Soldato
Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)
- Thread starter DXP55
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Soldato
You think the grid doesn't need power when millions of people are sitting in air-conditioned offices running PCs with multiple screens?
You think the grid doesn't need power when thousands of factories are running power hungry manufacturing machinery?
You think the grid doesn't need power when thousands of huge warehouse sized retailers are running hundreds of electrical appliances, high intensity lighting, heating (much of which goes out of the open door), open freezers, marketing displays etc.?
The grid doesn't just supply residential properties.
Soldato
Probably be cheaper for some people to just use camping gear in their kitchen to cook.
was reading about that yesterday, some one was going swimming, taking clean change of clothes, after swim into showers with old clothes on with soap and wash their clothes. cant fault it
i work full time inside, will be taking on overtime through winter to keep me out of the home
Soldato
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- 23 May 2006
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obviously these prices are terrible and a lot of people will need help... however equally (and I know it isn't generally a popular comment) but I also think a lot of us need to be educated in energy use
much like over 1/3 of food gets wasted in the UK, a lost of people waste so much energy
my mum for instance uses an open gas fire at the same time as the central heating is on, regularly boils a full kettle and either does not get around to using it or makes 1 cup of tea . my real pet hate is running the hot tap to warm the water up then she forgets the tap is on and gets side tracked.
my old housemate used to wear the skimpiest armless t shirts and shorts, wack the heating up whilst opening windows.
when I was a kid we didn't have central heating and only heated the rooms we needed.
today many people have heating on 24/7 and heat spare rooms etc when no one is near them.
I am not playing down the energy price rises at all but long term if there is any silver lining in this cloud it will be that it will make people think about their energy use.
my wife for years.has called me a tight arse. I always countered that I am not, I consider myself generous, but I just despise waste... esp as there isn't even a downside to it
much like over 1/3 of food gets wasted in the UK, a lost of people waste so much energy
my mum for instance uses an open gas fire at the same time as the central heating is on, regularly boils a full kettle and either does not get around to using it or makes 1 cup of tea . my real pet hate is running the hot tap to warm the water up then she forgets the tap is on and gets side tracked.
my old housemate used to wear the skimpiest armless t shirts and shorts, wack the heating up whilst opening windows.
when I was a kid we didn't have central heating and only heated the rooms we needed.
today many people have heating on 24/7 and heat spare rooms etc when no one is near them.
I am not playing down the energy price rises at all but long term if there is any silver lining in this cloud it will be that it will make people think about their energy use.
my wife for years.has called me a tight arse. I always countered that I am not, I consider myself generous, but I just despise waste... esp as there isn't even a downside to it
Soldato
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If you can, please consider donating all or part of your Energy Rebate to Cornish charities that are supporting those who need it the most.
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As Haggisman put it :-
The fact is we are still using electricity generation methods that cause pollution (gas / oil) as well as waste (nuclear) and as such, ANY injection into the grid via solar during the day allows those other generation methods to reduce their load, reducing their pollution and / or waste by using more "renewable" energy during the day.
This is still a good thing...
Soldato
And for more good (Sky) news...
The latest prediction, which amounts to about £569 a month, could see households paying more for their fuel bills than their monthly mortgage payments next year.
In comparison, the average bill in October 2021 was £1,400 a year.
Homeowners with fixed-rate mortgages pay £741 a month on average, according to the latest data from trade body UK Finance, compiled in December.
That means homeowners could see just a £172 difference in the cost of paying their mortgage and heating their home.
And for those with a standard variable rate (SVR) mortgage, the figures are even starker.
The average SVR mortgage monthly repayment, which borrowers can be transferred to once their fixed or tracker mortgage deal comes to an end, amounts to £516, UK Finance said.
That means that some households could end up paying £53 more on their utility bills than their mortgage as runaway energy prices overtake the cost of owning a home.
Meanwhile, people tied to a tracker mortgage, which directly track the Bank of England's base rate, will see around £50 added to their typical costs, according to calculations by the trade body...'
'Energy prices could rise to nearly £7,000 per year, experts say
As energy prices rocket, the average households could see energy prices spike to as much as £6,823 per year from next April, according to the latest forecast by energy consultancy Auxilion.The latest prediction, which amounts to about £569 a month, could see households paying more for their fuel bills than their monthly mortgage payments next year.
In comparison, the average bill in October 2021 was £1,400 a year.
Homeowners with fixed-rate mortgages pay £741 a month on average, according to the latest data from trade body UK Finance, compiled in December.
That means homeowners could see just a £172 difference in the cost of paying their mortgage and heating their home.
And for those with a standard variable rate (SVR) mortgage, the figures are even starker.
The average SVR mortgage monthly repayment, which borrowers can be transferred to once their fixed or tracker mortgage deal comes to an end, amounts to £516, UK Finance said.
