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GT5 is serious business.
Does GT5 look better than real life?
- Thread starter thecremeegg
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Caporegime
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Don't understand why people are berating this game so much. Sure, it's taking a long time to actually get it on the shelves, but I for one am happy that they're taking the time to get it right rather than the many many games that are released with a patch on day 1 and then several more over the following months only to still be left with the thought that it could have been so much better.
This isn't going too far at all, it's a challenge to your comments/opinion etc, you can't hide behind the fact the opinion comes from another person on another forum as if you aren't aligning your opinion with theirs.
but read on, it all becomes clear about the conspiracy...
So now we have it, your 'personal' opinion is based on (what I don't dispute) that SRT are commercially 'slanted' by sponsors.. of course they are, they are paid to advertise their sponsors, so they do..
This is where you then fall down.. you then 'assume' that this will automatically follow through to bias in their reviews, and then this is where the conspiracy nonsense comes from, you then extrapolate this to infer that the FM3 review is biased because they don't print every bit of gossip about GT5..
This flies in the face of several facts
1. They don't wax-lyrical about FM3 either, the only two main articles where A, a preview at E3, where they stated they where excited to see GT5, but it wasn't there, and B. A review of the released game, oddly GT5 not being released may be the reason they haven't review it.
2. They aren't a news site primarily.. they review stuff..
3. They have plenty of PS3 related content/reviews so certainly don't mind the PS3
4. One of the reviewers is a GT fan
5. Microsoft and Turn 10 don't sponsor them in any meaningful way I can see, the FM3 review was sponsored by 'sim raceway'..
6. If they where commercial animals, they'd be looking at the fact GT has a userbase tenfold that of FM and exploiting it..
7. Their Top sim cars are all PC sim racers, except 1 FM3 car
and I could go on...
Same as above really, you are linking commercialism and bias of the FM3 review in a way only a conspiricist would..
Odd you should praise them when you agree with everything they say and 'e-mail' them to say so, yet truly believe that the FM3 review is meaningless because you don't.. I hope you e-mailed your opinion of that review to them
[lighthearted]Come on, you are just a blind fanboy who is in denial..[/lighthearted]
GT5 is going to be a great game, but traditionally GT's have never been 'sim' like in the way a PC Sim game is, GT5 should be getting there, and I'm sure their review will indicate this. Since they have so much time and experience of GTR/iRacing/LFS etc, I will take their comparison to these as fairly credible (as much as you can from any review).. if they rate it much better then FM3 on the physics front, I'll happily accept it, as I'll be playing it too, but I certainly won't dismiss it and claim they are wrong because they have sponsors to keep happy..
I'm certainly not berating it at all, I am looking forward to it, but it's a driving game at the end of the day, people started the whole predicatble 'physics' debate.. I just offered about as credible a comparison of FM3's physics to PC Sim racers as you are likely to find, with the caveat that GT5 is no doubt going to score highly, in a bid to show that neither game is bad in this respect.
end of the day, this is only a discussion, hell it's not even heated...
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Not really, as they end in the same people going backwards and forwards over the same things e.g. physics, handling, is it better than Forza blah blah...
Without it being released, there's no way you can possibly state that there won't be "a patch on day 1 and several more over the following months only to still be left with the thought that it could have been so much better."
Longer development time does not mean a better game or less bugs in the game. Ideally yes it would but unfortunately it does not.
Caporegime
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Yeah, but isn't it nice to try and educate these people that they are both pretty decent?
It seems you aren't allowed to be rational and objective these days, unless you swing violently in one direction, you tend to get loads of flak..
Not going to comment further on this Demon its gone far enough.
However where did I comment anything about FM3 review scores or try to make it a VS of GT5/FM3. You seem determind to turn it into some debate.
I said FM3 seemed to get a lot more coverage and news and as yet GT5 has had very little. Either way it doesnt bother me it was only a comment based on someone elses observation, no need to make it so serious man.
However to turn around and say yes SRT have perhaps commerical expectances, and defend or praise SRT yet make fun of ign or other is a little one sided.
However where did I comment anything about FM3 review scores or try to make it a VS of GT5/FM3. You seem determind to turn it into some debate.
I said FM3 seemed to get a lot more coverage and news and as yet GT5 has had very little. Either way it doesnt bother me it was only a comment based on someone elses observation, no need to make it so serious man.
