Europa Universalis IV

I'm trying (and failing miserably) to do a Prussia campaign and could do with some help/advice to get it up and running.

I've looked at Brandenburg and the Teutonic Order as starting nations and have favoured the TO simply because they already own the provinces I need, however I'm simply not able to expand without everything going horribly wrong.

It might simply be that I'm being very unlucky, but more likely it's down to me still being a noob (I only have around 200 hours so far).

So I guess the question is, is it better to start as the TO or is Brandenburg the better option? If it's Brandenburg, are there any tips for ensuring Poland don't take out the TO and take the provinces I need before I get a chance to?

My issues with the TO are that Denmark nearly always attack the Levonian Order before I am strong enough to, so there is nowhere to expand to the East, and when I go to war with Pomerania none of my allies will join (maybe I'm picking the wrong ones) so along with their allies they are too strong, I thought I had finally managed to get an advantage in my last attempt as they didn't have decent alliances in place, but then Poland rented them a load of troops :-(

As usual, any tips or advices will be gratefully received
 
I would always go Brandenburg as you are inside the HRE (not sure if TO are) and you are pretty central for getting going.

I forget the name of the event but an event fires in most Brandenburg games pretty quickly where you can take some territory of TO for free to get you going. I've never been able to rush east myself early (Poland are top aggressive) so I played the long game and ate up small nations around me within the HRE to get up to speed. Be aggressive and opportunistic, wait for other wars so people's allies won't Dec with them and just gobble up fast and don't be afraid of some debt to get Mercs to succeed.

IIRC, as it's been a while, I get the few small nations to my south and west then get Pom when other wars give you the opportunity. That then boosts your income and at this stage it's chewing up other small territories and waiting/hoping for an opportunistic chance to steal what you need for Prussia from Poland. Normally Poland ends up in devastating wars with either Hungary, Russia or a civil war with Lithuania and that's normally my cue to dive.

I'm sure there's a way for brilliant players to pick up Prussia fast but I've found patience works just as well.

Just remember to have you forts and armies on low maintenance when not warring as Brandenburg, certaibly early game, as they don't make a lot of gold early. Don't be disheartened with a few restarts though, it can quickly go wrong if you are too aggressive or call a war at the wrong time.

Last game as Brandenburg using the above I formed Germany before it finished so it does work.
 
The TO don't start as part of the HRE but I usually improve relations with Austria straight away and add all my provinces as soon as possible to become a member. Once that's done I'm fairly comfortable that Poland are not going to attack me any time soon.

It's just expanding that's the problem, it could just be that I'm being a little impatient, on my other campaigns which have all been with bigger nations I've been able to steadily grow without too much concern.

I might try Brandenburg just to see if I have any more luck, just wanted to make sure there's nothing obvious I'm missing

Thanks for the replies.
 
The TO are monsters because of their traditions and ideas (basically Prussia) but keeping them alive is another matter entirely. The problem is Danzig and then your rivalry with Poland et al. There’s an event that fires early that basically releases Danzig (if I recall). If you can survive that it becomes possible to grow exponentially. But it’s not an easy game by any means. I had several runs until I gained confidence and managed to eventually form Prussia.

Very reminiscent of the old Byzantium campaign. Now if you want difficult try that hehe
 
philstanbridge said:
The TO are monsters because of their traditions and ideas (basically Prussia) but keeping them alive is another matter entirely. The problem is Danzig and then your rivalry with Poland et al. There’s an event that fires early that basically releases Danzig (if I recall). If you can survive that it becomes possible to grow exponentially. But it’s not an easy game by any means. I had several runs until I gained confidence and managed to eventually form Prussia.

Very reminiscent of the old Byzantium campaign. Now if you want difficult try that hehe
Click to expand...


Teutonic Order has 3 solutions to avoid war with Poland+Lithuania while maintain control of Danzig
a) Release Danzig as a vassal ASAP, and make it a march
b) Strip all land of Burghers (Influence bellow 60) as soon as game starts.
c) Keep Burghers loyalty over 80, thats the tough part as events can drop it.
 
Stripping the Burghers of land seems to work for me every time with the TO. It's not staying alive that's my problem it's actually being able to win a war and expand.

I started a Brandenburg campaign yesterday evening and that definitiely seems more viable for my skill level, I've already vassalized Pomerania and have the option to diplo annex them, I'll pick off a few of the small HRE nations around me next before deciding which way to expand.

Typically the TO didn't manage to handle the Prussian Confederation and ended up in the war with Poland, who have now vassalized Danzig so I'll have to deal with that at some point, although so far Poland haven't managed to get the personal union over Lithuania so they aren't looking as stong as they usually do.
 
