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End of socket AM4

surely though the point is that while intel may arguably be better in this particular instance, he already has the x470 board...

All he needs to do is drop in a 3XXX processor and get a fair bump in both IPC and clock. For any intel option he needs at least a new motherboard too.

After featuring in the sale of the 2700X, a 3700X would be a relatively cost effective and straight forward to achieve 10-15% bump in single core performance over his 2700X. Furthermore by staying with the X470 he then also has the option of a further simple drop in upgrade to the eg 4700X when it comes out sometime next year.
 
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Zeeflyboy said:
surely though the point is that while intel may arguably be better in this particular instance, he already has the x470 board...

All he needs to do is drop in a 3XXX processor and get a fair bump in both IPC and clock. For any intel option he needs at least a new motherboard too.

After featuring in the sale of the 2700X, a 3700X would be a relatively cost effective and straight forward to achieve 10-15% bump in single core performance over his 2700X. Furthermore by staying with the X470 he then also has the option of a further simple drop in upgrade to the eg 4700X when it comes out sometime next year.
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I know I know I know, I hear what you are saying about the 3700x / 4700x, the single core power is just not enough for me in iRacing with the VR, as even with my 2700x clocked to 4.3 I'm still seeing 1 core max out in resource manager when playing iRacing.
Mind u if I did stick with AMD dropped in a 3700x or 3800x and overclocked it, what ram would I be best to get so that I could get the most speed out of the system.
Atm I have 16GB (2x8GB) Corsair DDR4 Vengeance LPX Black, PC4-24000 (3000), Non-ECC Unbuffered, CAS 15-17-17-35, XMP 2.0, 1.35V
 
Zeeflyboy said:
surely though the point is that while intel may arguably be better in this particular instance, he already has the x470 board...

All he needs to do is drop in a 3XXX processor and get a fair bump in both IPC and clock. For any intel option he needs at least a new motherboard too.

After featuring in the sale of the 2700X, a 3700X would be a relatively cost effective and straight forward to achieve 10-15% bump in single core performance over his 2700X. Furthermore by staying with the X470 he then also has the option of a further simple drop in upgrade to the eg 4700X when it comes out sometime next year.
Click to expand...
I do tend to agree with your point of view especially when looking at cost as a variable though when you're frustrated by something not performing as you would like you sometimes then just want the best, just in case 2nd best still does not cut it. There is still no guarantee that the 'best' will suffice but at least you know you can't do any better.
 
MartinPrince said:
If you are targeting your build for a specific game (not something I would normally advise) then in your position I would advise the 9700K is best for you. You probably want to stay away from any kind of HT/SMT chip as what you will find is that the scheduler will often select a 'fake core' and then performance will drop. This will be especially true of poorly optimised games like iRacing.
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Sorry I missed this when you posted it Martin, that is very interesting about HT, so the 9700k looks even more stronger, plus I was reading about the 10 series from Intel and I'm sure I read the whole range will have HT.
Sure if I got the 9700k that gives me loads of single core grunt, as well as giving me 8 physical cores.
 
joedeath332 said:
Sorry I missed this when you posted it Martin, that is very interesting about HT, so the 9700k looks even more stronger, plus I was reading about the 10 series from Intel and I'm sure I read the whole range will have HT.
Sure if I got the 9700k that gives me loads of single core grunt, as well as giving me 8 physical cores.
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Yes, I've long since known and experienced that HT can be a hindrance in a few programs/games. When Intel decided in their wisdom/greed to drop it from their i7 line I was one of the few that was quite happy as it suited me better. Plus I had a notion that CPU's would overclock better as historically if you wanted to increase your maximum overclock then disabling HT would help.

For you I'd say the 3000 series just falls short compared to a 9700K in single thread performance and once you put a decent overclock on it then the gap widens. I have both systems so know this all too well.
 
joedeath332 said:
I know I know I know, I hear what you are saying about the 3700x / 4700x, the single core power is just not enough for me in iRacing with the VR, as even with my 2700x clocked to 4.3 I'm still seeing 1 core max out in resource manager when playing iRacing.
Mind u if I did stick with AMD dropped in a 3700x or 3800x and overclocked it, what ram would I be best to get so that I could get the most speed out of the system.
Atm I have 16GB (2x8GB) Corsair DDR4 Vengeance LPX Black, PC4-24000 (3000), Non-ECC Unbuffered, CAS 15-17-17-35, XMP 2.0, 1.35V
Click to expand...

There is your issue. 3000 MHz on a Gen 1+. Gen 2, apparently, does not rely as much on RAM speed but more so to tight timing. Gen 2 large L3 cache compensates. The 3700X has twice the L3 cache of the 2700X.

https://imgur.com/OIFHaHa

2700X @4.3 is still around 11% slower than the 3700X. And, if im not mistaken, Gen2 is actually has higher IPC than intel's. The latter's clocks compensate thus have the advantage. Now, with Ryzen 4000 that advantage is gone. for sure.

To say that intel does not rely on RAM speed and tight timing is just plain false.