That means that some households could end up paying £53 more on their utility bills than their mortgage as runaway energy prices overtake the cost of owning a home.
Meanwhile, people tied to a tracker mortgage, which directly track the Bank of England's base rate, will see around £50 added to their typical costs, according to calculations by the trade body...'
Soldato
Agree with the rest of your points, but this one isn't necessarily a bad thing - we used to do the same before we had smart TRVs, because it allowed us to keep the rest of the house at a much lower temperature whilst keeping the living room comfortable.
my washing up is done with cold water, if i want hot water for shave/wash i used the shower for the hot water as more efficient than running the hot water tap for ages waiting for it to go hot. plus in work 5days a week, i cant use much less energy if if i tried
Soldato
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- 28 Nov 2005
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- 12,997
Tbh that is exactly what we are doing when we have cups of coffee and tea, just use the gas cannister. Got a few stocked up.
Might be heating the tins of beans up too at this rate. At least the cold water therapy shower will now become mainstream
Associate
That sounds sensible. So If you mean anyone in government. Probably not !
Soldato
Might knock the shed down and use it as fuel for the chiminea.
Associate
To do that they need to stop using gas to generate more than half of the UK's electricity.
Soldato
No its doesn't cost 8-10k it costs anywhere from say £5k to £lol.
Its system dependent with a lot of variables. (size, layout, quality, warranties, location (Scotland vs South coast is very different), usage, etc etc)
They are deffo going up to install however, suggest its supply & demand but also of course lower pound (mainly made in China so $ priced) and of course inflation effect on the install companies.
But take mine, my cautious installer has suggested I will generate just under 4000 kw. The other was closer to 5000, but lets go with 4000.
Thats at £13k, but lets ignore the batteries and solar diverter (my excess in summer months will likely heat my water for "free")
The majority of the 4000 I will be able to use, but lets say 3500, its of course variable since it depends what days generate what.
The 500 will export of course.
3500 x £0.29 (old price cap) = £1015, so simple 13 year pay back. Yep your about right in your maths.
Thats ignoring any effect on battery when its not using my solar. (ie cheap fill)
Now at £0.52 its £1800 a year its 7.2 years.
At Jan predicted £0.9 its £3150 a year, that payback plummets for whatever period the £0.9 is in effect. Although if its just Jan-Mar then solar isn't going to save much, but the batteries should (tariff dependant)
I haven't included the solar diverter in this since its only using another few hundred units a year but that will add up.
I'm not going further into the maths, as you need a realistic model for your situation. Which is where it gets complicated, more panels vs more batteries or no batteries or no panels, and then types of panels and types of batteries and others such as solar diverter etc
Simply however my install at £0.29 should ROI (proper ROI including cost of capital) around year 11.
So when prices go up 80% the return drops by a factor of 1.8 times.
As I said my chosen installer is being very cautious.
The other benefit of batteries without solar is based on being able to charge cheaply (eco 7, Ev tariff etc), its difficult to predict as it relies on the margin between the two rates and thats not fixed.
Like most of the situation is not fixed and you need to run a few scenarios when you model, YOUR usage, and YOUR predictions for costs etc etc
As others have said the batteries are very easy to take with you, and reinstall costs will be low.
(the costs for a battery install on its own are low where as solar is high)
Hell even the government support is unpredictable and will affect the payback.
£400 a year back to people with solar creates a different scenario if thats in cash, or affecting the unit rate.
TLDR Its simply impossible to throw out simple numbers about payback, its situationally dependent and a load of the variables are impossible to predict accurately and come down to feels.
Whats actually interesting and will become a future consideration when buying a house is if it has solar.
A lot of the items are easy to take. Batteries as mentioned, but also inverter being a large cost small item.
You wouldn't want to take panels IMO, too much agro but can see some would, just leaving the frame in place.
Deffo will be interesting
Soldato
- Joined
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- 7,245
is that really cheaper ? even with current prices I am shocked if using a fraction of a kwh of electricity to boil a kettle would be more expensive than a camping gas cannister
I have a mate who fills his kettle from the hot water tap . I don't fancy that myself. am sure tap hot water is not meant to be drinkable (unless it's one of those quooker jobs or what ever they are called
Soldato
Those things aren't cheap to run, we bought one when our eldest was 6 months old going into winter for the first time and leaving it on in his room overnight added almost 50% to hour energy bills.just sorted my heating for the winter, DeLonghi TRRS0920 for £42 new with codes, will do for my bedroom
I put off buying heating oil the other day as the tank is half full currently and prices seemed to be dropping. Cue sharp spike from 84p to 96p per litre in the last 8 days. Heating oil is the wild west compared to 90% of the population on regulated gas prices!
I'd assume the boiling removes whatever risk there is from using a hot water tap.
2000w good luck.
Yeah they arent on all the time but still way more expensive than gas heating.