However to turn around and say yes SRT have perhaps commerical expectances, and defend or praise SRT yet make fun of ign or other is a little one sided.
This isn't serious at all... I'm certainly not upset, I think you've made a huge mistake in your logic which served to dismiss the point I was making that was trying to show that both games are decent.
I tend to deal in logic/common sense and facts, and will always 'test' opinion and challenge where necessary. To let unchecked opinion run rife when views can be quite extreme is not a good thing IMO.
Again, your logic/common sense has failed.. My reasoning for dismissing IGN in favour of SRT is that simply SRT have the necessary experience etc to review a sim racer against it's peers, IGN like many pure games sites do not..
I don't expect someone who runs a GT site and has aired very strong views about it's superiority against it's rival(s) to have anything other the a large bias.. But I can intelligently challenge this without having to make it 'serious'.. surely?
Peace, and chill man, it's a discussion, not a heated attack..
Alright then Im flawed and your not, okay.
How can your logic/common sense ensure someone at ign or other sites wouldnt have any more experience than those guys at SRT. Thats is totaly nothing more than an assumption of yours and unfounded.
Even regards SRT video reviews. Ive seen some better done personal customer/owner reviews on sites like "you tube"
How or why you can stand for SRT to be seen as true professionals or certainly more professional is debatable. I dont see why they should be treated with higher regards particulary when (possible agreements business) is between them and the brand or product they are reviewing which is likely to reflect partially in reviews and Im not suggesting it totally sways a bad product to be a good product but come on we know it has an influence everwhere that gets free products to review or promote.
Im chilled not heated at all but your pointing a finger at me and accusing my credability of being tarnished etc.
Yet again im called a fanboy, have i referred to any of you as such?
Ive in no way done that to you and acknowledge your entitled to your own opinions or went on a "big conspiracy theory"
All this because I reflected someones opinion of FM3 getting much more focus (even pre release) which is true but doesnt mean theirs anything at work but you had to get on a FM3 defensive...
How can your logic/common sense ensure someone at ign or other sites wouldnt have any more experience than those guys at SRT. Thats is totaly nothing more than an assumption of yours and unfounded.
Even regards SRT video reviews. Ive seen some better done personal customer/owner reviews on sites like "you tube"
How or why you can stand for SRT to be seen as true professionals or certainly more professional is debatable. I dont see why they should be treated with higher regards particulary when (possible agreements business) is between them and the brand or product they are reviewing which is likely to reflect partially in reviews and Im not suggesting it totally sways a bad product to be a good product but come on we know it has an influence everwhere that gets free products to review or promote.
Im chilled not heated at all but your pointing a finger at me and accusing my credability of being tarnished etc.
Yet again im called a fanboy, have i referred to any of you as such?
Ive in no way done that to you and acknowledge your entitled to your own opinions or went on a "big conspiracy theory"
All this because I reflected someones opinion of FM3 getting much more focus (even pre release) which is true but doesnt mean theirs anything at work but you had to get on a FM3 defensive...
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The SRT guys have proven experience over a long period of time with PC sims, that's provable and a fact. They made a review with a large section relating to PC sims and how Forza stacks up.
IGN, the review made no real mention of PC sims and some throw away generalised comments on physics etc, that's also a fact, it's in the review.
So when comparing 'physics' and how a console game stacks up to the PC sims (universally accepted as being top of the tree), I think it's fair to say SRT's review is far more informative.
If I wanted to know about the actual game as a game, I'd plump for IGN..
Are you seriously questioning this?
Don't confuse substance with style.. I'm sure there are plenty of good youtube reviews out there, but common sense tells me to look at their experience and standing within that community before accepting them as credible.
End of the day, obviously it's got a commercial element to it, but considering that despite some opinions that they've started to get a bit more commercial lately, I don't see people screaming they are total blaggers.. and considering they are well known in the sim racing community, that must be definition lend them a small degree of credibility..
The thing is, this is almost irrelevant, because the underlying logic dictates that if you are correct, and they are commercially swayed to this degree, then they'd certainly not actively not promote GT5, with such a high expected user base, you'd think their sponsors would want to sell their product to as many people as possible, and GT has the largest market by a huge degree.. In order for them to big up FM and downplay GT I'd expect MS to sponsor them in a huge way.. something they don't do at all..
