advancements?

Might as well just stop here. Call it a day.
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Now you're conveniently conflating this DLSS5 with an undefined superset of technologies encompassed under the term neural rendering.
What we are talking about, and all the ongoing buzz in this thread, is this specific DLSS5 screen space filter.

opethdisciple said:
I know it's six months late. I was being sarcastic and facetious.

Also reminding everyone of how this was seen when it first was revealed.

How times have changed....
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The original reception 6 months ago was specifically regarding DLSS5, which a host of people (this thread and the web) instinctively grasped to be a screen space filter.
Valid criticisms and concerns about it, now or 6 months ago, can't be dismissed by citing different technology - and the very different technologies they actually want and are keen for!

You've several times worked to convert naysayers about their issues with this DLSS5 by claiming they are naysayers of all future loosely related and unrelated technologies that incorporate AI techniques.

May as well cite rocket technology and ion thrust engines as a gotcha counterargument when people discuss air breathing turbojets and their application.
 
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I've just started playing with the dlls5 Swapper and I think its great on the games I have tried so far cant under stand why so many people view it in the negative light. I cant wait for more games to have it as standard
 
Dravic said:
Well you say that, but with the mods I posted above I can play CP2077 with PT, neural (not neutral) rendering, in 4k
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Nope, you can't. Unless you meant upscaled to 4k and applied DLSS5 and all the mods before upscaling plus FG. Don't rubbish yourself this is 4k or actual 90fps - it's upscaled to 4k, most frames aren't even rendered but AI generated. It's enough Nvidia is trying to rubbish everyone all the time with marketing "performance", you really don't have to add to this.
Dravic said:
, at 90 FPS, with a 4070. It isn't perfect but it's perfectly playable. And there's plenty of much more powerful cards than mine.
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The "playable" is a very very subjective thing. Back in the days I've found Doom and other 3d games best playable with below 10fps. I don't anymore.
Dravic said:
Btw, do you realise NEURAL rendering is part of the DX specs so it's probably here to stay?
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I already responded to that - but in short words, DX contains plenty of things that aren't used in games because publishers simply decided they won't (for whatever reason) and that's it. Ergo, it means absolutely nothing.

Rroff said:
While it doesn't excuse nVidia on the other hand ATI/AMD had plenty of time to develop tessellation - they demonstrated stuff with TruForm and early variants of tessellation before the hardware was there to make it feasible then sat on it when the hardware was capable of making it useful.
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Chicken and egg - developers didn't demand it, AMD didn't push for it, gamers didn't know about it and also didn't demand it. Then Nvidia decided they can spin it for more sales and they pushed for it and made developers implement it (just in a way that also slapped down competition, so 2 birds with 1 stone). And now hardly anyone knows it exists and that it's still used in games because it's not being advertised anymore unlike Nanite for example.

Rroff said:
It isn't really mature enough yet to generally use it - a lot of games aren't stable for more than a few minutes with it (though that is improving) and without the full motion data and other data/tags from developers implementing it internally there are a lot of artefacts and other issues.
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There are a lot of artefacts with it in motion even when it's natively implemented as per hub video analysing it in the NBA game. Everyone is oh ah about it and they must be wilfully blind IMHO or staring at every character right against their faces as a bit further away and not only skin colour changes, characters look different and rather awful in many cases (I dare to say worse than without it) but there are also motion artefacts and often it simply does so little it's not even worth any performance hit. It's a very mixed bag of cats really, depending hugely on a given title, quality of textures and lighting on it, camera movement, type of the game etc. It has some narrow use, but that's about it. Blown out way out of proportion.

Where is shines and where people could genuinely use it for fun is photo mode in games. In actual fast games? It has no place at all in current shape.
 
Tinek said:
Nope, you can't. Unless you meant upscaled to 4k and applied DLSS5 and all the mods before upscaling plus FG. Don't rubbish yourself this is 4k or actual 90fps - it's upscaled to 4k, most frames aren't even rendered but AI generated. It's enough Nvidia is trying to rubbish everyone all the time with marketing "performance", you really don't have to add to this.

The "playable" is a very very subjective thing. Back in the days I've found Doom and other 3d games best playable with below 10fps. I don't anymore.

I already responded to that - but in short words, DX contains plenty of things that aren't used in games because publishers simply decided they won't (for whatever reason) and that's it. Ergo, it means absolutely nothing.
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I think you rather missed my point, the fact that it even runs on my unsupported last gen mid range card basically using hack upon hack and it's "acceptable" is quite impressive.

PC gaming has always been about that compromise between fidelity and FPS and, as you say, it is subjective. I certainly wouldn't want to use it in a fast paced online shooter but it's perfectly fine for a slower paced RPG.

If you don't like it or are not willing to make those compromises that's fine don't, there are plenty of people who are quite happy with it though.
 
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