Does something need to be done about dogs?

[Deleted User 298457]

Woman, 41, killed in American Bulldog attack in Aberdeen

Michelle McLeod was described by relatives as a much-loved mother and daughter.

www.bbc.co.uk

Another one, breed not revealed.

It says Women right in the title

 

[potatolord]

Woman, 41, killed in American Bulldog attack in Aberdeen

Michelle McLeod was described by relatives as a much-loved mother and daughter.

www.bbc.co.uk

Another one, breed not revealed.

That makes it ten for 2024, over double the long-term average number.

Second highest year on record (afyer 2023, 16).

 

[Rai200]

What did the bar staff do and why didn't they kick her out?

Honestly I don't think they realised it had got me quite so bad. I'm a regular there and they were helpful, but they're also just 19-20 year olds working in a pub. I don't blame them for not wanting to intervene and also get bitten.

They might have CCTV.

They don't, I've asked the pub across the road if they do but haven't had a reply yet.

Secondly, they were negligent for allowing her to remove the muzzle in the first place - I mean if she literally told them that (a known dangerous breed) was "a bit bitey" and they just let her remove the muzzle and lead and have it sat there then they're partly to blame too - WTF were the staff thinking?

"A bit bitey" was paraphrasing, but she had told them it was a rescue and could be aggressive.

If you sued them I bet they'd not be happy with that woman and wouldn't be letting her take the muzzle off (or perhaps even come back to the pub) ever again - though it might also mean you're no longer welcome too if it's an independent pub. If it's a brewery-owned chain then I'd definitely sue them!

Independent, I'm not going to sue them. I don't blame anyone but the owner.

Go to a solicitor and in addition to the police report/crime see if you can pursue a civil case against both the woman and the brewery/pub - worth going after both in case she's on a low income and comes up with some BS about how she can only afford £1 a week. - Edit - if it's a registered XL Bully (might well be given the muzzle) then she's required to have third-party liability insurance ergo definitely sue her - you're potentially owed a few grand:

Tried a quick google:

If the police are otherwise being lazy then at least there could still be some consequences for her but really they need to both confiscate that dog/put it down and ban her from owning a dangerous breed + criminal punishment and a payout in civil court too - ditto to the pub, staff were negligent and helped cause that after being told about the danger - pub (hopefully brewery chain as a whole) might be prompted to update their guidelines/staff training.

I have given the owners details to the police and proceeded with an interview/statement. I believe they intend to prosecute if it can't be resolved via less formal means.

I've also contacted a solicitor and they seem keen to make a claim on a no win, no fee basis.

Update on the bite after 3 days, again ignore the fatness.

 

[Felon]

Holy-moly that's a bruise and a half.

Also totally agree with @dowie and his advice, - also not surprised a solicitor will give you a no-win no fee on that, the owner of the dog was clearly in the wrong.

Totally push ahead with this, that dog needs to be seized and you're certainly due some compensation, - imagine if you'd have had a child with you.. (or somebody else's child next week)

 

[dowie]

I have given the owners details to the police and proceeded with an interview/statement. I believe they intend to prosecute if it can't be resolved via less formal means.

That sounds like lazy BS on the part of the police, I wouldn't drop this - there isn't a less formal way of dealing with this really - she needs to be prosecuted and that needs to go on her record so she's not given an exemption for a dangerous breed in future.

Also, the dog needs to be confiscated and destroyed.

I've also contacted a solicitor and they seem keen to make a claim on a no win, no fee basis.

Update on the bite after 3 days, again ignore the fatness.

Yeah, that's a nasty bit of bruising - not surprised they're happy to go after her, potentially a few grand from her insurance.

Also, importantly, if the insurance has had to pay out because she's owned a banned breed + let it attack someone then getting insurance again is going to be more difficult.

 

[Fubsy]

Tell the police the dog tweeted the bite and that you were made to feel unsafe. They'll be right round for that

 

[ttaskmaster]

That sounds like lazy BS on the part of the police, I wouldn't drop this - there isn't a less formal way of dealing with this really - she needs to be prosecuted and that needs to go on her record so she's not given an exemption for a dangerous breed in future.

We don't know if the dog was a dangerous or prohibited breed, whether she had an exemption, or anything else about it.
What we do know is that she knew the dog had problems and/or her handling wasn't up to scratch, yet she deliberately removed all restraints and let it free in a public place. Her ignorance of the results here suggest she's ignorant of many other negligences.

Forget exemptions - At the very least her sentencing should include permanent prohibition from ever owning or having charge over a dog.

Also, the dog needs to be confiscated and destroyed.

Not necessarily.
Depending on age and general behaviour, it may be possible to rehome with a competent owner. Admitedly not especially likely, but that option should be explored first.

 

[Rai200]

We don't know if the dog was a dangerous or prohibited breed, whether she had an exemption, or anything else about it.

She herself claimed it's an XL bully and is registered in a FB post earlier this year. I agree with the rest of your post though, especially re-homing/training the dog with someone competent.

What we do know is that she knew the dog had problems and/or her handling wasn't up to scratch, yet she deliberately removed all restraints and let it free in a public place. Her ignorance of the results here suggest she's ignorant of many other negligences.

Forget exemptions - At the very least her sentencing should include permanent prohibition from ever owning or having charge over a dog.


Not necessarily.
Depending on age and general behaviour, it may be possible to rehome with a competent owner. Admitedly not especially likely, but that option should be explored first.