Oh, and I am not a huge fan of SRT in any way, I've watched only a handful of their reviews (Wheels/FM/GT etc). Considering that we approach these games from a Sim angle, there is little good quality information out there, most reviews are just from a 'gaming' perspective, and evaluation of physics is based on saying things like "Compared to Burnout this is quite a handful to drive", so I think SRT (although only a sponsored review that must be taken as such) is still more relevant then just about any other review I can find..
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I wish they'd have a decent arcade mode that was my favourite part in the original. The campaign thing was such a grind, to get anything you'd have to do a hundred races of such a track or you'd have to game it somehow, by looking at a walkthrough for the best races to get the money.
It didnt reward skill, because you could end up with a car that wasnt adequately comparable to the others, just cheat by upgrading your car, or you'd have to carefully manage your upgrades not too much, nor too little. With the arcade mode it was better set up as a challenge and you got clear good rewards.
It didnt reward skill, because you could end up with a car that wasnt adequately comparable to the others, just cheat by upgrading your car, or you'd have to carefully manage your upgrades not too much, nor too little. With the arcade mode it was better set up as a challenge and you got clear good rewards.
I wouldnt even bother trying to compare FM3 or GT with PC sims.
I dont rate FM3 or any console racing game to be close to the levels available on PC but common sense tells me the console market is different.
Ive even expressed a fair view of FM3 on this thread regards handling and physics. That still makes me a fanboy, and if I dont praise or value SRT as highly as some that too seems to be a problem
"I don't see people screaming they are total blaggers"
Where do you get that from, who said that, again your going overboard.
Nobody said they ignored or downplayed GT, what was questioned was the lack of news or similar amount of attention as some other games.
I suggested you read some comments in other places is all as not everyone has your opinions of them.
Im past caring about this now...
I dont rate FM3 or any console racing game to be close to the levels available on PC but common sense tells me the console market is different.
Ive even expressed a fair view of FM3 on this thread regards handling and physics. That still makes me a fanboy, and if I dont praise or value SRT as highly as some that too seems to be a problem
"I don't see people screaming they are total blaggers"
Where do you get that from, who said that, again your going overboard.
Nobody said they ignored or downplayed GT, what was questioned was the lack of news or similar amount of attention as some other games.
I suggested you read some comments in other places is all as not everyone has your opinions of them.
Im past caring about this now...
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That's what they did to GT-PSP, leaving it with little or no replay value.
I don't care if it's better than this or that title, I'm just looking forward to getting the finished game. Can't wait to get my CE on pre-order
That's your personal opinion, which is fine, but my opinion is that FM3 is getting closer to PC Sims, I just happen to align with SRT's review with my opinion which serves as evidence to back up my opinion (and lend some weight to it), do you have something similar to back up your opinion?
Forgive me for saying this, but "you drop your knickers at every oppertunity ", i.e. roughly summising here, your opinion appeared to be FM2 was great when released, then it was pap compared to GT5p, then NFS Shift was the next big thing, then FM3 got some praise, now GT5 is so amazing it'll knock our socks off.. or something along those lines.. consistency is the key, and an ounce of objectivity...
?? I was stating a fact.. The respected community has not ousted them as being of dubious review status, other then comments on obvious commerciality creeping in, but even then their reviews/opinions aren't being widely challenged as false. So what reason would anyone have to dismiss or downplay their FM3 review where they compare to PC Sims?
The fact is they are a review site, they didn't have any FM3 news either.. just an E3 preview (and would have included GT5 if it was there), and the FM3 review.. you totally questioned their lack of news reporting of GT5 as evidence to back your opinion up, when it's released or if it's at the next main event they go to and they ignore it, let me know, until then I see no evidence at all that aligns with your hypothesis.
My opinion of them is as any review site, the information must be taken in the context of a 'review', and yes it's not 100% reliable, no review is, but show me all the other 'reviews' that review it in context of PC sims, and I'll go and read those too.. But just because they are in the same boat as other review sites doesn't mean I'll just toss away a review I don't agree with, yet e-mail them and congratulate them on a review I do agree with..
Stop taking it personally is my best advice!
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Stop taking it personal he says when its obvious your making it like a personal attack and going to such bother.
Ive not read 1/2 of what you posted above as frankly dont care.
Regards FM2 your wrong as I hyped it as much as anyone but when it released I was dissapointed, as were many.