Panos said:
Teutonic Order has 3 solutions to avoid war with Poland+Lithuania while maintain control of Danzig
a) Release Danzig as a vassal ASAP, and make it a march
b) Strip all land of Burghers (Influence bellow 60) as soon as game starts.
c) Keep Burghers loyalty over 80, thats the tough part as events can drop it.
Click to expand...

What is the benefit of doing the Burgher stuff and why does that avoid war with Poland?
 
I can only comment on option B...

The TO start with three provices controlled by the Burghers, these are the provinces that cuase the Prussian Confederation event to fire, when this happens Danzig is released from the TO and Poland join them in their independence war.

After 12 months you can remove the provices from Burgher control, doing this causes a couple of rebel armies to spawn (so do them one at a time) which are easily defeated, with the Burghers estate not owning any land the event can't fire. You can then boost stability to 2 and select a national idea which ends the Prussian Confederation once and for all. It's then safe to give land back to the Burghers should you want to.

It doesn't necesarily prevent war with Poland permanently, it just stops them becoming involved in the Danzig independence war. At least that's my take on the whole thing.
 
philstanbridge said:
I fancy another shot at TO or maybe Brandenberg. Was a lot of fun. But lets not forget the new patch out towards the end of the year will focus on Europe and Germany in particular.
Should add some new flavour and features to the HRE.
Click to expand...
One fo the reasons I'm doing a Prussia campaign now is so I can see how things change after the next update/patch :-)
 
I've tried a couple of times recently on Byzantium, I haven't got the patience to re-start 20+ times just to get the stars all to align to have teeniest possibility of a chance though :p
 
No1newts said:
What is the benefit of doing the Burgher stuff and why does that avoid war with Poland?
Click to expand...

Many things in EU4 are triggered under certain conditions. Here are the ones for Danzig

Trigger conditions for the Prussian Confederation event.
  • Year is at least 1450
  • Year is less than 1500
  • Country is not vassal
  • Owns core province Danzig (43)
  • Poland exists
  • Is a neighbor of Poland
  • Not at war with Poland
  • Is not allied with Poland
  • Poland:
    • Is not a vassal
  • Poland:
    • Has at least 10 provinces
  • Has at least 5 provinces
  • Any of the following:
    • Danzig does not exist
    • Danzig:
      • Is a vassal of our country
  • Burghers has at least 50 influence
  • Any owned province:
    • Has estate Burghers

So whats the easiest of them all? So either Danzig is vassal (preferably march) or Burghers have no lands.
Allying Poland, you need to have stars aligned.

After you get rid the Prussian Confederation event, you befriend Austria and join HRE. No more attacks from outside. Or do it the hard way and ally Hungary & Muscovy.
 
philstanbridge said:
Cheers Panos, I'm definitely going to try that again... Just for the pure rage when it goes belly up :D
Click to expand...

EU4 and rage especially inside heated zones like HRE, East Europe and Mexico is implied :D
You cannot imagine how many times "threw the toys out of the pram" when something stupid happened. Like an ally making a peace deal (usually Spain), against Morocco and not giving me (Portugal) lands I occupied at 100% war score and having marked as important to me.
 
I just gave the TO a quick shot... I say quick, as it was over fairly sharpish...

Problem I faced was Poland was not an enemy of Austria so I couldn’t get my provinces into the HRE before Poland declared on me..

When I lost that war - inflicting 123,000 casualties as an aside, I then lost the provinces that I needed to get me into the HRE. It was all a bit of a non event. In fact playing this again you realise why the TO rarely survives into any mid to late game.. it’s very challenging unless you get lucky to begin with..
 
I'm only about 30 years in to my Brandenburg campaign and I've somehow managed to become the emperor of the HRE, however I'm not sure if that is a good thing or not?

The additional manpower and force limit seem nice but my economy is just about supporting my army of 10 units so I'm not sure it's that much of an advantage at the moment.

Should I carry on as emperor or is it going to go downhill fast?

Of all my failed TO attempts (and there were a lot) I never once failed to join the HRE before Poland declared war on me, I'm guessing you must be playing on a harder skill level than the default setting?
 
Emperor is great, but you need to keep your HRE members on side. You get a lot of benefits being emperor including a huge manpower boost and land force limit. Plus if anyone declares on a HRE member you can all join in and stack wipe. Grow very slowly, and you'll be fine. Take diplomatic and keep every member happy.

I couldnt get Austria on side because they were happy with Poland. Simple as that I guess.
 
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