 

[dowie]

We don't know if the dog was a dangerous or prohibited breed, whether she had an exemption, or anything else about it.

Despite what you'd like to believe XL Bullies are both dangerous and prohibited under the DDA - whether she had an exemption or not doesn't negate that. Given she had a muzzle for it and that has been a legal requirement since earlier this year along with registration then it seems pretty likely she does have an exemption.

Not necessarily.
Depending on age and general behaviour, it may be possible to rehome with a competent owner. Admitedly not especially likely, but that option should be explored first.

Yes necessarily - it's a dangerous breed and has attacked - you can't rehome it, you need to destroy it.

 

[Felon]

As much as I love dogs, and it hurts me to see them get put down or destroyed - I also wouldn't blame the dog for this, it's likely more the owner being a ****.

But in the final analysis, if a dog like that can just 'go off' unprovoked at the drop of a hat and do that much damage to an adult, only an insane person would allow the owner to keep it.

I'd say, that if there was a specialist home it could go to, to live out it's days I'd support that, but those places are already overflowing with similar problem breeds.

I find the whole situation heartbreaking, but these things are just too dangerous.

 

[ttaskmaster]

She herself claimed it's an XL bully and is registered in a FB post earlier this year. I agree with the rest of your post though, especially re-homing/training the dog with someone competent.

I must have missed that in a previous post somewhere.
With that in mind, the law and the situation is different. Law will almost certainly require the dog to be destroyed then, and while the situation is that it could theoretically still be rehomed, there ain't a snowball's chance in hell anyone would take on that task.

Despite what you'd like to believe XL Bullies are both dangerous and prohibited under the DDA - whether she had an exemption or not doesn't negate that. Given she had a muzzle for it and that has been a legal requirement since earlier this year along with registration then it seems pretty likely she does have an exemption.

A wonderful put-down and utter destruction of my argument. Yes, sir, you win again. Good for you.... except that it hinges on assuming I was aware of something, which you can tell from my post I clearly wasn't.

Besides which, Rai already addressed the point several hours ahead of you, and in a far more productive manner.
Rai also did not ASSume to know my beliefs, even though they're already explained in detail, so again your response is unnecessary, unfounded and unhelpful.

Regardless of your waffle, my point still stands - Permanently ban her from ownership entirely, along with any additional punishments and penalties.

 

[dowie]

A wonderful put-down and utter destruction of my argument. Yes, sir, you win again. Good for you.... except that it hinges on assuming I was aware of something, which you can tell from my post I clearly wasn't.
[...]

I honestly don't know with you tbh.. I can only go on what you've written and I'm not a mind reader - you've argued plenty of times in favour of XL bullies.

 

[ttaskmaster]

I honestly don't know with you tbh.. I can only go on what you've written and I'm not a mind reader - you've argued plenty of times in favour of XL bullies.

And what I wrote, which you quoted, quite clearly shows that I had not seen any confirmation of breed (beyond Rai's guess based on appearance).
It's clear, as Rai actually understood, so any failure to comprehend is on you.

I have argued in favour of those dogs not being twisted to fit the status mould. Where they have been, as is the case with so many of those the UK has imported, it is a different story. You know this.

 

[dowie]

This is tiresome cope - "where they have been" -as if there are some lines of soft, gentle XL Bullies and the muscular, aggressive looking ones are some anomaly.

 

[Felon]

XL bully: Baby seriously injured in dog attack in Folkestone

A woman, 76, and a man, 18, have been arrested in connection with the attack near Folkestone.

www.bbc.co.uk

Am I overreacting or have things gotten out of control now?

This is clearly not an 'all dogs' problem, it's a single breed that's solely responsible here...

 

[ttaskmaster]

This is tiresome cope - "where they have been" -as if there are some lines of soft, gentle XL Bullies and the muscular, aggressive looking ones are some anomaly.

The experts' findings on the different bloodlines were already covered earlier in the thread. The only 'cope' is how you conveniently forget details like that.

 

[jellybeard999]

XL bully: Baby seriously injured in dog attack in Folkestone

A woman, 76, and a man, 18, have been arrested in connection with the attack near Folkestone.

www.bbc.co.uk

One family member told the BBC the dog, called Hunter, had never shown any form of aggression and it was out of character.

This all sounds very familiar...

 

[potatolord]

XL bully: Baby seriously injured in dog attack in Folkestone

A woman, 76, and a man, 18, have been arrested in connection with the attack near Folkestone.

www.bbc.co.uk

Am I overreacting or have things gotten out of control now?

This is clearly not an 'all dogs' problem, it's a single breed that's solely responsible here...

While I don't like being that guy...

This is a hot news area, and any attack by a bully xl is likely to get disproportionate media coverage at the moment.

There is always a "base" of attacks by Jack Russells etc, but those won't get the same coverage at present.

 

[Jelly4mybelly]

For future reference, one thing I would try, perhaps, is dialling 999. They are obliged to follow a 999 call through. I mean it is a misuse of the 999 service, but if you make up some BS about dangerous dog I think you would get away with it.

I agree with this. You need to embellish of course. The XL bully dog being out of control and going for random people should pique their attention to attend the scene. Can you visit the pub the same time next week to see if they are there again?

 

[Kenai]

had never shown any form of aggression

...said every incompetent dog owner ever, whilst the dog displays a million and one blindingly obvious indicators of poorly managed aggressive behaviour