SRT got more attention for their GT5P / FM3 comparison than anything else so of course they wont ignore GT5.
FM3 ive been impressed with in many ways but also feel much more could have been done to make it more of a simulation of racing. It improves over FM2 but its like an upgraded FM2 with better graphics and audio and some new features. Quite frankly it is void of many things, qualifiying, weather, race strategies with proper pitstops. Very basic leaderboards, little ability to download or transfer ghosts and doesnt really simulate real world racing like other PC sims do. You rate it so highly as close to a PC sim yet its obvious they put more effort into making the game more adaptible for all to play due to sales than they did to actually make it more of a simulation. Of course the 8 cars is still quite a restriction in sim aspects.
Apologies to others this has continued.
I dont want an analysis on everything I post or have to fully explain it thanks.
I also suggest you put me on your ignore list.
Ive not read 1/2 of what you posted above as frankly dont care.
Regards FM2 your wrong as I hyped it as much as anyone but when it released I was dissapointed, as were many.
SRT got more attention for their GT5P / FM3 comparison than anything else so of course they wont ignore GT5.
FM3 ive been impressed with in many ways but also feel much more could have been done to make it more of a simulation of racing. It improves over FM2 but its like an upgraded FM2 with better graphics and audio and some new features. Quite frankly it is void of many things, qualifiying, weather, race strategies with proper pitstops. Very basic leaderboards, little ability to download or transfer ghosts and doesnt really simulate real world racing like other PC sims do. You rate it so highly as close to a PC sim yet its obvious they put more effort into making the game more adaptible for all to play due to sales than they did to actually make it more of a simulation. Of course the 8 cars is still quite a restriction in sim aspects.
Apologies to others this has continued.
I dont want an analysis on everything I post or have to fully explain it thanks.
I also suggest you put me on your ignore list.
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That sounds very fair..
As I previously mentioned, 'simulation' in terms of these games is quite multi-faceted.. and we all prefer different aspects of simulation or at least put them higher up our list of criteria for what makes our own enjoyment of a game unique.
I agree that if weather/number of cars and certain racing series are a must, GT5 promises lots..
In terms of physics simulations, A.I, environmental interaction, for me it's only just scraping by..
Possibly hence why the word real world is mentioned, I tend to be thinking of physics etc, where as others may think of graphics/race series etc..
Both GT and Forza look great and drive ok.
But they are both a bit crap too, aimed at 'Tuners' who want to 'pimp their ride, dude'.
Best racing game 'could' have been Race Pro IMO, but we got a bit short-changed with it.
It is a pity Turn 10/MS and SONY/PD could not throw their weight behind something more original in the racing game department, rather than still turning out a carbon copy of a game that is nearly 15 years old.
That style of game has not moved on and it is the biggest critiscism of the current 'racing' games that i have.
Move on FFS you are both getting boring now.
EDIT: LOL even EA jumped on this clapped out old idea with SHIFT.
Where has originality gone ??
But they are both a bit crap too, aimed at 'Tuners' who want to 'pimp their ride, dude'.
Best racing game 'could' have been Race Pro IMO, but we got a bit short-changed with it.
It is a pity Turn 10/MS and SONY/PD could not throw their weight behind something more original in the racing game department, rather than still turning out a carbon copy of a game that is nearly 15 years old.
That style of game has not moved on and it is the biggest critiscism of the current 'racing' games that i have.
Move on FFS you are both getting boring now.
EDIT: LOL even EA jumped on this clapped out old idea with SHIFT.
Where has originality gone ??
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Soldato
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^ I just have to ask, Have you actually looked into what GT5 offers this time around?
It's hardly a carbon copy...Although I guess it has cars, that go around tracks and you tweak the cars inorder to better your times... but this is a racing game. what were you expecting?
It's hardly a carbon copy...Although I guess it has cars, that go around tracks and you tweak the cars inorder to better your times... but this is a racing game. what were you expecting?
I am expecting a Gran Turismo game, updated for the current gen.
I'd like a new approach from a developer, something that maybe involves racing in real licensed championships, with real racing rules such as Flag rules, real tactics such as are used by real racing teams around the world.
This kind of game can only be found on the pc at the moment, as it seems none of the big guns will dare to take this format into a new direction.
It sells, so it will continue.
I want something a bit different, but from a big developer prepared to take chances, instead of another 'update' to an old format.