EDIT: Found this vid going from Gen 1+ to 2.

https://youtu.be/5kxvPxIL1lk
 
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joedeath332 said:
My problem is that i mostly just use the PC for playing Sim games , with the main one being iRacing which unfortunately is single core dependant , and atm with my 2700x overclocked i am still getting frame drops in VR , ( GPU is a 1080ti ) , so i need to increase my HTz of my cpu. hense me thinking on going to intel again.
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Hi OP, it seems that I have just done this very upgrade for someone, except he was going from the 1700X on X370, he didn't want to spend a fortune but his RTX 2080 Super wasn't being utilised as it should have been in iRacing. We chose to go with a R5 3600X, which cost <£100 since we sold on the 1700X. You could do the same but obviously you'd get a bit more for the 2700X, and it should maybe only cost you £80, but it would be a lot cheaper than changing your whole PC, and still give you a decent boost in performance due to the significant IPC gains.
Update the BIOS drop in the new CPU, update drivers etc. job done nice and easy.
 
MartinPrince said:
Yes, I've long since known and experienced that HT can be a hindrance in a few programs/games. When Intel decided in their wisdom/greed to drop it from their i7 line I was one of the few that was quite happy as it suited me better. Plus I had a notion that CPU's would overclock better as historically if you wanted to increase your maximum overclock then disabling HT would help.

For you I'd say the 3000 series just falls short compared to a 9700K in single thread performance and once you put a decent overclock on it then the gap widens. I have both systems so know this all too well.
Click to expand...
Thanks once again for the info, I'm positive that from a financial point of view the Ryzen would be the way to go, but going on my gut instinct the i9 9700k is the way for me to go.. Decisions decisions
 
joedeath332 said:
Thanks once again for the info, I'm positive that from a financial point of view the Ryzen would be the way to go, but going on my gut instinct the i9 9700k is the way for me to go.. Decisions decisions
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See my comment above. You could try that and lose pretty much nothing, other than an hour or two of time.
 
joedeath332 said:
Thanks once again for the info, I'm positive that from a financial point of view the Ryzen would be the way to go, but going on my gut instinct the i9 9700k is the way for me to go.. Decisions decisions
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I'm pretty sure it would be faster but as @Journey suggested it might be worth trying the Ryzen 3000 CPU route to see if that will improve things enough for you. If it doesn't then you can return the CPU under Distance Selling Regs so it would only cost you return postage. Might be worth a try first. ;)
 
joedeath332 said:
I currently have an asus X470-f AM4 socket MB with a 2700X and am looking to upgrade and am undecided on amd or intel so i have a question if i was to stick with the AM4 socket and upgrade to say a 3800x will there be a next gen of release of chips from amd ( say 4***x series ) that will work with the AM4 socket or will the next gen of amd chips be on a new socket.
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Get a 3600X - it only costs like £200 and will improve your performance by quite a bit. You can sell current cpu on ebay for £120 no doubt. Meaning the upgrade costs you £80.

Those saying buy intel for 2% more performance for 3 times the money don't have a clue.

You already have an AM4 motherboard. Therefore it makes sense to just buy a 3600X.

If you were buying from scratch I'd still be tempted to say 3600X just because it's so fast and so cheap.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
Get a 3600X - it only costs like £200 and will improve your performance by quite a bit. You can sell current cpu on ebay for £120 no doubt. Meaning the upgrade costs you £80.

Those saying buy intel for 2% more performance for 3 times the money don't have a clue.

You already have an AM4 motherboard. Therefore it makes sense to just buy a 3600X.

If you were buying from scratch I'd still be tempted to say 3600X just because it's so fast and so cheap.
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I wouldn't even bother with the 3600X, since the standard 3600 is just a smidge slower for £20 less.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
I have both trust me the 3600x is worth it. £20 for an extra 200mhz is cheap enough to pony up. Imo you would be mad at as little as £20 not to. Especially as you can't overclock amd
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Yeah £20 between the 3600 and 3600X seems we’ll worth it. The difference between a 3700X and 3800X is £40 down from £80.
 
joedeath332 said:
@Journey & @Orange Nexus thanks :)
Click to expand...

You are welcome. Got my R7 2700 at stock with a 5700XT but i play at 1440/4K and my RAM is set at 3200 CL14 DOCP. Prolly if i have a 2080 Ti, then i'll ramp up the RAM to 3466 CL14 using the DRAM calc. Have no issue with bottleneck.

BTW, i do have a R5 3600, which is indeed faster than the 2700 in single core. I was gonna pair the 3600 with the Xt but no need.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
I have both trust me the 3600x is worth it. £20 for an extra 200mhz is cheap enough to pony up. Imo you would be mad at as little as £20 not to. Especially as you can't overclock amd
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It's not an extra 200MHz though, bar spikes when idling on the desktop. Plenty of testing has been done between the 3600 and 3600X, and in real-world workloads they essentially run at the same clock speed and provide the same performance, with FPS results well within margin of error.


Whether it's "only £20" or not, you're essentially donating money to AMD. "Just trust me, bro" doesn't hold up as an argument in the face of actual data. The real best argument for buying a 3600X would be if you plan to use the stock cooler, since it comes with the notably better Wraith Spire instead of the Wraith Stealth.
 
Aretak said:
It's not an extra 200MHz though, bar spikes when idling on the desktop. Plenty of testing has been done between the 3600 and 3600X, and in real-world workloads they essentially run at the same clock speed and provide the same performance, with FPS results well within margin of error.


Whether it's "only £20" or not, you're essentially donating money to AMD. "Just trust me, bro" doesn't hold up as an argument in the face of actual data. The real best argument for buying a 3600X would be if you plan to use the stock cooler, since it comes with the notably better Wraith Spire instead of the Wraith Stealth.
Click to expand...

were those tested before or after the BIOS updates that fixed all the issues with boost clocks?
 
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